From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 01:28:10 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Disco road test To: lro@stratus.com Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 00:22:12 -0600 (MDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 328 X-Status: Status: RO Disco road test results have been published: Whale, Gregory. "1994 Discovery: Disco is back... and it's music to our ears" FOUR WHEELER Vol. 31, no. 9 (Sept. 1994) p. 26-30 T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 07:05:21 1994 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Date: 1 Aug 94 11:56:22 GMT To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Message-Service: mail Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Ben Smith Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO My apologies to the other netters. I don't have a direct mail ID or phone # for Ben. Ben, Are you back in NJ? Would you be up for a weekend camping trip in the Pine Barrens (500 miles+ sand roads)? I plan to head up to VT this weekend - job, weather, & accomodations permitting. Any other weekend would be fine (your welcome to come to VT too - stops at ABP and RN are planned). You can call me at: W-567-5488 (Short Hills) H-835-1796 Bill Maloney maloney@attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Jul 31 22:38:06 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: lots of questions, long, from non owner To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 13:27:55 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > So, I figure a 109 running a standard petrol engine with an > overdrive would increase the gas mileage, cruising range, and make perhaps > 60mph sustainable on the freeway. Then, I saw the post a couple days ago > from Australia (sorry, I forgot who) about changing differentials to 4.1:1 > ratio. This is a 20% change from standard, right? This is just about the > same as the overdrive, right? So the overdrive would be better from the > standpoint that it can be engaged and disengaged, and would have a greater > change on engine rpms, but would be heavier than differential gear changes. > What about both? Is that just plain insane? First of all, I would definitly not go with both, as 4th with overdrive and 4.1:1 diffs is a little too tall a gear for a 2.25. If you tend to do mostly off road driving, the over drive is the way to go, but if you don't do that much the high speed diffs would be the way to go. > Why do people change > engines? Spare parts, non-oil leaks, power, what is the one biggest > reason? Does anyone change transmissions or tranfer cases? ie my jeep got > >20 mpg on the freeway at 65 and seemed to me to have a very low 4wd first > gear. I know it would make some people retch, but has anyone completly > different drive train in a Land Rover. I guess at the far end of the > scale, I saw a wrecked range rover for sale in the SF chronicle for $5000. > What would its drive train be like in an old 109? Most people change engines for more power or greater economy here in Australia, although I am changing back to a Rover motor as it is more suited to the car. Half the reason people in Australia think that Land Rover transmistions are weak is because they through a Holden (GM) motor in with more power and torque higher in the rev range, which means the they rev the motor more, putting a lot more stress on the transmission, I personally believe that you should stick with the original motor. I do know of people that have changed the whole transmission. One I can think of is a guy who put a nissan gear box and transfercase and diesel motor in his series III long wheel base. > > john f hess phd (wow, really?) > jfhess@ucdavis.edu > > from home via modem ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 10:12:04 1994 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 11:02:37 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Rover in court X-Status: Status: RO Going to court tomorrow (again) to testify as an expert witness as to the value of Robert D's wrecked 109. For those who came in late, Robert was hit by a woman who tried to pass him on a double yellow line as he was making a left hand turn. The other vehicle was totalled in the wreck, the Rover sustained minimal damage...except it was forced airborne over a 12' ditch only to hit an off-road bucket excavator parked in the field. Maybe this time we'll go to trial, not get another bloody continuance. Anyway, any recent comparable sales would be of interest. The vehicle was an immaculate '65 109" pickup, overdirve, dual tanks, bumper overiders, stainless steel master cylinder with remote brake booster (it had the best brakes I've ever seen on *any* Rover), oil cooler and about 26,000 original miles. I've got Lanny's and Charlie's recent sales at Rover North, both very comparable vehicles. I think the value is in the range of $8 to $9k. Any other sales/opinions? *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 10:11:47 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 08:03:43 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net, Mike@apple.com, Fedette@apple.com, mfredett@ichips.intel.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Portland ABF Leak X-Status: Status: RO In message <199407300120.SAA11573@pacific.pacific.net> Granville Pool writes: > I would like to go to the Portland meet and want to try to get together a > convoy of other North California roverites to head that way, maybe taking > two days up and two days back. I figured that we could camp out somewhere > along the way. > > Can you give more details as to cost of entry of a vehicle and of a > meetswapper (?) and other particulars of where and how we would connect with > you far-northwest rover folks? > > Thanks, > > Granville Pool Land-Rover's first because > Land-Rovers last! > mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net > 2601 Road I, #0 ("Road-I-Land") > Redwood Valley, CA 95482 > (707) 485-7220 > Portland All British Field Meet 10795 NW LaCassel Crest Ln. Portland, OR 977229 Entry is $30 for the week end. The Sat BBQ = $12 for the public one & is about $5 for the Land Rover Clubs BBQ You chose to go to one or the other. Phone 503-244-2296 for entry form & more info. Your idea of the length of the trip & mine are close. I want to Leave Cupertino Wed at noonish to get past the San Francisco madness before it gets too bad & take a couple of days to mosey up taking pictures along the way. The meet normally winds down by 2 ish Sun (Or at least I usually do). I was thinking of a combination of #1 & #101. Take care TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 11:18:25 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: POLL-for 109/2.25L petrol owners To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 11:07:31 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: from "David John Place" at Jul 29, 94 11:01:20 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 753 X-Status: Status: RO There are three threads recently discussed on LRO: -- Overdrives and high ratio axles. -- 16 inch tires verses 15 inch tires. -- gas mileage associated with various models of carburators Several of the appends give background information, but it seems to me that some of the wide variance in gas mileage might be explained by the 30-40 percent gearing differences in the various LR configurations out there. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From ccray Mon Aug 1 13:39:22 1994 Subject: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 13:39:22 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1106 X-Status: Status: RO OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. They were about 15 x 12 inches. They had a cork to plug the opening and a rope handle. You would fill the bag with water and drape it over a radiator cap. The canvas would get wet and the evaporation (and the fan action would help too) would cause the water to cool. I remember being out in 100 f sunshine and the water was so-o-o cold you could barely drink it. Anyway, I want one of those bags for the Utah expedition. I think it would look proper on the grill of a SIIa 88. Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. Thanks in advance... ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From BENHAM@WFOCLAN.USBM.GOV Mon Aug 1 14:30:35 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 12:29:23 +1100 Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Ray, I too think they look cool on the front of a LR. You can get them @ $12.00 ea from various outdoor and military surplus stores. However, mine leaks and is worthless. It is made out of the original Scotish flax with a cork stopper. Why it leaks is beyond me. I may put Scotchguard on it, but then that solution may defeat the original purpose of having some evaporation keeping the water cool. Let me know what you find out. Later, John Benham From ccray Mon Aug 1 15:00:56 1994 Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny (fwd) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 15:00:56 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 794 X-Status: Status: RO MR ALEXANDER P GRICE was bold enough to point out... > >If you can find "Manifold Destiny" (it recently came out in paperback, and >any decent bookstore should be able to order it) it has some interesting >recepies: .... you are RIGHT -- called the bookstore and it will be in Thursday. $7.95. Sorry to bother the netters -- should have done my homework earlier. Anyway, it is our objective to check out a couple of recipes and I will report back. > ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 19:40:20 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 17:34:56 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: lro@team.net Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 294 X-Status: Status: RO > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? I don't think I'm a guru, but here's a suggestion; A High Lift jack and some lenths of rope and/or chain will do just about anything a winch will. Just a little slower. R, bg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 17:14:26 1994 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 17:44:32 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the pa X-Status: Status: RO Ray Harder writes: >OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they used to have canvas waterbags.... Yup, I had one for years...hung it off the driver's side mirror so's I could quaff without dismounting. Worked great. First, the rope rotted out and a gust from a passing semi sent it spewing into traffic. Retrieved and rewired, it lived a few more years, 'til the top fabric disintergrated. Actually, I think it was made from flax (coarse linen). Got mine from Dick Cepek, but all Cepek advertises these days is tires. If you find another give me a shout. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 17:47:58 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 15:37:26 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: mfredett@ichips.intel.com From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Re: ABF leak, Portland Cc: lro@team.net X-Status: Status: RO Thanks for your reply on the net, regarding the field meet. I understand that you have also tried a couple of times to phone and have missed me. Best time is late night (9:00-11:00 P.M.), although I will probably be home all this evening. Dormobile top is sold (traded) but have other stuff and plan to bring stuff to field meet for swappingtime. A couple more questions regarding the meet: 1. TeriAnn Wakeman writes that one must (naturally) choose between the "public" bbq @ $12.00/head or LRO bbq @ approx. $5.00/head. I should think we'd want to attend the LRO bbq and so question is exactly how much and would that be a part of the registration fee as would the public one? 2. What sort of picture is appropriate for the program, a portrait or an action shot? Inasmuch as it is a Land-Rover, I lean toward an action shot. What do you think? Thanks. Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 22:15:35 1994 From: Malcolm956@aol.com Sender: "Malcolm956" To: LRO@team.net Date: Mon, 01 Aug 94 22:07:50 EDT Subject: Water Pumps X-Status: Status: RO I seem to have a leak in the fan of my '65 Ser IIa 88". At least the fluorescent green liquid is flung from the fan blade tips as the engine runs. As the normal water content of a fan blades is on the lowish side, my conclusion is that there is a leak at the forward end of the water pump shaft. I would appreciate comments -about the relative merits of installing a rebuilt pump (ca $120) v. putting in the seals, et al, (ca $60). -do I really have to start by taking out the radiator? The latter question is really more of a forlorn hope than a real hope. My first British car was a Austin A-40 back in '57. Often the long way is the fast one, but any short custs would be appreciated. Thanx; Malcolm =====__ |[__]|_\_==_ | | ] (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:[> From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 21:44:43 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Camel Trophy Questions Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 19:39:00 -0700 From: Mike Fredette X-Status: Status: RO Hi folks, Here in the US there is an appalling lack of publicity for the Camel Trophy. The cable sports channel aired the film of last years event a couple times but that's about all. I understand that in other parts of the world, it's very big stuff indeed, my question is why? The Camel folk don't sell any of their merchandise ie. hats, shirts, watches, stickers etc. anywhere that I'm aware of in the US. They don't even advertise in LRO in the UK. With it being such a big event I would think they would make these items more available. What I'm getting at is, I want to buy some of these goodies, do any of you world traveled types know where to do so in the US? Or how about the across the pond types, anything in Australia or New Zealand or the UK or Europe? I'm sure someone can shed some light on the mystery. Also, I think it was Sandy Grice or one of the East coast fellows who had the address of Mr Collins, the US Camel Trophy organizer, could you please publish it again. Rgds Mike Fredette 94 DEFENDER 90 (how sweet it is) Portland, Oregon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 18:03:28 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re[2]: lots of questions, long, from non owner To: lro@team.net Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 8:53:19 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > > >============================================================================== > >Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" > >LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) > >email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au > > I see you are in Victoria - do you know anything about McNamara Diff > specialists in Moorabbin? I got some info from them some time back and I > was wondering if you knew anything more about them. > > > Best- > Greg > > > Yes, I have one of his manual diff locks in the back of my series 1, really strong, and good for getting out of embarising situations. What do you want to know! ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 22:32:19 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: Water Pumps To: Malcolm956@aol.com Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 13:22:28 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9408012207.tn483357@aol.com>; from "Malcolm956@aol.com" at Aug 01, 94 10:07 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > > I seem to have a leak in the fan of my '65 Ser IIa 88". At least the > fluorescent green liquid is flung from the fan blade tips as the engine runs. > As the normal water content of a fan blades is on the lowish side, my > conclusion is that there is a leak at the forward end of the water pump > shaft. > > I would appreciate comments > -about the relative merits of installing a rebuilt pump (ca $120) v. putting > in the seals, et al, (ca $60). > -do I really have to start by taking out the radiator? > > The latter question is really more of a forlorn hope than a real hope. My > first British car was a Austin A-40 back in '57. Often the long way is the > fast one, but any short custs would be appreciated. > > Thanx; > Malcolm > > =====__ > |[__]|_\_==_ > | | ] > (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:[> > put a kit through the water pump, this replaces everything except the casing, new impella, spindel, the works. Will make it just like new. ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 13:15:28 1994 Date: 02 Aug 94 11:48:34 EDT From: Keith Steele <75126.1123@compuserve.com> To: Subject: Manifold Destiny X-Status: Status: RO For the cookin' while you are cruisin' set my wife found the under the hood cook book. It is still in print. Our copy will arrive in one two weeks. For those of you interested in obtaining a copy of your own it is - MANIFOLD DESTINY: The One! The ONLY! Guide to Cooking on your Car Engine. ISBN: 0679723374 Paperback $7.95 US. Published by Random House. It is available for special order through most book stores. Ray Harder wrote - Oh, how timely. 11 days till LULU and owners drive 1200 miles to Western Colorado and Utah for the LROA outing. We are going to make the manifold roast beef (w/potatoes, carrots onions). This part of the trip has my wife actually excited. If you (or someone else) could find and post some recipes from this book you would be heroes. Sorry Ray I most likely will not get the book in time (lost another chance at being a hero) for your departure but if you Rover over to your nearest book purveyor, offer to pay for overnight express, you may yet have some adventure to add to your adventure. Keith Steele 75126.1123@compuserve.com '72 Series III since new From 75126.1123@compuserve.com Tue Aug 2 10:53:39 1994 Date: 02 Aug 94 11:50:25 EDT From: Keith Steele <75126.1123@compuserve.com> To: Subject: Manifold Destiny X-Status: Status: RO Ray If you get this before the LRO mail list I found the Manifold Destiny book and it is still in print. It is MANIFOLD DESTINY: The One! The ONLY! Guide to Cooking on your Car Engine. ISBN: 0679723374 Paperback $7.95 US. Published by Random House. It is available for special order through most book stores. I have ordered a copy for my wife and I - arrival date 1 to 2 weeks. If the Manifold Destiny book comes earlier rather than later (in time for your and LULU's departure I will let you know. If you want me to Fedex it over to you I will. You never know, if you Rover over to your local book store and offer to pay overnight express you may be able to get it in just a couple of days. Good Luck and enjoy your trip. If my Rover is back together in time I am planning to go to the East Coast Main Event -cookin as we're cruisin. Keith Steele 75126.1123@compuserve.com '72 Series III since new From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 14:16:55 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? From: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Dale Desprey) Reply-To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 11:10:43 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu writes: > OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they > used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. > > Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am > wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might > obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. > I have a canvas water bag. I haven't put it on this year. Problem number one is that it leaks from the bottom corner. I found that it was best to soak it before using it. Problem number two is the "don't know the answer, so make something up" rover types in our club, were sure to criticize. I had mine hanging down in front of the rad, wrapped through the grill. "Won't that cause overheating problems". It doesn't make any difference on mine. These are available new, at Sir Plus. They have a plastic cap instead of a cork. Also the cord doesn't last very long. If you can't find one locally, let me know. Dale Desprey -- Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 12:39:28 1994 Date: Tue, 02 Aug 1994 13:30:16 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Good & bad news X-Status: Status: RO Went to court this AM concering Robert's demolished 109. Everyone from both sides were there...except the judge. Seems they ran out of judges/courtrooms so the trial got "bumped" 'til who knows when.... Now the good news...a college friend who works for RJR called. He's picked up a bunch of Camel Trophy goodies for prizes/giveaways at the October Mid-Atlantic Land Rover Rally. How about T-shirts from this year's event? Camel Trophy belts, pens, pins and even gold-plated Zippo lighters (hey, it's RJR!) engraved with every Camel Trophy location and date. The ol' Rover is going to be in *five* more episodes of the "Archaeology" series. John Rhys Davis again narrates, siting in or standing near the Rover in each. It's getting paid ($100 a day) almost more than me! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 15:16:08 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 12:26:53 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Re: Hot Plate (venting footwells) X-Status: Status: RO John R. Benham (BENHAM@WFOCLAN.USBM.GOV) writes: > > On a recent Rover Run, it was unseasonably hot in NW Montana and >Northern Idaho. My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around >the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles >on my Clark Wallabees!! My old Land Cruiser FJ-40 had side vents to >prevent this heat build up. Any suggestions from other LRO's on how >you all deal with the heat build up?? > I recall that some enthusiast in the eastern U.S. once marketed a simple but sturdy guard of heavy steel wire (or light steel bar) which would cover a standard Land-Rover tropical roof vent, allowing you to mount such a vent on the side, to vent the footwell, yet have it reasonably protected from brush damage. I haven't seen such an item advertised in years. Anyone know what became of it? Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 11:24:13 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 09:08:56 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: tomills@du.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: springs update X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu> "T.F. Mills" writes: > Some time ago I solicited y'all's advice on spring repair, and decided > it would be best to get some spring specialists to do it. > > I'm not too happy with the $585 result. A few days afterwards, the LR > started to list badly to the driver's side. Before I could take it > back, the tranny fell apart, but that's another story. I can also see > daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? And what's > the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and > right fairly unique to Rovers? And could the shop have switched the > left and right springs because they didn't know there was a > difference? Could there be any other reasons for the listing? It was > listing alternately from side to side before I took it in, and I had hoped > re-arching and repair would cure the problem. And another thing, some > of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that > was normal. > > Any thoughts? > > > T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu > University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA > Ya shoulda not bought those shares of stock for that bridge Your Land Rover should run too stiff when empty and not list at all. Mine rides like a sedan with seven bales of hay in the back and does not list or sway unduely. There should not be space at the ends of the leaves. When there is they are just there for ballast and not to help carry a load. I have yet to meet a person who had leaf springs rebuilt who was happy about it. I have also seen a few worn out springs being sold by Land Rover parts companys as good used....sold at a higher price than you could purchase a new set from Merseyside Land Rover services ltd. As I recall, their prices for new springs are very resonable. Shippings not too good since they are heavy, but you could probably think of a few light things that your Land Rover needs to help defray shipping costs (By purchasing a lot of things at once you can pay for the cost of shipping out of part of the money you are saving over purchasing them in the US). You should ring up your shop and ask that they rebuild them again and do it right this time. If you can get them to agree to it you can remove the leaf springs & get them rebuilt again while you are doing the tranny... Or you can try to get your $$ back in trade for your old springs..HAH Sorry, I can't think of anything positive to say about your situation. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 00:49:14 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: Hot Plate (venting footwells) Date: 2 Aug 1994 22:18:42 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <199408021926.MAA08208@pacific.pacific.net>, Granville Pool wrote: >I recall that some enthusiast in the eastern U.S. once marketed a simple but >sturdy guard of heavy steel wire (or light steel bar) which would cover a >standard Land-Rover tropical roof vent, allowing you to mount such a vent on >the side, to vent the footwell, yet have it reasonably protected from brush >damage. I haven't seen such an item advertised in years. Anyone know what >became of it? > >Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last. > I remember a chap, Doug Richardson, fabricating (or having them fabricated) in the LA area. I'll see if I can locate a phone or address. It's been a while since I've seen these too -- they were an iron bar/grill that would protect the vent hatch from brush. Randy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 22:24:42 1994 Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 23:11:50 LCL From: Joseph Broach Subject: Spare tire mounting To: land-rover-owner@team.net X-Status: Status: RO Hi, I am a new owner and this may be a nutty question, but what is the best place for the spare? My 88" has mounting plates on the bonnet (current mount), the rear door, and behind the front seats? The bonnet is convenient, but hampers visibility and makes the bonnet a real chore to open. Thanks!! From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 21:32:07 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 20:23:47 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: TEST X-Status: Status: RO Just checking to see if my email went south. Roy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 01:00:42 1994 Date: Tue, 02 Aug 1994 22:53:03 -0700 (PDT) From: LROVER@u.washington.edu Subject: Bits and Spares must sell need Cash Sender: Land Rover Fanatic! To: lro@team.net X-Envelope-To: lro@team.net X-Vms-To: IN%"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Status: Status: RO 1-Safari roof for an 88 needs some TLC $700.00 or trade 1-Dlx dished hood fair to good shape$200.00 or trade 1-109 box bed set up as a trailer no top or sidess anylonger unfinished project sell or trade for $350.00 1-Safari rear door fair shape $80.00 1-coil Lucas $2.00 1-SIII steering wheel $4.00 1-pair SIII ext. door hinges $4.00 3-Interior door handels $1.50 ea. 1-Lucas Alt. rebuildable $30.00 1-Set SIII door trim $15.00 Misc. LR name tags..$2.50ea. also...'71-SIIa 88 in good working order blue w/hard top clean rarely driven, asking $7,500.00/trade That's what's available at this time anyone interested please e-mail me or call me at (206)365-3514hm# or (206)623-5460wk# or fax# (206)623-9831. Sincerely, Benjamin J. Freeman From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 02:03:23 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Re: land rover badges To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 00:51:16 -0600 (MDT) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "Robin Craig" at Jul 30, 94 07:19:58 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2101 X-Status: Status: RO Robin scribblerit: < BTW if you get Soldier like Mr Mills and myself the aforementioned < offending badge can be seen on the rear of a lightweight on the rear < cover of the July25 issue of that erstwhile publication. < < Millsy mate, did you spot the other two anomalies with that picture? Millsy pontificat: Quit rubbing it in!! I have yet to receive the Soldier issue with all the neat review Rovers from a few months ago, let alone the July 25 issue. I feel like the US is a desert island. I'm going to have to move to Canada. There was a recent US postal scandal: tons of undelivered mail stockpiled in DC -- I always suspected a plot to pretend airmail from overseas was really on a slow ship around all the horns and capes. Anomalies? Well, I'm busy trying to epoxy the shreds of my tranny in time for the national rally. I would have shot any other vehicle that behaved like this. But I love my Rover. It will make a sexy birdbath if all else fails. And I do have that ugly Tootsie to console me! (I wonder whatever happened to the smelly gummy Norwegian.) TeriAnn was right: we ain't normal. .________________._____ /~~~~~~~//~~~~~~~~//~~~~~| / // // | /_\.___ //__ \.___//_______| [%%%%%%%%%] ======] |[_______] _____ ===========_____ --------}========================== | |/| ! ## !| | | []| |) | |/| ###### | | _____ | | ___ | |_____|/|_######_|____ |/_ _ \}_______|________/_ _\ |. / ______________________ \ \ \_______________// \\ / |/ |%{ @ } !! |%\| @ } |%{ @ } \%\ / !@&%!! \%\ / \%\ / ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ 1966 Land Rover Series IIA 109" T. F. Millsy tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 03:15:57 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Re: Names To: velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk (S|ren Vels Christensen) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 01:03:30 -0600 (MDT) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "S|ren Vels Christensen" at Jul 31, 94 02:06:52 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 799 X-Status: Status: RO Soren Vels lapsit calami: < When watching a movie i was suddenly struck with inspiration. The most < obvious name for the landie was handed to me on a silver tray. A name that < reflects the highest dreams and wildest plans for a roving type in urban < imprisonment. Lawrence of Arabia. I call mine Sal or Sali -- short for Salah-uddin (or Saladin). Same general inspiration. I was once driving through the affluent celebrity town of Aspen, Colorado, in my topless 109, and somebody yelled out at me, "Hey, Lawrence!" There must be something to the idea, especially since T.E. never had a Rover. I suppose it beats calling your beloved, "Rat". T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 02:44:18 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: springs update To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 01:34:12 -0600 (MDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1065 X-Status: Status: RO Some time ago I solicited y'all's advice on spring repair, and decided it would be best to get some spring specialists to do it. I'm not too happy with the $585 result. A few days afterwards, the LR started to list badly to the driver's side. Before I could take it back, the tranny fell apart, but that's another story. I can also see daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? And what's the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and right fairly unique to Rovers? And could the shop have switched the left and right springs because they didn't know there was a difference? Could there be any other reasons for the listing? It was listing alternately from side to side before I took it in, and I had hoped re-arching and repair would cure the problem. And another thing, some of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that was normal. Any thoughts? T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 03:37:46 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: springs To: tomills@du.edu (T.F. Mills) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 17:38:02 +0930 (CST) Cc: lro@stratus.com (Land Rover Owners Group) In-Reply-To: <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu> from "T.F. Mills" at Aug 3, 94 01:34:12 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1069 X-Status: Status: RO Tom writes: >I can also see daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? Uh dunno... my springs always had a small gap when unloaded. Got worse after reseting though. >And what's the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and > right fairly unique to Rovers? Cant speak for US vehicles but definitely existed on some oz holdens. > Could the shop have switched the left and right springs because they didn't know there was a difference? Possible/likely A check of spring numbers may help but they may have been reset "against" the spring number anyway. > Could there be any other reasons for the listing? Shackle bushes done up too tight and/or at the wrong ride height. most likely. > And another thing, some of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that was normal. Hard to say. Depends upon the style of spring, if thry are "overload" style then several leaves in a bundle will sit below the main set. > Any thoughts? Time for a beer! -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 05:28:35 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: springs update To: tomills@du.edu (T.F. Mills) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 11:11:59 BST Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu>; from "T.F. Mills" at Aug 3, 94 1:34 am X-Status: Status: RO One other thing besides Darryl's thoughts.Is one side low,or,is one side high?Sounds stupid,I know,but I actually have a *high* side, (the left) while the other is normal.This on an 88" BTW. I *think* what happpened was that when I replaced the springs,with non-genuine ones,both sides were made the same,but with the increaed camber normally associated with the RHS.This theory is largely borne out(no,forget that bit....).The fact that there *is* more weight on the RHS is borne out by the increased "squash" of the radial tyres I've just put on instead of cross plys,on the RHS front *and* rear. One other theory I've heard advanced,is that due to non aligned chassis repairs,the spring hangers are no longer the same distance apart,thus causing the problem,but I discounted that one on the grounds that you'd have to make a relatively massive error to make any difference. So when your springs were reset,were they both made the same? Just a thought. Cheers Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 05:04:57 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 12:04:42 GMT+0200 Subject: Re: Names Cc: lro@stratus.com Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > Soren Vels lapsit calami: > > < When watching a movie i was suddenly struck with inspiration. The most > < obvious name for the landie was handed to me on a silver tray. A name that > < reflects the highest dreams and wildest plans for a roving type in urban > < imprisonment. Lawrence of Arabia. > > I call mine Sal or Sali -- short for Salah-uddin (or Saladin). Same > general inspiration. I was once driving through the affluent > celebrity town of Aspen, Colorado, in my topless 109, and somebody > yelled out at me, "Hey, Lawrence!" There must be something to the > idea, especially since T.E. never had a Rover. I suppose it beats > calling your beloved, "Rat". T.E.'s arabic name was summat like "El-aurens" -- rolls off the tongue melodiously, non? ...... Nice name for someone's really desert-worthy Landie! Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 10:59:29 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Listing To: tomills@du.edu (T.F. Mills) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 11:26:16 EDT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu>; from "T.F. Mills" at Aug 3, 94 1:34 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] X-Status: Status: RO > I'm not too happy with the $585 result. A few days afterwards, the LR > started to list badly to the driver's side. Before I could take it > back, the tranny fell apart, but that's another story. I can also see > daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? And what's > the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and > right fairly unique to Rovers? And could the shop have switched the > left and right springs because they didn't know there was a > difference? Could there be any other reasons for the listing? It was > listing alternately from side to side before I took it in, and I had hoped > re-arching and repair would cure the problem. And another thing, some > of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that > was normal. > > Any thoughts? Ok folks. I've said this before but nobody has ever bought it. The shackle pins that hold the rear shackle of the front spring and the front shackle of the rear spring to the frame may be too tight. These two shackles-on the frame side-are threaded and a locknut further secures them. If these are tightened up with all your might then they cannot "swing" with the compression/decompression of your springs. ...and goddammit they should. If not, you get an extra rough ride, if they move, but not freely (ie they get stuck in one point, unevenly at that) your rover might list to one side (much like the company I work for-read the papers lately??). Note that the manuals do NOT mention any of this (and hence I've not made any believers out of you)- they just say "assemble, bounce it around a bit, torque" or something to that effect. Those of you with badly worn springs may find these two shackles will "bottom out" against your frame. C'est la vie. Time for new springs. Aside from this, we all assume you have new bushes (frame side) or that they were ok from the start. WRT seeing space between the leaves-are they "peeling apart"??? Are they secured with metal straps about them (either bolted on or bent on)? Rgds, rdushin/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 10:16:05 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 10:04:28 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: That spring thing again - X-Status: Status: RO I'm sure I should remember this from the last time this was discussed (and I will archive the thread this time) but what is the opinion on LR road springs and the need/no need for different cambers for each corner. Rovers North only seems to have one spring for the front and one for the back. Perhaps this makes sense in the LHD truck as the gas and the driver are no longer on the same side?? Opinions. As for the Springs themselves - Rovers North is $100+ per for the original part - "Bat Fastard" is 25 pounds front and 33 pounds rear (shipping????). Do you run a real risk of getting springs that will not last? Any specific experience with aftermarket springs? Thanks - Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 13:22:14 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: OVLR: August off-road event. Preliminary Details. From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 12:08:17 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO August brings another OVLR off-road event. Below is the tentative information on the Calabogie power cut/Flower Station Road camping weekend as it is currently planned. The only detail that will be changing will be the departure time from Ottawa. If anyone is interested in participating in this event, they can either phone Jerry Dowell, or they can send me a message at fourfold. Rgds, Dixon Weekend, August 20/21: The Calabogie/Flower Station Road A revisit of an old overnight run not attempted in several years. This would be considered a medium off- road effort with and option of no heavy winching required. A good opportunity to check your axle articulation. Who: Anyone interested in an interesting off-road camping adventure. Phone Jerry Dowell (819 827-2932) to reserve a spot. There will be a limit on the number of Land Rovers as there are time constraints on how long it will take to get through any obstacles. We cannot sit at a mud hole for several hours and still make the campsite by dark. Phoning early is also a good idea as preference will be given to vehicles with 16" wheels. Vehicles may be divided by route to balance the number of winches on each trail, preference being given to the hydro cut route. What: Two teams of vehicles will enter the trail from opposite ends. The first will be at the beginning of the Calabogie Power/Hydro Cut and following the power cut to Straddlebug Lake; The hydro cut route will involve three to four areas where vehicles will have to be winched through. The second comes in at the Flower Station Road. This route will not involve winching, but features a trail building exercise of about 100 feet to get past a swamp. The two groups will meet in the centre at a large clearing. Bring:There is no fresh water at the campsite. Bring water. This is a bring your own everything event. You are responsible for bringing any required food, beverages, water, cutlery, oil, spare petrol, spares et cetera. One vehicle on the Flower Station route will require a chainsaw. When: At this time there are two proposed starting options. The current is meeting at Shoppers City West at 8am and proceeding to Calabogie. The journey is a two hour trip. As this might cut into time a bit much, the alternate proposal is to leave Friday evening and camp at the large pine at the end of the hydro cut. The two teams would leave from this point. -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 12:32:24 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 13:22:04 -0400 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Apparently-To: lro@transfer.stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > Rgds, > Joseph > >Remove the steering wheel and put it back centrally,with the wheels >straight ahead. >Cheers >Mike Rooth >You could always remove the steering wheel and put it back on straight >TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world Oh no, no no. Do it *right*. Adjust the steering drag link rod that runs from the steering relay to the right wheel. Loosen the clamps on either end that keep it connected to the tie rod ends. Use a tad of spritz (eg WD40) if need be and give the rod a twist while your favorite slave sits at the helm and yells when it is straight. You may need a pipe wrench and a rag to protect the rod if you dare not scratch it. As stated previously (but not to the list) this assumes the lever(s) attached to the relay have not been removed/replaced one or so splines off to either side. I forget *exactly* how it lines up, but methinks that when the wheels (ie tyres) are straight and you are at the half- way point in steering box travel (what is this, twelve turns lock to lock? so maybe six turns in....ignore where the "spokes" of your steering wheel are for now) the lower lever coming off your relay is supposed to be straight forward (check your manual, it covers this). I forget about the "incoming" lever to the relay but that is coverd as well in the manual. Once these two levers are set properly (they *probably* already are) then a simple twist or three about the drag link rod will straighten your wheel pronto. May well be a tad more trouble than removing the steering wheel, but that is splined and may not neccessarily line up when you move it. Besides, if your are dealing with a IIa or later Joe Lucas gets involved as well (horn removal). No biggie, but..... rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 14:14:07 1994 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 12:05:00 MST From: DEBROWN@srp.gov To: Offroad@ai.gtri.gatech.edu, lro@team.net Subject: California Emissions. X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: California Emissions. I'm trying to find a Land Rover Discovery, and am having a hard time finding anything less than full retail price. I have found a buying service that has a connection with a dealer in California that offers $1000 off the retail sticker price. However, they MUST add the "California Emissions" to the vehicle at a cost of $100 and I live in Arizona. Can anyone out there please explain exactly what this includes, and how does it affect the vehicle's performance? Thanks, *** **** **** "Some men see things as they are and say why? * * * * * I see things as they never were and say why not?" * **** **** *** * * * -Robert Frost From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 15:09:05 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 12:05:52 -0800 To: lro@stratus.com From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) Subject: Re: Spare tire mounting X-Status: Status: RO 2. >A bit more sophisticated is to make up a swivelling mounting bracket >that is firmly attached to the rear of the Landie. It takes the form >of two brackets with a spindle onto which is welded a swinging arm >that actually takes the tyre. The two brackets mount firmly onto the >rear of the chassis and loadbed rail just central to the rear lights. >The wheel is mounted on the swinging arm which is "locked" across the >rear door by a (or the) tailgate-type pin. > Very strong and rigid, takes up no space and is really a sensible >development of the el cheapo Landie tyre-on-back-door arrangement. >The only snag (such as it is) is that in order to open the rear door >it is 1st necessary to unlatch the tyre swinging mounting and swing it >out the way. A bit difficult to describe in words, but hopefully the >principle is lucid!! >Cheerio, >Keith Coman > > > * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Hello all, I really hate to say this, but this mount sounds exactly like what I had on the back of my Jeep! In the case of the Jeep, it mounts right in the corner, the top bar over the right rear light and the bottom bar under the light. Could it be that this is one idea that should be transferred to the Land Rover? I will say that for a look at a defender 90 at the LROA christmas get together, the spare tire carrier is very nice! Mounted to the side and swivels out of the way of the door automatically! when the tailgate is opened. Now, it would appear that my wife is making arrangements for us to go to England at the end of August. From past posts, I want to visit the auto museum and get a Land Rover ride, visit the Land Rover Factory (is that possible for plain-tourists?) and check out bookstores listed in FAQs and other posts. All that aside, what else should someone like me do? I don't have a Land Rover and so don't need parts but could be persuaded to look for things for others, assuming I'm not required to carry a short block or set of springs back. Any ideas greatly welcomed. John Hess, PhD Phone me 916 752 8420 Dept of Human Anatomy FAX me 916 752 8520 University of Calif Email me jfhess@ucdavis.edu Davis, CA or leave me alone, your choice. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 17:32:56 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 16:21:49 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: TEST X-Status: Status: RO Test, test. I think my mail is on the blink. Roy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 22:56:26 1994 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 23:38:58 LCL From: Joseph Broach Subject: Thanks!! To: land-rover-owner@team.net X-Status: Status: RO Thanks to all who replied to my "Land Rover Owner at Last" post. I am sorry I am not able to thank you all personally, but I have received too much great information. I have also been out putting around in Sidney a lot. I had to top up the front diff due to a loose drain plug. Are their certain conditions under which to check fluids (i.e. do things need to be engaged, in neutral, or does it matter at all??). Anyway, know that all your replies are appreciated and put to good use. Rgds, Joseph '67 ser IIa 88"....Sidney From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 00:43:21 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 07:45:24 GMT+0200 Subject: Re: Spare tire mounting Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > 2. > >A bit more sophisticated is to make up a swivelling mounting bracket > >that is firmly attached to the rear of the Landie. It takes the form > >of two brackets with a spindle onto which is welded a swinging arm > >that actually takes the tyre. The two brackets mount firmly onto the > >rear of the chassis and loadbed rail just central to the rear lights. > >The wheel is mounted on the swinging arm which is "locked" across the > >rear door by a (or the) tailgate-type pin. > > Very strong and rigid, takes up no space and is really a sensible > >development of the el cheapo Landie tyre-on-back-door arrangement. > >The only snag (such as it is) is that in order to open the rear door > >it is 1st necessary to unlatch the tyre swinging mounting and swing it > >out the way. A bit difficult to describe in words, but hopefully the > >principle is lucid!! > >Cheerio, > >Keith Coman > > Hello all, I really hate to say this, but this mount sounds exactly like > what I had on the back of my Jeep! In the case of the Jeep, it mounts right > in the corner, the top bar over the right rear light and the bottom bar > under the light. Could it be that this is one idea that should be > transferred to the Land Rover? Bingo!! We don't get too many Jeeps out here, so I wasn't familiar with this arrangement having been derived from the Landies' trans-Atlantic "father". It's a *great* idea IMO, but out here the swing-mounts that I've had a look at were all homebrew. Well it looks like a trip to a Jeep accessories store or scrap yard with a tape-measure could be just the ticket for you lucky chaps puzzling over how to mount a spare tyre on the back of a Landie!! (:D) Kind regards, Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 03:34:06 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: TEST To: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com (ROY CALDWELL) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 9:24:12 BST Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408032221.AA10699@mtnoca.helena_noc>; from "ROY CALDWELL" at Aug 3, 94 4:21 pm X-Status: Status: RO > > > Test, test. I think my mail is on the blink. > > > Roy > Received,strength five.Listening.Out. Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 09:18:24 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 09:06:44 -0600 To: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Re: Access to roverweb Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO >> >> In an effort to consolidate some of the services on my machine the address >> for the roverweb has changed from http://roverweb.gar.utexas.edu:1500/ to >> http://roverweb.gar.utexas.edu/roverweb/roverweb.html. > >Hi Greg, I cant seem to access either of these addresses. I get an error >message stating that our machine is unable to connect to the foreign host. >Any ideas??? > >Ta >-- > > Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) > Dept. of Plant Science, Waite Institute > University of Adelaide, Glen Osmond S.A. 5064 > Australia. Voice:61_8 303 7426 Fax:61_8 303 7102 Woops - nice address I gave you...... try - http://whitman.gar.utexas.edu/roverweb/roverweb.html Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 11:04:48 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: twakeman@apple.com, lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 08:47:57 +1100 Subject: Re: POLL- LR camping X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > Date sent: Wed, 3 Aug 94 17:06:00 -0700 > From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" > Send reply to: "TeriAnn Wakeman" > To: lro@stratus.com > Subject: POLL- LR camping > Its time for a new poll to help out the LR interior disadvantaged. > > Question: How do you set your Land Rover up for car camping (specify long or > short wheel base). If you have anything built in, please be as descriptive as > possible as to what how big (dimensions would be nice) and where. > > > I'll start with my car: > > 109 two door, safari top, tail gate. > > camping modifications: > Horz 5 gal propane tank under bench between right seat and right rear wheel. > Hole cut in side of car with LR tool box lid modified as a lid for the side > providing access to the propane tank. > > Car camping set up: > I bungie cord 3 large plastic bens to the right rear bench. Front one hold > clothes, middle one sleeping bag & pillow, rear one kitchen stuff. Extra > propane bottles for lanterns and kitchen stuff in right rear tool box. > > Left rear toolbox contains tools, work on car clothes and oil. Above that at > left rear is bungie strapped ice cooler (food and film). Bungi corded against > back of front seats, plastic tarp, chase lounge pad (AKA bed), folding table, > propane stove, folding chair, two five gal. water cans. Not bungi corded, Great > pyrenese, dog food, dog food & water dish, old car cover for dog bed & chain for > dog. > > passanger side front floor, two buckets for washing and rinsing dishes, two > propane lanterns, one flashlight. On seat, camera gear. > > When I'm camping all the noncamera gear goes out except bed and ice chest. I set > the tanle up fot the stove & kitchen stuff, connect the stove to the inside > propane tank. Hang a lantern above the stove & one at the end of the tail gate > top. I sleep in the pad in the back of the car. > > So what does everyone else do?????????????? > > > TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world > twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards > LINK: TWAKEMAN > 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, > MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 > TeriAnn, Your set up looks preety good. I have a SWB 88 and do not have the luxury of space. I tent it and have all of my equipment stored in Rubbermaid `Action Packer's. These storage units are the best thing that has ever happened for campers. I have also designed an integral roof rack system. The rack holds the tent bag, safari chairs (from Costco), a 4" PVC pipe holding tarp poles, and extra water or gas. All of the cooking, tarps, and other odds and ends are stored in the `Action Packers'. The jewel of my set up is that the roof rack was designed to incorporate a shower curtain with a hot water shower. I have an 12 volt RV type pump which pumps (upon demand) heated water from a large 5 gal pot on a Coleman stove. It's fitted with a couple of pieces of short garden hoses to a PVC pipe/valve/shower head assymbly. The whole assymbly can be stored in a small `Action Packer'. It works great! No need to wait for a solar shower - especially here in the Northwest US. The shower unit becomes a very popular piece of equipment on Rover Rallys! Most of my professional life I've been ruffing it in the `field' - so I know that a hot shower is a luxury! Regards, John R. Benham Spokane, WA, USA > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 13:52:24 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 13:39:17 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Hot Rod Rover X-Status: Status: RO For those looking for those extra hp - I talked with Steve at British Pacific this morning about a few things and I got sidetracked and started asking him about engine modifications. It started with headers and went from there so for those that might be curious I thought I would pass on what I learned. Headers - 4 tube with collector - $274.55 Weber, 2 stage, 2 barrell carb - $360.11 High perfomance intake manifold for above - $221.76 Electronic ignition - he likes the Crane/Allison unit Coil - Lucas Sport or Jacobs also mentioned going with 2.5 liter petrol cam - better breathing I don't know what this would do to your low end performance or idle. He didn't seem to think it would hurt (though it sure would put a dent in your wallet). This starts to sound a little like overkill but a person can dream . . . . Best- Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 14:03:53 1994 X-Msmail-Message-Id: A7424C2D X-Msmail-Conversation-Id: A7424C2D From: Edward Balassanian To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 11:42:19 TZ Subject: RE: Subscribe X-Status: Status: RO please remove me from this list. thanks. ---------- | From: ROY CALDWELL | To: | Subject: Subscribe | Date: Wednesday, August 03, 1994 7:07PM | | Received: from transfer.stratus.com by netmail.microsoft.com with SMTP (5.65/25-eef) | id AA21045; Wed, 3 Aug 94 18:19:20 -0700 | Received: from uswat.advtech.uswest.com | (uswat.advtech.uswest.com [130.13.16.1]) by | transfer.stratus.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA00937 for | ; Wed, 3 Aug 1994 21:08:00 -0400 | Received: from centhub (centhub.mnet.uswest.com) by | uswat.advtech.uswest.com with SMTP id AA17654 | (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 3 Aug 1994 19:07:58 -0600 | Received: by centhub.mnet.uswest.com (M-Net Hub.930405) | Received: from mtnoca.helena_noc by nmamail (4.1/SMI-4.1) | id AA28942; Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:05:22 MDT | Received: from ipx4.helena_noc by mtnoca.helena_noc (4.1/SMI-4.1) | id AA10812; Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:07:10 MDT | Message-Id: <9408040107.AA10812@mtnoca.helena_noc> | | | Have not received any mail from the list. | Tom responded to my test but I did not | get a copy via the list. Please see of | I have dropped of the subsciber list. | Thanks, | | Roy - Rovers in the Rockies | | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 16:58:26 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 17:48:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: off center steering To: Mike Rooth Cc: Joseph Broach , lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408031604.AA06944@hpc.lut.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO The steering arm on the relay is in the wrong spline or bent....the lower arms are always loose btw.......the stops on the swivel housing should limit the turns,not the worm in the steering box....knock the drop arm off,move the wheels to full left and reinstall the arm....this should help...some of the relays have a master(double thickness) spline that would make this impossible....so check*before* you get the *big* hammer! "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Wed, 3 Aug 1994, Mike Rooth wrote: > > > > > > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > > > Rgds, > > Joseph > > > Remove the steering wheel and put it back centrally,with the wheels > straight ahead. > Cheers > Mike Rooth > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 19:40:57 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 20:30:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: test To: ROY CALDWELL Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408042309.AA00424@mtnoca.helena_noc> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO OK.......All togeather now........"IT'S *WORKING*,ROY!!!!!!!" (do ya think he*heard*us?......I donnno....should we try again?....nay,he's got a Lucas-puter...wouldn't do any good...) :-) :-) :-) :-) sorry, i couldn't resist....... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Thu, 4 Aug 1994, ROY CALDWELL wrote: > > > Sorry for bothering people again. Sysop said we > did have some trouble with the mail tool. I want > to try this again to see if I can get this returned > via the Rover list. Thanks! > > Roy - Rovers in the Rockies, going into withdrawl with > no owners list > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 19:40:47 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 17:34:35 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: burns@cisco.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Ready for Colorado X-Status: Status: RO I sympathize about the transmission pan removal problem-- they don't mention in the manual that you have to take the chassis apart to do it! Have a great trip! John Brabyn 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 02:51:16 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: New Arrivals From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 04 Aug 94 23:37:43 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Just collected two series 3 109 SW's for about 25 nucks yesterday. Yup you guessed it, two of the Roco limited editioon jobbies are out, look great, have a few spares if anyone is interested, will post more tommorrwo. Must go to bed now rtgds Robin -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 08:53:04 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 15:24:46 +0100 (MET) From: S|ren Vels Christensen Subject: Re: Hot plate To: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <30F38123F68@wfoclan.usbm.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO On Tue, 2 Aug 1994, John R. Benham wrote: > Dear LRO's, > > On a recent Rover Run, it was unseasonably hot in NW Montana and > Northern Idaho. My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around > the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles > on my Clark Wallabees!! My old Land Cruiser FJ-40 had side vents to > prevent this heat build up. Any suggestions from other LRO's on how > you all deal with the heat build up?? > > Thanks, > > John R. Benham > Spokane, WA Well, if you can get Rockwool in WA try to get a plate that is fluffy on one side and hard on the other, -about 1 inch thick. Cut it to fit with about 5 mm clearance. Clean the panel and stick it on with contact glue (on the out side, of course). "And now to something completely different". M.P.F.C. Since i'm going to Jutland next week, i finally got to change the leaking fuel tank. The old one was the small 45l used to make room for PTO. The new one is a 70l, which is difficult to hold between the knees while trying to fit the bolts in holes with 2-3 mm wider span than the frame. I also learned to split a 1/4 inch bolt in two exactly identical halves with an accu tool with a 4 mm hi-speed drill. And now, off for two weeks in the sun with Lawrence and Carlsberg. +----------------------------+--------------------------------+ | Soren Vels | 1976 sIII 109" 2.25 petrol | | velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk | "Lawrence of Arabia" | ((|||)) | Royal Danish Air Forc | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 | ((|||)) | Communications Specialist | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members. | ((|||)) +----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______ ######################((|||))#############((|||)) AVoN RANGEMASTER 7.50 16 ######################((|||))#############((|||)) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 09:53:06 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 16:34:00 +0100 (MET) From: S|ren Vels Christensen Subject: Re: Thanks!! To: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO On Wed, 3 Aug 1994, James B Russell wrote: > Unless you are exceptionally fortunate you will probably find your > Land-Rover will have a typically British tendency to leak fluids. In > fact, there are many of us who begin to worry when they don't leak since > that usually means there are no longer any fluids to leak out. > > Don't be concerned about engaged, nuetral, or anything like that but do > make it a regular check everything and top off as necessary. Make this a > do as I say not as I do since I am far more neglectful than I should be. > > And if you don't have service manuals, be sure to get them since your > local garrage has probably never heard of a Land-Rover let alone have any > tech data on them. Consider a parts book too. > > Enjoy! You are in for a wonderful love/hate relationship. I know -- I > have had the same beat up 1966 IIA 88 SW for 18 years now. It is a good > and close friend and like a good friend, sometimes they are forgetful (as > am I) but we always get over it. > > Jim Russell ==== jrussell@netcom.com > (Seattle -- San Francisco) Fluids quick check: After a trip, open the hatch under the middel seat and take a deep breath (through the nose). Manuals: For a new owner, the official workshop manual combined with a Haynes is IMO the best thing. The workshop manual is very detailed and the Haynes has a lot of photos, which is great because you can see what things are like inside before starting repair. +----------------------------+--------------------------------+ | Soren Vels | 1976 sIII 109" 2.25 petrol | | velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk | "Lawrence of Arabia" | ((|||)) | Royal Danish Air Forc | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 | ((|||)) | Communications Specialist | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members. | ((|||)) +----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______ ######################((|||))#############((|||)) AVoN RANGEMASTER 7.50 16 ######################((|||))#############((|||)) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 11:29:40 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Fri, 05 Aug 94 12:17:58 EST To: CXKS46A@prodigy.com, Harry Greenspun Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re[2]: Roof racks off the rack Content-Length: 420 X-Status: Status: RO Harry Greenspun writes: > I know that Yakima makes a series of adapters that can be attached > directly to the roof (either bolted through or even a "molly" mounting > system when the other end can't be accessed). These then accept Yakima > rack "feet." I would assume that the adapters are general purpose - they act as surrogate gutters and would work for any brand rack system. Flame away if I'm wrong... Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 01:43:59 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Rangie bits into 109 To: lro@stratus.com (Land Rover Owners Group) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 16:08:12 +0930 (CST) Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1352 X-Status: Status: RO I think it was John Hess who asked about fitting a Rangie drive-line to a 109. Too late John. Thats just what rover did for the Stage ones. ('78-83 ???) The V8 was detuned a bit and the gearing altered a bit. ie slower :-( (This is the 3.5 V8 and LT95 4sp we're talking about) As for putting one into a 4/6cyl 109. No idea as to how hard it would be. The radiator would definitely need to move and the g/box hump would need to be reshaped. The chassis of a stage one is different but I dont know by how much, just the engine, radiator and possibly g/box mounts I presume. (a rangie radiator is used) You would definitely need the .996 transfer set if you didnt go for the 3.54 diffs (ex rangie or 110/defender) My stage one runs at about 30kmh per 1000 rpm in top, with the .996 and 4.7 diffs. (yes I know thats not the normal stage one set up, but mine is not the only one like it, thought to have been a special order job-lot as the others I know about also had county trim level and the optional low ratio steering box ... until I busted mine :-( Might be fun to try the conversion if you have lots of spare time and $$$$$ Cheers -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) Dept. of Plant Science, Waite Institute University of Adelaide, Glen Osmond S.A. 5064 Australia. Voice:61_8 303 7426 Fax:61_8 303 7102 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 04:22:52 1994 To: lro@stratus.com From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Cooking in lorries Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 10:16:48 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO Hexamine stovese are neat, but replacement hexamine is grossly overpriced (unless you steal it from soldiers) and smelly. But if you cut a couple of little windshield plates from an old drinks can, to rest inside the sides of the stove, and fill it up with barbecue charcoal, it works superbly as a small Osborne Stove. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 08:31:46 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 09:22:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Fairey Overdrive In-Reply-To: X-Status: Status: RO Steve writes > >Turing radius?????? Oh,with a 16 ft 2 axle trailer with *two* John Deere >model B tractors on,it is,let's see, New >York,Pennsalvania,Delaware,Maryland....thats 4 ,right????? >(turinig radius with or without trailer is the same .....*way* too big!) I think the origional owners manual sez "Turning radius--45 feet" Steve is right.....WAY too big. I wonder if you could do one of those power turns and take off the other way like in smokey and the bandit. Later Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 10:42:16 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny To: 75126.1123@compuserve.com (Keith Steele) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 10:34:39 -0500 (CDT) Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) In-Reply-To: <940731014947_75126.1123_FHD44-1@CompuServe.COM> from "Keith Steele" at Jul 30, 94 09:49:47 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1315 X-Status: Status: RO Keith Steele was bold enough to point out... > >For those Landie drivers who like to smell the roast along with >roses while cruising the byways of the world, there is a cookbook >which came out a number of years ago in the US called, strangely >enough, Manifold Destiny. It is dedicated to recipes for under >the hood cooking, some of which were quite good. My wife is >trying to see if she can obtain a copy someplace. .... Oh, how timely. 11 days till LULU and owners drive 1200 miles to Western Colorado and Utah for the LROA outing. We are going to make the manifold roast beef (w/potatoes, carrots onions). This part of the trip has my wife actually excited. If I could get some more recipes it could add some adventure to our adventure. I know we could retrofit some kitchen varieties, but why not use some new ones that have been field tested. If you (or someone else) could find and post some recipes from this book you would be heroes. Thanks, in advance. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 11:03:54 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 08:55:51 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: lots of questions, long, from non owner X-Status: Status: RO John, These old Land Rovers are noisy as all get out, get poor gas milage (my poll shouws about 12-13 MPG, slow (I get treated as a stationary object by everyone else when I on the road), and requires you to spend lots of time checking fluids. You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of time. If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new 4X4. But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering about exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. People wave, give you a thumbs up as that drive by, you get into all kinds of conversations with non-owners. But if you don't pull over to let them pass they get mighty upset. If you want a reliable Land Rover that you can hop into & go & keep up with everyone, get a new one. I don't know anyone with a old Land Rovers that goes outside their "Home territory" without enough tools on board to rebuild the car. If you want good gas milage and decent off road capability, try a VW Thing, of a Baja Bug. If you want chrisma try a Land Rover & UNDERSTAND that chrisma does not come without a price that most people are not willing to pay. Range? I have two petrol tanks and am getting ready to install a third. The tanks are not very big, but if you get enough of them you get range... just not in the sand or deep mud. Jim, AKA Scotty, always seems to have a Land Rover or two around thats for sale and knows where there is a half dozen or so more for sale. He closed his shop in Pittsburg to stay home with his wife when Jean was dying of cancer. He has a home shop with no real hours. The number is 510-686-2255. You will probably get his answering machine. Before you purchase one, just understand that it is a commitment of time for maintnenece, $$ for parts, you will have to learn more than you think to keep it going (or have lots of $$ and a regular Land Rover doctor that you visit monthly). They are noisy, primitive, slow, and go through fluids. They are not for normal people. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 14:49:18 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 09:47:24 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU, land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last X-Status: Status: RO In message <199407310252.WAA26843@transfer.stratus.com> Joseph Broach writes: > > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? Too much winch is better than not enough, and one that works both ways is better than one that only pulls. Other than that you can just check the yellow pages & all the off road equipment places you cn find. Not everyone has RN's markup. > > * I thought the all Landies came with 16" wheels, but the 88" has 15"ers > Any tire recommendations?? Not only that but early 16 inch wheels are narrower, and you can get wide aftermarket white spoke wheels as well (Mine has them & they look much better than stock). Sorry since I do not have stock wheels I can't give an answer. > > * What is the use for the neutral position of the transfer case?? Your Land Rover can handle both front & rear PTOs. You can put the transfer box in netral and run the PTOs without moving the car (There is a PTO front winch for the Land Rover). > > * The gearbox (serII) jumps out of second when the clutch is disengaged > (pushed down)?? What is the probable cause of this?? You probably have some serious wear in the transmission. I would budget a transmission rebuild soon before it lets go & meanwhile make sure you keep the fluids topped up > > * The PO could shift from first to second even though second's not > synchronized You double clutch between first & second. On downhill stops, I start in second, and have sometimes been known to shift first to third. But mostly I double clutch 1-2. > it sounded okay, but is it alright for the tranny? Surely not... > > * How hard is it to remove the Safari roof?? How heavy is it?? There is a row of bolts holding the top of the wind screen to the front of the top. If you have a valence at the front you will need to remove it first. There should be a bolt at all four corners where it contacts the body. If it has the side opening rear door, remove it first. You will need two people inside & under with good backs to lift it & walk it off the back. My roommate (also female) & I remove my 109's 2 door safari hard top without help if we can not find any. Its a bitch but doable. You just chant "aluminum top light" and tell your roommate that its just a light aluminum top & hope she forgets how heavy it really is when its time to put it back on. > > * Any maintenance tips?? Fluids! drain them all out & put in new fluids..water..90 wt., brake fluid. Use Castrol LMA DOT 4 brake fluid ONLY Frequenly check all 90 wt resavours until you get a feel on how quickly it is leaking out of each one. Don't go on a trip without checking fluids. Lock the front wheels for a day at least once a month, once a week is better to get fluids splashed around in the front axle. Dont forget, transmission, transfer case, both diffs, and each front ball joint each has its own resavour & oil is much cheaper than parts. Fluids! > > ...Thanks for wading through this mess!! > > J.B. (...and "Sydney" the ser IIa SWB from Tenessee) Save this document as:Save a copy in:Show ClipboardHide Clipboard Undo <<<>>> Redo <<<>>>(Unable to display contents at the momentUntitled-<<<>>> closingquitting CanUt Undosaverevert From CXKS46A@prodigy.com Mon Aug 1 14:06:00 1994 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 13:57:05 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny X-Status: Status: RO If you can find "Manifold Destiny" (it recently came out in paperback, and any decent bookstore should be able to order it) it has some interesting recepies: Thruway Thighs, Poached Fish Pontiac, or Safe-at-any-Speed Stuffed Eggplant. The pork tenderloins really cooked up well (my own idea, but based on concepts in Manifold Destiny). Wrap things up real well, ie., triple wrap in aluminum foil, not only to deep engine funk/road dirt out, but to keep juices in and off your manifold. Carry oven mits or work gloves. If you get really creative, you could incorporate a temperature probe in with the food to provide a direct read-out on the dash! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Jul 31 23:11:53 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 13:57:22 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? The winch on my Series 1 is home made, don't know how much it would cost to build, but it is bloody strong. Basically it works of the P.T.O. and uses a centre PTO with the belt pully removed and a sprocket put on instead, which is used to turn a double link chain to the shaft that runs to the winch, which runs along the main bearer of the chassie on the left hand side. The actual winch drive, I have been told, is the turret drive off a Centurian tank, turned onto its side and had a winch drum welded to it. The only problem with turret drive is the gearing, its wwaayy tooo low, 40:1 reduction to be precise, which means that I can winch a Range Rover up a hill in 4th gear at an idle with a stuffed motor, which is what I have to do, as all the uni's in the drive shaft have gone and then it rattles to much, but other than that its a great winch, realy good talking point as well > > * I thought the all Landies came with 16" wheels, but the 88" has 15"ers > Any tire recommendations?? > > * What is the use for the neutral position of the transfer case?? The neutral postion in the transfer case is for when you are running equipment of the P.T.O. that requires the vehicle to be stationary, eg. saw bench off a belt pulley, or when winching some one elses vehicle from where it should not have gone, which is about 90% of the work that my winch has to do. > * The gearbox (serII) jumps out of second when the clutch is disengaged > (pushed down)?? What is the probable cause of this?? Rebuild the gear box, you occasionally see a Landy jump out of third, but not second, except my parents series III which jumped out of every gear, including reverse, until it was rebuilt. >* The PO could shift from first to second even though second's not synchronized > it sounded okay, but is it alright for the tranny? Surely not... This is okay, you just have to get used to doubleing the clutch when changing from third to second, but don't even think of changing down to 1st on the move, I have never been able to do this without lots of grinding noises. > * How hard is it to remove the Safari roof?? How heavy is it?? Why on earth would you want to do that, the safari root keeps cabin tempurature down in the summer! > * Any maintenance tips?? If you are not working on it, then there is definitly something wrong with the vehicle! But seriously, regularly check the swivell housing for oil, or else you will go through wheel bearings. After off roading, check all the oils for water and the correct levels, especially the diff's, also remove the brake drums and clean out any junk that is in there, if you don't do this you will go through brake drums and shoes like they were going out of fashion. If you have an oil leak, try to fix, and if you cannot, regularly check the oil, my parents tranfer case used to leak, then they cooked, they had to throw the entire thing away, the main shaft was blue!! and the casing had teeth embeded in it, the whole thing was scrap. > ...Thanks for wading through this mess!! > > J.B. (...and "Sydney" the ser IIa SWB from Tenessee) > ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Jul 31 23:19:49 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: testing the Discovery's air bags. To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 14:07:41 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO Hi all, I thought this might interest a few of you out there. Last Friday, the LROC of Victoria, Australia, had a film night, where one of the videos shown was of some of the testing that was done to the Discovery to make sure that the air bags did not go off while off roading, and believe me, I am never going to buy a demonstrator vehicle after I saw what these vehicles were put through. They chained them up to trees, and then took off, they jumped them about 2 metres in the air, they bounced them over railway sleepers, that were about 1.5 metres apart, but the discoverys wheels only hit the sleepers, not the ground. They had a concrete step that was about a foot tall, and snatched one over that. They drove them over a simulated corregated road, that if they took any faster, the drivers would have lost control! Basically you would not want one of these vehicles, as they would either be longer than standard or would have a funny bannana shape about them, I know how strong they are built! ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From ccray Mon Aug 1 15:00:56 1994 Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny (fwd) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 15:00:56 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 794 X-Status: Status: RO MR ALEXANDER P GRICE was bold enough to point out... > >If you can find "Manifold Destiny" (it recently came out in paperback, and >any decent bookstore should be able to order it) it has some interesting >recepies: .... you are RIGHT -- called the bookstore and it will be in Thursday. $7.95. Sorry to bother the netters -- should have done my homework earlier. Anyway, it is our objective to check out a couple of recipes and I will report back. > ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From jhilborn@moose.uvm.edu Mon Aug 1 16:24:55 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 17:25:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Jan Hilborn Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu In-Reply-To: <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Ray, it wouldn't be very hard to make one (or 5)... the hardest part would be the closure at the top... if you don't have any luck (in the next few days) i'll try to throw one together and you can test drive it... jan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 16:39:27 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? Date: 1 Aug 1994 21:31:14 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu>, wrote: >OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they >used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. > >They were about 15 x 12 inches. They had a cork to >plug the opening and a rope handle. You would fill >the bag with water and drape it over a radiator cap. >The canvas would get wet and the evaporation (and the >fan action would help too) would cause the water to >cool. I remember being out in 100 f sunshine and the >water was so-o-o cold you could barely drink it. > >Anyway, I want one of those bags for the Utah expedition. >I think it would look proper on the grill of a SIIa 88. > >Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am >wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might >obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. > Don't know if it will help, but mine says: Keeps Drinking Water Cool SAHARA Flax (picture of a cow skull and cactus) Water Bag another Wenzel product Randy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 10:48:05 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 08:35:41 +1100 Subject: Hot plate X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Dear LRO's, On a recent Rover Run, it was unseasonably hot in NW Montana and Northern Idaho. My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles on my Clark Wallabees!! My old Land Cruiser FJ-40 had side vents to prevent this heat build up. Any suggestions from other LRO's on how you all deal with the heat build up?? Thanks, John R. Benham Spokane, WA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 17:40:20 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: Lucas Wiring Date: 1 Aug 1994 22:31:54 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <9407310128.AA06479@mtnoca.helena_noc>, ROY CALDWELL wrote: >I hope somebody has some ideas because I have run out >of ideas. This is the problem. I replaced the main >frame wire in Wicked Wonda, my 58 Series I. I thought that >I understood how the tail lights wired up but the signals >don't work. I have the factory single lens dual element >bulb. One element is the tail light the other is the brake light. >It does not matter which element I try to get to blink it is >a no go. The original factory vehicle manual wire diagram >does not show the turn signal switch or relay - the twits! >The factory manual does not show the relay or switch until the IIA >mod. > Probably not in the workshop manual because turn signals were an option. I recall ( or seem to) that the workshop manual for Series II, in the back of the book, showed the installation methods for optional equipment. This is a single volume book, and not the two volume IIA manual. I know it showed how to put in a governor, winch, dual gauge. >Now, this sounds stupid but, which element gets the signal blink? >The tail or brake light? The bright element, which is also the brake light. >The factory IIA illustrations and my >other Rovers have the signal light seperate and the brake and tail >light in the same assembly but with one element bulbs. True on 99.9% of Land-Rovers you find. Tail/stop is dual filament, turn signal, single filament. >Oh by the >way the wire from the back to the front was only three wire. Tail >and brake light and a spare. As yet I can't figure out how the >turn signals worked. The turn signals are factory installed, for >what it's worth. And this is what makes me think you had the alternate type of signals. If I am right, then these three wires were not tail, brake, and spare, but tail, right brake, and left brake. Hopefully, you have your original turn signal switch. Switches for separate turn signal lamps will have three terminals on the back. Again, if my suspicions are right, your switch has more than three. Here's how it goes: on the way from the brake light switch to the bulb, the circuit first stops off at the turn signal switch where it is split into left and right brake light, then goes to the respective bulbs. When you switch for a turn, the appropriate brake light circuit is interrupted, and the blinking circuit is sent to the brake light. The switch will have separate terminals for front lamps, and perhaps the dash indicator light. > >Any way, send all non-destructive ideas to me, pleeeease, I been >without a Rover so long, don't know which way is up!!!!! > > >Roy - Sticking pins in the voodoo doll of George Lucas out on > the Rockie Mountain Front. I'll try to find diagrams tonight (Monday); got a FAX number? Randy rsrose@iago.caltech.edu '57 Series I, with separate turn signal lamps. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 18:03:32 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 15:53:12 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu, lro@transfer.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owners@apple.com, FORUM@apple.com Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? X-Status: Status: RO In message <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> writes: > OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they > used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. > > They were about 15 x 12 inches. They had a cork to > plug the opening and a rope handle. You would fill > the bag with water and drape it over a radiator cap. > The canvas would get wet and the evaporation (and the > fan action would help too) would cause the water to > cool. I remember being out in 100 f sunshine and the > water was so-o-o cold you could barely drink it. > > Anyway, I want one of those bags for the Utah expedition. > I think it would look proper on the grill of a SIIa 88. > > Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am > wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might > obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. > > Thanks in advance... > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 > > - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) > - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) > - 80 MGB - xx > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ray, I got mine 5 or 6 years ago at McGukins (SP?) hardware store in Bolder CO. It is the BEST hardware store I have ever seen. They do mail order. So you can call information, get their phone number & order one over the phone, assuming they still carry it. You will need a place to hang it from. I have a bonnet hold down on the center front of my car & that worked fine after shortening the rope handle. Good luck finding one. TeriAnn TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 19:07:15 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 08:46:21 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: LRO@team.net, Malcolm956@aol.com Subject: Re: Water Pumps X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 480 X-Status: Status: RO > > I would appreciate comments > -about the relative merits of installing a rebuilt pump (ca $120) v. putting > in the seals, et al, (ca $60). > -do I really have to start by taking out the radiator? > I carry a water pump rebuild kit in the tool box. I've only had to do it once, in the field*, but it's easy. You do not have to remove the radiator. *In the street in front of my In-Laws (well, it was more entertaining than a Giants game on TV.) Regards, Bill G. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 20:19:34 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: canvas water bags To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 10:45:11 +0930 (CST) Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> from "ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu" at Aug 1, 94 01:39:22 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 306 X-Status: Status: RO > Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might > obtain one, (a canvas water bag that is) Ray if all else fails they are readily availible down under. Can still get the big round ones (~25+ litres) that you hang under a tree. Just a thought. -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 00:15:12 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: up again From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Mon, 01 Aug 94 23:31:37 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Well its monday night and the info dam has finally broken and we have gotten out of the weekend drought here. Craig in OZ mentions the Dsicovery air bag video! WHAT A SCREAM!!! they showed this baby to the press here at the Discovery Launch in canada in May and the press coulndt beleive the abuse that vehcil;e was subjected to. Man they really tried everything just like Craig said. It was kind of like how you expect every rental car gets treated!! It seemed to be the same vehicle the whole way through the video. Robin Craig Ottawa, Ontario, Canada -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 02:23:50 1994 To: land-rover-owner@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 08:18:06 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO >> * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? >Too much winch is better than not enough, and one that works both ways is better >than one that only pulls. Other than that you can just check the yellow pages & >all the off road equipment places you cn find. Not everyone has RN's markup. I reckon that hand winches are the best. Cheap adn more versatile. The thing that has always bothered me is that most power winches are mounted on the front. Now, unless you habitually drive into place you are likely to get stuck backwards............... The problem arises when you are bogged and cant reroute the winch to the rear. A hand winch clips on anywhere and pulls in any direction. They can also be used for other things away from the presence of the lorry. A high lift jack can also be used as a winch (or even at a pinch, as a high lift jack....) Sadly my hand winch is a cheapo crap job for a fiver from a market stall. It's done the job to date, but bending it back into shape is disturbing and I'd quite like a proper one - anyone know any details in teh UK? From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 19:04:10 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 16:58:33 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: LROVER@u.washington.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Fairey Overdrive X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 627 X-Status: Status: RO >Hum...Toro O/D ? I have not heard of that brand How much$ and were? >Sincerely, >Benjamin J. Freeman Toro overdrives are (were) a close copy of the Fairey, but the case is a little bigger, so they hold more oil. I was told that the sycro is a Range Rover part. They were sold in the US by DAP (and ?) a few years back. I don't know if they are still made or not, but believe they were made by Bearmach. Price was comparable to the F brand. Mine works fine in all gears and I use it in low range also. No problems. except the oil transfer thing that I have outlined, and seemed to have cured with venting. Regards, Bill G. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 04:46:30 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 11:42:43 GMT+0200 Subject: Re:Land Rover Owner at last -- Winches Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > >> * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? > > >Too much winch is better than not enough, and one that works both ways is better > >than one that only pulls. Other than that you can just check the yellow pages & > >all the off road equipment places you cn find. Not everyone has RN's markup. > > I reckon that hand winches are the best. Cheap adn more versatile. The thing > that has always bothered me is that most power winches are mounted on the > front. Now, unless you habitually drive into place you are likely to get stuck > backwards............... > > The problem arises when you are bogged and cant reroute the winch to the rear. > A hand winch clips on anywhere and pulls in any direction. > > They can also be used for other things away from the presence of the lorry. > > A high lift jack can also be used as a winch (or even at a pinch, as a high > lift jack....) > > Sadly my hand winch is a cheapo crap job for a fiver from a market stall. It's > done the job to date, but bending it back into shape is disturbing and I'd > quite like a proper one - anyone know any details in teh UK? Just to add two cents.... The quality\performance of the winch is one thing, but to my mind another critical issue is the quality of the actual winch *rope*. Ropes that have either (a) seen better days or (b) which are used at fairly acute angles (often with abrasion over rocks\earth or tree trunks) can and do fail catastrophically -- the whip-back effect of a snapped tow rope under severe load has to be witnessed to be believed -- and if one's tender shrinking body's in the way....... Moral of the story is that even with an el cheapo winch, make sure that the rope is in top-notch condition, is operated within its strain tolerance, and that there is adequate clearance people-wise in case of failure. Personally, I feel that a good quality winch will allow for remote control operation either by an operator standing well out to one side or from within the cab taking directions from a well-clear external observer. In either instance, when using the winch it is I think a jolly sensible thing to raise the hood\bonnet to shield the windscreen\cab in case of rope failure. Cheers, Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 08:20:50 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 09:15:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Harry Greenspun Subject: Aftermarket products for Disco? To: Land Rover BBS Cc: Guy Kawasaki Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 517 X-Status: Status: RO While I'm waiting for my 5-speed Disco to arrive, I'm pondering accessories. Two questions: 1. Is it possible to get aftermarket rear (jump) seats? Since I'm already paying full MSRP for the Disco, the thought of shelling out over $1000 to the dealer for rear seats makes me woozy. 2. Any recommendations on a brush bar? Atlantic-British sells one ($400) which they claim is air-bag compatible (like the OEM bar- $900!). D.A.P. sent the Bearmach brochure. Any suggestions? Thanks. Harry From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 18:10:27 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last To: lro@team.net Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 9:00:53 EST In-Reply-To: from "To:lro@team.net" at Aug 1, 94 1:57 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? One other suggestion I remembered last night, buy a hand winch first, like a turfor, a power winch mounted on the front of a vehicle is going to be no good if you have to pull your self out backwards, or sideways. ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 09:43:20 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 10:30:00 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: jhong@haiku.com (John Hong) Subject: TeriAnn sums it up X-Status: Status: RO TeriAnn writes: >You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of time. >If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. >Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new 4X4. >But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering about >exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. >Before you purchase one, just understand that it is a commitment of time for >maintnenece,$$ for parts, you will have to learn more than you think to keep it >going (or have lots of $$ and a regular Land Rover doctor that you visit >monthly). They are noisy, primitive, slow, and go through fluids. >They are not for normal people. This is the best summation of the rover experience I have ever read. TeriAnn, are we allowed to redistribute "The Manifesto" with attribution? IT made my day. I'm so glad you and NotAJeep Denis decided to stay on the list. My rover is really hurting for a frameup and general overhaul - keeping up with all the bandaid maintenance is really trying. But I'm not giving up! I CAN FIX IT! In the vein of rover strange/obsessive behavior - if I had to choose between secure garage space for a year or a nice girlfriend for a year - I'd have a hard time deciding - mind you, if the garage was heated and had a floor drain it would be EASY! :) Well anyway, I'm off to the West Coast for a quick trip starting tomorrow - if any of you WC LRO-listers see a Korean guy in a boring rental car with a bat fastard sticker waving at you...cover your floor drain. John Hong (jhong@haiku.com 617-625-9469 voice 623-5253 fax) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 12:48:36 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Cookin' _ON_ the road From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 09:32:20 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Stevens writes: > I've been following the thread about the Land Rover's cooking abilities. > (And perhaps, to tie in the thread about mileage, the figures should be > given in mpg: meals per gallon) :-) However, it must be born in mind that the Land Rover is probably not the best vehicle for getting those smaller snacks while out on the road. Its excessive ground clearence insures that you will need a large BBQ to handle all of the good stuff you happen across. > As a sidebar, there was, a couple of years ago, another cookbook for > would-be road chefs, titled something like "The Roadkill Cookbook". I > gather it was half tongue-in-cheek, half serious. I seem to recall one > chapter entitled "Identifying your dinner at 50 miles per hour." The book got a lot of press. Identifying the little buggers, determining if they were fresh enough to pick up, determining age, etc. were all part of the book. Rather amusing read. > This presupposes that someone will do you the honors of "hunting up" and > laying out dinner for you. Although if you're going to run into moose on > the hoof on the hiway, it would appear from the Rover meets Brick Wall > thread that a Landy is the best vehicle in which to fetch venison. It was in a 1991 Rovers North newsletter (I believe the year is right) that there was a photo of a Land Rover that hit a moose. The Land Rover was a bit crushed looking in the front, but still drivable. > Bon appetite Out on the prairies it must not be as much fun hitting dinner. All of those wide fields enable you to see the critters coming. You will have to come out east where there is a thrill of driving down country lanes, through the wooded sections, and having dinner leap right in front of you. Makes you react fast, especially if you are in an Austin Mini and a dozen suddenly appear... Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 10:50:50 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 08:40:59 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net, mfredett@ichips.intel.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: ABF leak, Portland X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408012237.PAA26588@pacific.pacific.net> Granville Pool writes: uld that be a part of the registration fee as would the public one? > > 2. What sort of picture is appropriate for the program, a portrait or > an action shot? Inasmuch as it is a Land-Rover, I lean toward an action > shot. What do you think? I'm trying to find a copy of the picture of my Land Rover that appeared in the Rover's North Working Rovers section. Its the back of my car with the tail gate down and a bunch of dairy goats disembarking. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 14:16:26 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Substitute for Air Locker From: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Dale Desprey) Reply-To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 11:13:58 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO I saw a post awhile back, either from NZ or OZ, about products comparable to ARB Air Lockers, but stronger, simple and less expensive. Somehow, I lost track of the thread. Any information that you may have about these products would be greatly appreciated. Dale Desprey -- Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 11:54:20 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 09:46:13 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: jhong@haiku.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: TeriAnn sums it up X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408021430.KAA04269@zork.tiac.net> John Hong writes: > TeriAnn writes: > > >You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of > time. > >If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. > > >Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new > 4X4. > > >But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering > about > >exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. > > >Before you purchase one, just understand that it is a commitment of time for > > >maintnenece,$$ for parts, you will have to learn more than you think to keep > it > >going (or have lots of $$ and a regular Land Rover doctor that you visit > >monthly). They are noisy, primitive, slow, and go through fluids. > > >They are not for normal people. > > This is the best summation of the rover experience I have ever read. > TeriAnn, are we allowed to redistribute "The Manifesto" with attribution? > IT made my day. I'm so glad you and NotAJeep Denis decided to stay on the > list. > > My rover is really hurting for a frameup and general overhaul - keeping up > with all the bandaid maintenance is really trying. But I'm not giving up! I > CAN FIX IT! In the vein of rover strange/obsessive behavior - if I had to > choose between > secure garage space for a year or a nice girlfriend for a year - I'd have a > hard time deciding - mind you, if the garage was heated and had a floor > drain it would be EASY! :) > > Well anyway, I'm off to the West Coast for a quick trip starting tomorrow - > if any of you WC LRO-listers see a Korean guy in a boring rental car with a > bat fastard sticker waving at you...cover your floor drain. > > > John Hong > (jhong@haiku.com 617-625-9469 voice 623-5253 fax) > John, Please feel free to use it. An attribution would be nice but since so many of my statements seem to get into general circulation like my long ago "Land Rovers are built to withstand the charge of a bull rino and be rebuilt in the jungle with a screwdriver and a crescent wrench". For me the decision would be much easier.. A boyfriend who would like nothing better to do than work on my cars while I drove them would be much better than a garage. But as it is I have never had the time to do the upkeep on a boyfriend and my British cars. Therefore a garage would come in handy. Speeking of bat fastard... have you personally seen the cubby box they make that goes in between the front two seats? It looks cheap in their advertizment, but it looks like the largest commercial one available. Do you have any opinions? Take care, TeriAnn TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 18:29:35 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 18:22:11 -0500 (CDT) Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) In-Reply-To: from "Dale Desprey" at Aug 2, 94 11:10:43 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1312 X-Status: Status: RO Dale Desprey was bold enough to point out... >These are available new, at Sir Plus. They have a plastic cap instead of >a cork. Also the cord doesn't last very long. If you can't find one >locally, let me know. > Get to me a city where Sir Plus is located. I can call directory assistance to get a phone number. Thanks. TerriAnne's Boulder contact is good, but they are temporarily out of stock. Apparently they are selling like hotcakes. They had a mini (10x10) in stock but not the larger (12x18 est). It is so refreshing to talk to someone that knows what I am talking about. I must have drop-ped into about 20-30 red-neck missouri hardware stores and the blank stares (by the 40 and under) is dis-concerning. The over 40 know what I am talking about but they don't give a damn. Anyway, Boulder (yes, it is McGukins) is going to call me back tomorrow. If they have problems, the Sir Plus backup might be handy. I will keep netters informed... Thanks, ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 22:18:17 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: Substitute for Air Locker To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 11:37:19 +0930 (CST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "Dale Desprey" at Aug 2, 94 11:13:58 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2082 X-Status: Status: RO Dale writes: > I saw a post awhile back, either from NZ or OZ, about products comparable > to ARB Air Lockers, but stronger, simple and less expensive. Somehow, I > lost track of the thread. Any information that you may have about these > products would be greatly appreciated. You are probably thinking of the Jack MacNamara products. They advertise in LRO I think. They make a manually activated diff lock for the rear axle. ( you have to get out and wind a bolt fitted to a modified axle.) from what i've seen these things work great and arent too expensive, They are also in keeping with the somewhat primitive appeal of older Land-Rovers :-) MacNamaras also make cabin activated diff locks now. Craig Murray mentioned Mal Story's Maxi-drive diff locks. These things are certainly good but he used to insist on fitting stage I V8 type CV joints in place of the uni-joints in the ball swivels if you wanted a front diff lock. This added nearly $1K to the cost of the kit way back in 1988 ( no I couldnt afford it then either) It is possible to use toyota CV's and have mal re-spline the toyota axles to save some dollars but you need a very specific toyota axle. A friend spent ages running around wrecking yards with a micrometer until he found the right ones. Hey I can replace an awful lot of standard axles for ~$1K For 10/10ths work the Maxi-drives are probably the strongest of the in-car actuation types, (though I havent seen the later MacNamara in-car lockers) In all likely hood both of these would be stronger than the ARB air-lockers, mainly due to strengthened axles supplied with the kits. For simple "get out of trouble" diff locks the manual MacNamaras take some beating. For the real hard cases with salisbury type diffs, You can get a No-Spin Detroit locker, but be prepared to rethink your driving style on loose dirt roads. (yes you can do power turns in a landy with a holden GM 3.3lL 6cyl and a detroit locker) Craig can probably fill in most of the bits I've forgotten :-) -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 21:38:18 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: Hot plate To: BENHAM@wfoclan.usbm.gov (John R. Benham) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 12:01:31 +0930 (CST) Cc: LRO@Team.net In-Reply-To: <30F38123F68@wfoclan.usbm.gov> from "John R. Benham" at Aug 2, 94 08:35:41 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 510 X-Status: Status: RO John Benham writes:> Dear LRO's, > My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around > the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles > on my Clark Wallabees!! I use 10mm eva-zote like close cell foam (you know like sleeping mats) Certainly helps. Throw a heavy rubber mat on top and wa-la warm but not fried feet. Cheap easy and fire-hosable! Be warned when water gets under the foam it becomes slippery as all get out. Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 18:08:27 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: wc@lady.ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (William Carter), lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 15:56:14 +1100 Subject: Re: Disco fever X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO William, What is a Rhino package and how can you get to an accuracy of a thousanths of a minute of latitude and longitude? John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 15:23:53 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 13:14:09 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: land-rover-owner@team.net, PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU Subject: Re: off center steering X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 919 X-Status: Status: RO > > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > Rgds, > Joseph Adjust the lenth of one of the two steering rods that attach to the steering relay. Either one will do it, but not the one between the wheels, that ones for the toe-in. Just loosen the clamp, spray WD-40 or ? on the threads at both ends, turn the rod once or twice, drive, to see how far off you went, in the wrong direction (of course), correct, tighten clamp. No sweat. R, bg PS; It doesn't make the thing turn more one way than the other. It just changes where the steering wheel spokes are. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 02:26:45 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: fast Rover, dead Rover To: sinasohn@crl.com (Roger Sinasohn) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 01:19:19 -0600 (MDT) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199407071444.AA00680@crl2.crl.com> from "Roger Sinasohn" at Jul 7, 94 07:44:55 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 904 X-Status: Status: RO Ages ago, Uncle Roger wrote: < T. F. Mills writes: < < > Speaking as the owner of the fastest Rover in the West (1966 109"), < > I'd say don't even think of getting by without overdrive if you plan < > on much highway driving... < How fast does yours go? What kind of engine do you have? My '59 109" < cruises comfortably at about 70; I could probably get it up to 75 on a < steep downhill. I know of a guy with a V-8 in a sIII 88" that has < reportedly done over 100mph. I'm sorry you asked. That's the price for boasting. I now have the slowest Rover in the West. Tranny fell apart. But in the good old days, my 4cyl with Weber could get up to about 85 on the flats (according to the speedometer of an accompanying car since mine is off). T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 01:31:19 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 08:32:48 GMT+0200 Subject: Re: Spare tire mounting Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > I am a new owner and this may be a nutty question, but what is the > best place for the spare? My 88" has mounting plates on the bonnet (current > mount), the rear door, and behind the front seats? The bonnet is convenient, > but hampers visibility and makes the bonnet a real chore to open. Thanks!! Aaaah, the eternal problem!! 1. Mount it on the bonnet and you encounter the snags mentioned above -- plus extra wind resistance? 2. Mount it on the back door and watch the hinges and frame slowly crack. 3. Mount it behind the seats and watch the load space disappear. 4. Put it up on the roof-rack and require physio-therepy after hefting it around. Hobson's choice? On the bonnet is perhaps the best option -- at least that way you can have a cover made up and the "well" inside the rim can be used for an extra storage space. Next is perhaps the back-door -- this is certainly the most convenient. Two local South African "mods" might be of interest tho if you've got some metalworking skills... 1. Make up a mounting frame that can bolt onto a seat box and body side panel in the loadbed. The wheel stands vertically on top of the box parallel with the side of the Landie. This works well and takes up relatively little space. It also helps keep the wheel somewhat protected from light fingered gentry in the case of a hardtop body. 2. A bit more sophisticated is to make up a swivelling mounting bracket that is firmly attached to the rear of the Landie. It takes the form of two brackets with a spindle onto which is welded a swinging arm that actually takes the tyre. The two brackets mount firmly onto the rear of the chassis and loadbed rail just central to the rear lights. The wheel is mounted on the swinging arm which is "locked" across the rear door by a (or the) tailgate-type pin. Very strong and rigid, takes up no space and is really a sensible development of the el cheapo Landie tyre-on-back-door arrangement. The only snag (such as it is) is that in order to open the rear door it is 1st necessary to unlatch the tyre swinging mounting and swing it out the way. A bit difficult to describe in words, but hopefully the principle is lucid!! Cheerio, Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 10:14:07 1994 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 10:58:23 LCL From: Joseph Broach Subject: off center steering To: land-rover-owner@team.net X-Status: Status: RO My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. Any ideas on how to correct this?? Rgds, Joseph From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 09:18:18 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: Ready for Colorado To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 7:08:03 MDT X-Status: Status: RO I finally got the R-rover ready for the pilgrimage to Colorado. I change the transfer, and transmission fluids, and filter . To get the pan off one has to drop the front y exhaust pipe, unbolt the removable cross member, and presto you can get the transmission pan off. I had a real tough time with one of the exhaust bolts. It wasn't corroded, I used penetrating oil, but it would not budge. So I got serious. I got the new torque wrench (long handle) put both feet on the frame, strained a few sinews, but loosened that nut welded to the hanger. I could not figure out why it was so tough to snap a quarter/twenty size bolt..... oh well. I also broke a stud on the collar on the Y pipe connecting to the muffler. (TeriAnn if you are looking for a super stud, this was it.) It was tough. The collar is un-removable, so you have to work with it attached to the y pipe. It would not press out, (heated) hammer out, and I had a tough time drilling it out. I have noticed that the transfer case on the R-Rover is tough on the fluids, I have been changing mine every 15K miles. This time I bought some amsoil synthetic from RN, and after the change, I swear the transfer case is quieter. Well Saturday is the big day, load up and head west. I wonder how well those canvas water bags work with ice tea. I could just picture boiling your canvas water bag for hot tea, if you ran out. See ya in Colorado. Russ Still no real name for the rover. Maybe roper..... From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 10:07:13 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 09:55:52 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Product Info - McNamara Diffs X-Status: Status: RO Hope this is of some interest - Jack McNamara Differential Specialist 25 Levanswell Rd. Moorabbin 3189 Victoria, Australia std. 03 555 2213 isd (?) 613 555 2213 fax 555 0251 They make a variety of differential enhancements some of which I listed below. Heavy Duty Diff centre - hypoid design, larger pinion gear set, ratios - 3.54, 3.73, 3.9, 4.1, 4.3, 4.375, 4.55, 4.71, 4.875, 5.2 - 4 pinion carrier - with 10 spline side gear (to fit standard rover axles). A$1400 Heavy Duty Diff centre as above with salisbury axles (either front or rear) A$1600 Heavy Duty Diff centre with Detroit Locker - no axles A$1700 Front Diff Strengthening Kit - 4 pinion carrier - inner salisbury axles either Burfield or Uni-joint. A$590 Rear Diff Strengthening Kit - 4 pinion carrier and salisbury rear axles (which use standard salisbury drive flanges). A$590 Rear Diff Lock Kit (manual locking) - same as above but includes locking aparatus (includes one salisbury drive flange with a threaded cover - under cover is bolt - remove bolt and spring loaded axle slides into splined cross shaft.) A$720 Vacumn Diff Lock - diff assembled with new vacumn diff lock and salisbury axles - Front A$2400 - Rear A$2500 They appear to do a lot of custom work - larger axles - and so on. They also mention a Nissan 4 or 5 speed gearbox transplant (mounts to Rover transfer box). If you want more info let me know. I do have their literature. Best- Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 11:24:04 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: off center steering To: PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU (Joseph Broach) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 17:04:24 BST Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199408031504.LAA28173@transfer.stratus.com>; from "Joseph Broach" at Aug 3, 94 10:58 am X-Status: Status: RO > > > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > Rgds, > Joseph > Remove the steering wheel and put it back centrally,with the wheels straight ahead. Cheers Mike Rooth From fourfold!dd@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Wed Aug 3 13:09:28 1994 To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? From: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Dale Desprey) Reply-To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 11:36:00 -0500 In-Reply-To: <9408022322.AA16360@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu writes: > Get to me a city where Sir Plus is located. I can call directory > assistance to get a phone number. Thanks. > > TerriAnne's Boulder contact is good, but they are temporarily > out of stock. Apparently they are selling like hotcakes. They > had a mini (10x10) in stock but not the larger (12x18 est). It > is so refreshing to talk to someone that knows what I am talking > about. I must have drop-ped into about 20-30 red-neck missouri > hardware stores and the blank stares (by the 40 and under) is > dis-concerning. The over 40 know what I am talking about but > they don't give a damn. > I phoned Sir Plus in Ottawa at (613) 731-4049. I asked about the flaxen water bags they put in front of radiators. She said "What?". Anyway she went to check and said yes, trey are $19.98 Canadian. With our comunistic taxes it brings it to $22.94 Canadian or approx. $16.00 U.S. Then there is shipping, so see if you can get one locally. If you can't, let me know and we can make arrangements to send you one from here. Dale -- Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 12:24:34 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 09:38:09 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU, land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: off center steering X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408031504.LAA28173@transfer.stratus.com> Joseph Broach writes: > > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > Rgds, > Joseph You could always remove the steering wheel and put it back on straight TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 13:26:13 1994 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 1994 13:54:25 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: off center steering X-Status: Status: RO New member Joseph Broach writes about off-center steering... Easy...it's the drag link between the steering box and the steering relay in the front cross member. It's just another tie-rod with opposite threads on each end. Loosen the pinch bolts on each end, jack the front end up, center the wheel, then twist the shaft (lenghten/shorten it) 'til the wheels point right. You may have to do it a time or two 'til you get it exactly right, though. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 22:53:00 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: Spare tire mounting To: lro@team.net Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 13:43:24 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > > > Hi, > > I am a new owner and this may be a nutty question, but what is the > best place for the spare? My 88" has mounting plates on the bonnet (current > mount), the rear door, and behind the front seats? The bonnet is convenient, > but hampers visibility and makes the bonnet a real chore to open. Thanks!! > I would prefer to have it either on the rear door, or mounted behind the front seats, if you carry passengers in the back, it might be a bit annoying for them if you have it the back. Having it on the rear door, I beleive strains the hinges, and would mount a third hinge, if not already there. Just my 2 bits worth. ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 14:00:36 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 11:52:51 PDT From: wc@lady.ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (William Carter) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Disco fever X-Status: Status: RO It may be that I'm showing my age (48), or just the results of an "active life-style"...But. Let me back up to last week. My room mate, a frend of about 30 years, had his 88 series III break-down out side of Salt Lake City on his way to Laramie, WO. from here, Berkeley, CA. As he had just begun a month long vacation and was on his way to visit his girl frend he didn't take the time to fix the car, but instead bought a new Discovery. I am smitten! I am a second generation Land Rover/Rover owner. I am on my third Land Rover, the ultimate vehicle and the last car I thought I'd ever own. It's everything I've wanted. IIA LWB van/camper w/ a tail gate so I can lay in bed with an open window on the world. Full rhino package. Toilet, stove, and the kitchen sink. I traded a hood with Scotty, so the one I have came from one of my dad's old Rovers. It's outta here, history, 4 sale cheap! I'm going for a (automatic aargh...) Disco and a small Airstream. Anybody out there got some plastic flamingos (camo-colored prefered) to sell? Lawn chairs or decent umbrella table? -- | William Carter, Inventor Ph# (510) 548-3115 | | Internet: wc@lady.berkeley.edu FAX (510) 644-4471 | | N 37-51.147' x W 122-16.322', Apt. B (WGS 84) | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 15:43:02 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 13:33:06 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: wc@lady.ICSI.Berkeley.EDU, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Disco fever X-Status: Status: RO In message <9408031852.AA02575@lady.berkeley.edu> William Carter writes: > > > > It may be that I'm showing my age (48), or just the results > of an "active life-style"...But. Let me back up to last week. > My room mate, a frend of about 30 years, had his 88 series III > break-down out side of Salt Lake City on his way to Laramie, WO. > from here, Berkeley, CA. As he had just begun a month long > vacation and was on his way to visit his girl frend he didn't > take the time to fix the car, but instead bought a new Discovery. > I am smitten! > I am a second generation Land Rover/Rover owner. I am on my third > Land Rover, the ultimate vehicle and the last car I thought I'd > ever own. It's everything I've wanted. IIA LWB van/camper w/ a > tail gate so I can lay in bed with an open window on the world. > Full rhino package. Toilet, stove, and the kitchen sink. I traded > a hood with Scotty, so the one I have came from one of my dad's > old Rovers. > It's outta here, history, 4 sale cheap! > I'm going for a (automatic aargh...) Disco and a small Airstream. > Anybody out there got some plastic flamingos (camo-colored prefered) > to sell? Lawn chairs or decent umbrella table? > > > -- > | William Carter, Inventor Ph# (510) 548-3115 | > > | Internet: wc@lady.berkeley.edu FAX (510) 644-4471 | > | N 37-51.147' x W 122-16.322', Apt. B (WGS 84) | So whats being 48 got to do with anything. Many of us are that age. Whats a rino package? I'm also curious about how you have your car set up as a camper. Every time I go out & think about how to make things fit they won't Its been driving me crazy. I end up with no toilet the ice chest and bed inside and everything else outside when in use. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 16:23:20 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 17:11:32 EST To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" , lro@stratus.com Subject: Re[2]: Disco fever Content-Length: 201 X-Status: Status: RO > I end up with no toilet the ice chest and bed inside and everything else > outside when in use. TeriAnn, what do you mean no toilet. The toilet's outside with everything else, right? ;-) Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 18:19:06 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 15:29:25 PDT From: mark@zelda.nwra.com (Mark Baldwin) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: subscribe X-Status: Status: RO SUBSRCIBE From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 20:24:45 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 15:52:19 -0800 To: lro@stratus.com From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) Subject: insanity? X-Status: Status: RO TerriAnn thought this would be a nice intro for the group. She also was of the opinion that I qualify for Land Rover Owner status. Thanks. TerriAnn, I was going to post this, but it got too long. I appreciate the truthful (non sugar coated) advice. I will probably get a LR soon. Hello all, I posed a bunch of questions last week and have been greatful for the responses. In particular, TerriAnn really set me straight when she wrote: These old Land Rovers are noisy as all get out, get poor gas milage (my poll shouws about 12-13 MPG, slow (I get treated as a stationary object by everyone else when I on the road), and requires you to spend lots of time checking fluids. You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of time. If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new 4X4. But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering about exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. end quote. Not to waste bandwidth, but to sort of share the "joy", I will say that I own a 1964 Sunbeam Tiger. I got it from my Tiger guru (who I will now plug) Norman Miller on Main St. Redwood City (Rootes Group Depot, 415-364-1965). He refurbished/restored a car that I eventually bought. In the four years I've had it, I've pulled the engine and had two pistons replaced because it just wasn't rebuilt right. I've rebuilt the clutch master cylinder twice and the brake master once. I rebuilt with a good dose of help from Norm, the brake booster. I've checked out a couple of electrical things, fixed a couple of small oil leaks, had the radiator recored and recently put on a new fan to aid cooling. Quite a few people wouldn't put up with this but I do. The car is now running better than ever in the sense that it stays cool when the air temp is >90. However, having a tiger that runs well is NOT like having a new car. The heater doesn't work at all. No A/C. No radio. Engine heat comes off the transmission tunnel that would I'm sure cook the feet of most Land Rover owners. We joke that we have a 260 cu in heater. The combination of california summer road heat, sun and engine heat makes stopping feel like a real relief! However, all this is in my mind worth it. The car is great; small, great visiblity and it goes smoothly and quickly whenever you push the gas. Driving anywhere will put a smile on my face. Like you Land Rover folks, I carry a set of tools with some spare bits in the trunk under the false bottom. However, I've never had to do any work on the road. Along with all this, since we live in Davis (bike capitol of the US) we ride bikes alot. Mind you, not normal bikes. My wife has an old english Raleigh Tourist with 28" wheel and pushrod brakes. I have a hybrid new/old bike with a Sturmey Archer 5 speed rear hub, not freewheel with derailleur. We are both very happy with these arrangements. Wherever we go out of town, we pop our heads into bike stores and ask about parts or spares, always on the look out for someone who understands this illness for old things. I think a Land Rover would fit into this quite nicely. Bye, John Hess, PhD Phone me 916 752 8420 Dept of Human Anatomy FAX me 916 752 8520 University of Calif Email me jfhess@ucdavis.edu Davis, CA or leave me alone, your choice. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 19:17:18 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 17:06:00 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: lro@stratus.com Subject: POLL- LR camping X-Status: Status: RO Its time for a new poll to help out the LR interior disadvantaged. Question: How do you set your Land Rover up for car camping (specify long or short wheel base). If you have anything built in, please be as descriptive as possible as to what how big (dimensions would be nice) and where. I'll start with my car: 109 two door, safari top, tail gate. camping modifications: Horz 5 gal propane tank under bench between right seat and right rear wheel. Hole cut in side of car with LR tool box lid modified as a lid for the side providing access to the propane tank. Car camping set up: I bungie cord 3 large plastic bens to the right rear bench. Front one hold clothes, middle one sleeping bag & pillow, rear one kitchen stuff. Extra propane bottles for lanterns and kitchen stuff in right rear tool box. Left rear toolbox contains tools, work on car clothes and oil. Above that at left rear is bungie strapped ice cooler (food and film). Bungi corded against back of front seats, plastic tarp, chase lounge pad (AKA bed), folding table, propane stove, folding chair, two five gal. water cans. Not bungi corded, Great pyrenese, dog food, dog food & water dish, old car cover for dog bed & chain for dog. passanger side front floor, two buckets for washing and rinsing dishes, two propane lanterns, one flashlight. On seat, camera gear. When I'm camping all the noncamera gear goes out except bed and ice chest. I set the tanle up fot the stove & kitchen stuff, connect the stove to the inside propane tank. Hang a lantern above the stove & one at the end of the tail gate top. I sleep in the pad in the back of the car. So what does everyone else do?????????????? TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 19:57:56 1994 Date: 03 Aug 94 20:44:06 EDT From: "Stephen O'Hearn" <72700.3262@compuserve.com> To: Land Rover Owner Subject: Land Rover Owner group subscription X-Status: Status: RO SUBSCRIBE From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 20:18:30 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:07:10 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Subscribe X-Status: Status: RO Have not received any mail from the list. Tom responded to my test but I did not get a copy via the list. Please see of I have dropped of the subsciber list. Thanks, Roy - Rovers in the Rockies From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 23:40:30 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 21:32:54 -0700 (PDT) From: James B Russell Subject: Re: Thanks!! To: Joseph Broach Cc: land-rover-owner@team.net In-Reply-To: <199408040347.XAA07134@transfer.stratus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Unless you are exceptionally fortunate you will probably find your Land-Rover will have a typically British tendency to leak fluids. In fact, there are many of us who begin to worry when they don't leak since that usually means there are no longer any fluids to leak out. Don't be concerned about engaged, nuetral, or anything like that but do make it a regular check everything and top off as necessary. Make this a do as I say not as I do since I am far more neglectful than I should be. And if you don't have service manuals, be sure to get them since your local garrage has probably never heard of a Land-Rover let alone have any tech data on them. Consider a parts book too. Enjoy! You are in for a wonderful love/hate relationship. I know -- I have had the same beat up 1966 IIA 88 SW for 18 years now. It is a good and close friend and like a good friend, sometimes they are forgetful (as am I) but we always get over it. Jim Russell ==== jrussell@netcom.com (Seattle -- San Francisco) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 02:57:18 1994 To: lro@stratus.com From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: POLL- LR camping Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 08:49:00 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO >Question: How do you set your Land Rover up for car camping (specify long or >short wheel base). If you have anything built in, please be as descriptive as >possible as to what how big (dimensions would be nice) and where. Minimalist. 90 van. Sunlounger set up along wheelbox and over front bulkhead. Trangia stove (backed up with Osborne or Hobo for the rare occsasions it isnt pissing down). + a few food items in a cardboard box. Plus the essentials of life - a portable telly, adn a ghetto blaster with a set of Shadowfax tapes and some more ripped off from 'Musical Starstreams' on The Breeze (97.9FM) when I was in Salt Lake City. I just treat it as a high security, high comfort tent. I'll be doing this longer term soon since I cant be bothered renting again, so I'll post field reports and mods as they occur to me (at least until the plods hassle me so much I have to rent........Bloody Old-Age-Travellers) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 14:03:53 1994 X-Msmail-Message-Id: A7424C2D X-Msmail-Conversation-Id: A7424C2D From: Edward Balassanian To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 11:42:19 TZ Subject: RE: Subscribe X-Status: Status: RO please remove me from this list. thanks. ---------- | From: ROY CALDWELL | To: | Subject: Subscribe | Date: Wednesday, August 03, 1994 7:07PM | | Received: from transfer.stratus.com by netmail.microsoft.com with SMTP (5.65/25-eef) | id AA21045; Wed, 3 Aug 94 18:19:20 -0700 | Received: from uswat.advtech.uswest.com | (uswat.advtech.uswest.com [130.13.16.1]) by | transfer.stratus.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA00937 for | ; Wed, 3 Aug 1994 21:08:00 -0400 | Received: from centhub (centhub.mnet.uswest.com) by | uswat.advtech.uswest.com with SMTP id AA17654 | (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 3 Aug 1994 19:07:58 -0600 | Received: by centhub.mnet.uswest.com (M-Net Hub.930405) | Received: from mtnoca.helena_noc by nmamail (4.1/SMI-4.1) | id AA28942; Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:05:22 MDT | Received: from ipx4.helena_noc by mtnoca.helena_noc (4.1/SMI-4.1) | id AA10812; Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:07:10 MDT | Message-Id: <9408040107.AA10812@mtnoca.helena_noc> | | | Have not received any mail from the list. | Tom responded to my test but I did not | get a copy via the list. Please see of | I have dropped of the subsciber list. | Thanks, | | Roy - Rovers in the Rockies | | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 14:17:53 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Product Info - McNamara Diffs From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 04 Aug 94 12:53:46 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) writes: > Jack McNamara Differential Specialist > Victoria, Australia For those interested, the Aussie dollar is approximately the same value as the Canadian dollar. $0.7377 US versus $0.7216 US. -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 14:23:45 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: OVLR: August off-road event. Preliminary Details. From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 04 Aug 94 12:58:38 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) writes: > > August brings another OVLR off-road event. > When: At this time there are two proposed starting options. > The current is meeting at Shoppers City West at 8am > and proceeding to Calabogie. The journey is a two > hour trip. As this might cut into time a bit much, the > alternate proposal is to leave Friday evening and camp > at the large pine at the end of the hydro cut. The two > teams would leave from this point. Discussions here have lead to the conclusion that the alternate plan will be pursued. The group will leave at 6pm from the shopping mall at Baseline road and Woodroff avenue. Directions to the camping area can be supplied to those who cannot be ready by the projected departure time. Rgds, -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 14:18:25 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 15:07:56 -0400 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Apparently-To: lro@transfer.stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO Kind Folks- 6-9 months or so ago there was talk on this list about roof racks. One person out there spoke very highly of the Yakima rack system as the best fitting bike/ski/canoe/strappable cargo and _most easily removable_ rack available for LRs. Another spoke highly of the Thule. Both of these racks require "high rise" kits that lift the "raingutter footings" up high enough to clear the roof line on LR hardtops. I have seen neither of these fitted to LRs, but am curious (and am considering a purchase).....are they sturdy?? As I recall, the thule setup was then claimed by one of us to be inferior to the yakima. Too bad for me if this is so, as there are several thule's floating around amoungst my family and all I would *really* need to get would be a high rise kit for the occasional use the rack would see.....if the yakima truely is superior, I'll have to splurge.... Comments and suggestions would be appreciated. Those employed by and/or major stockholders in thule or yakima need not reply. Thanks, rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 15:19:25 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Thu, 04 Aug 94 16:09:54 EST To: "Russell G. Dushin" , lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: No subject given Content-Length: 1164 X-Status: Status: RO Russell, I've used the Thule rack with luggage carrier quite extensively...to a point where I'm more worried about the load capacity of my Volvo roof rather than the rack itself...don't want the rain gutters ripping off and the rack falling onto the sheetmetal...usually happens at an embarrassing point, right? I would believe that the two are rather comparable. I do like the luggage carrier of the Thule as it appears more substantial than the basket carrier of the Yakima. But since you've got access to Thule equipment already, I'd go that route. Of course you'll be horrified to learn what the high riser kits cost, but that's a separate issue. May be cheaper to buy a complete rig, so you might want to check that out... What are you going to carry up there, anyway, more spare tires, LR parts and gas...or collapseable bridges like in the Maya Ruta. I understand those bridges are pretty lightweight... ;-) Of course, YMMV. Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 17:14:15 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 14:09:45 -0800 To: lro@stratus.com From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) Subject: Yakima racks X-Status: Status: RO To everyone, I have a Yakima rack that goes on my Mazda. It grabs on to the rain gutters and if properly attached, I believe I could roll the car by pushing on the rack! We put three bikes on top of the rack, using the mounting arm that leaves both wheels on the bikes and grabs the down tube. Again, very simple and VERY sturdy. Maybe in the future, I'll see how the rack fits on a Land Rover; for now, we call our little Mazda WORKING Mazda because we do everything with it. Newer models have provisions for locks everywhere, we just lock all three bikes together and the rack itself has locks on the attachment points. Don't know about interchangability or Thule racks. John Hess, PhD Phone me 916 752 8420 Dept of Human Anatomy FAX me 916 752 8520 University of Calif Email me jfhess@ucdavis.edu Davis, CA or leave me alone, your choice. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 18:20:27 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 17:09:02 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: test X-Status: Status: RO Sorry for bothering people again. Sysop said we did have some trouble with the mail tool. I want to try this again to see if I can get this returned via the Rover list. Thanks! Roy - Rovers in the Rockies, going into withdrawl with no owners list From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 09:25:24 1994 Date: Fri, 05 Aug 1994 09:41:53 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Roof racks off the rack X-Status: Status: RO The Thule won't fit (I tried), and I doubt that the Yakima will either. The 'long legs' kit for the Thule will clear a regular top by a millimeter or two, but won't clear a tropical roof. Also, the rack legs are intended to angle inwards towards the center of the vehicle, whereas above the rain gutter on a Land Rover, the roof slope is 'pret near vertical, so it throws off the gutter clamps and the cross bar. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 11:00:26 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 11:48:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Harry Greenspun Subject: Re: Roof racks off the rack To: MR ALEXANDER P GRICE Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <013.01067682.CXKS46A@prodigy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 237 X-Status: Status: RO I know that Yakima makes a series of adapters that can be attached directly to the roof (either bolted through or even a "molly" mounting system when the other end can't be accessed). These then accept Yakima rack "feet." Harry From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 11:40:38 1994 Date: Fri, 05 Aug 1994 12:13:24 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Stuck up Disco Owners? To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Last week a coworker told me that there was a Discovery in the parking lot of our 2 building complex. I made copies of The Gearbox and OVLR, jotted a note with my name and extension, and slipped it under the wiper (I gave it a good look - teal, dual sunroofs, auto, alarm - did not touch). A week later and not even a thank you. It looks like the average Discovery owner is just about as friendly as the average Range Rover owner (netters excluded). I guess I won't be waving to them either. On the plus side one of the managers that I work with just ordered a Discovery and said the waiting list at the Parsippany NJ dealer is 82 people and 3 months long. He also checked out the Philadelphia dealer and the wait was also 80+ long. This fellow is very amiable and was delighted to get the articles I copied for him. I wish I had enough bucks to do one myself. It is a really nice vehicle. The only way would be to sell both Rovers and go into hoc. I would never do the former. I'd wait for the 300 TDI, however. I replaced the heat sheild on my 88 last weekend after leaving it off for a couple of weeks. I left it off to allow the new manifold gasket to bed in and allow me to tighten it down a couple of times. My toes are noticably cooler. Enough baloney from maloney. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 13:51:23 1994 Date: Fri, 05 Aug 94 10:24:50 MST From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV To: lro@team.net Subject: Undeliverable Mail X-Status: Status: RO *** Resending note of 08/05/94 10:22 FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: LR Discovery concern... Bill writes: >Last week a coworker told me that there was a Discovery in the parking lot of >our 2 building complex. I made copies of The Gearbox and OVLR.... What are "The Gearbox and OVL"? Can I get a copy e-mailed to me? If so, I'm at: debrown@srp.gov Also, a SERIOUS question about Land Rover Discovery... Does anyone have any hard facts or statistics on the reliability of the Discovery? I understand they've been sold in the UK for several years, and I'm VERY interested in purchasing one, but "everyone" I talk to advises to stay away from Land Rovers, citing reliability problems and expense of repair. (Note, I haven't found actual LR owners to talk with, only non-owners.) Please help me!!! Last night I even looked at a (sigh...) Toyota Land Cruiser, nice ride, but not much power, no rear A/C and a sticker price of $41K. Gulp!! Very high quality though... Also, the ground clearance of the "T" vehicle was over 2 inches more. Isn't the ground clearance important in off roading? I'm not very experienced yet, but want to do a lot, and want a reliable truck that will last a very minimum or 15 years. Again, are there any reports or articles that I could obtain about the LR (particularly the Discovery) reliability, customer satisfaction, recalls, problems per 1000 vehicles, etc... Please help me. Thanks, From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 12:39:23 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 10:30:47 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: lro@stratus.com, mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk Subject: Re: Night shift for Defender X-Status: Status: RO Great news!! I had previously read somewhere in the automotive press some doubt expressed about Land Rover's commitment to the Defender, so it's good to hear they are looking after the vehicle that gave them their current reputation. John Brabyn Mill Valley Ca 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 12:52:04 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 13:34:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: Re[2]: Roof racks off the rack To: llevitt@idcresearch.com Cc: CXKS46A@prodigy.com, Harry Greenspun , land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9407057761.AA776114278@ccmailin.idcresearch.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO I have used the Thule false gutters to put racks on the fiberglass roof of the VW Westfailia camper...I think the number is 341 in the Thule system...the gutter needs to be mounted nearly vertical to work well,and I don't see how you would get enough clearance with a tropical roof...I'll look 'em both over tonight and see if it can be done...BTW...I've seen a rover roof rack that was sold as an original accesory that had the legs going through holes in the tropical roof....I'll bet there is someone out there on the net who wondered what those 4 nice round holes were for....now you know....the dealer put them there..... steve...... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 13:13:56 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 10:58:16 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: llevitt@idcresearch.com, lro@stratus.com, mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk Subject: Re: Night shift for Defender X-Status: Status: RO 'How about organizing a management buyout or other takeover of Land Rover -- the only decent division of Rover/BMW etc??? From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 12:18:12 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 18:02:20 +0000 From: mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk (Martin Farrall) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Night shift for Defender X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 343 X-Status: Status: RO You may be interested to note that the Solihull factory has introduced it's first ever night shift production line for making the Defender range as a consequence of increasing demand. The Discovery line has had a night shift for some time now for the same reason. Keep on buying those Land Rovers and keep a Midlander happy! Martin Farrall From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 13:14:40 1994 Date: Fri, 05 Aug 94 11:04:50 MST From: DEBROWN@srp.gov To: lro@team.net Subject: LR Discovery question/concern... X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: LR Discovery question/concern... Bill writes: >Last week a coworker told me that there was a Discovery in the parking lot of >our 2 building complex. I made copies of The Gearbox and OVLR.... What are "The Gearbox and OVL"? Can I get a copy e-mailed to me? If so, I'm at: debrown@srp.gov Also, a SERIOUS question about Land Rover Discovery... Does anyone have any hard facts or statistics on the reliability of the Discovery? I understand they've been sold in the UK for several years, and I'm VERY interested in purchasing one, but "everyone" I talk to advises to stay away from Land Rovers, citing reliability problems and expense of repair. (Note, I haven't found actual LR owners to talk with, only non-owners.) Please help me!!! Last night I even looked at a (sigh...) Toyota Land Cruiser, nice ride, but not much power, no rear A/C and a sticker price of $41K. Gulp!! Very high quality though... Also, the ground clearance of the "T" vehicle was over 2 inches more. Isn't the ground clearance important in off roading? I'm not very experienced yet, but want to do a lot, and want a reliable truck that will last a very minimum or 15 years. Again, are there any reports or articles that I could obtain about the LR (particularly the Discovery) reliability, customer satisfaction, recalls, problems per 1000 vehicles, etc... Please help me. Thanks, *** **** **** "Some men see things as they are and say why? * * * * * I see things as they never were and say why not?" * **** **** *** * * * -Robert Frost From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 12:42:18 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Fri, 05 Aug 94 13:35:22 EST To: lro@stratus.com, mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk (Martin Farrall) Subject: Re: Night shift for Defender Content-Length: 496 X-Status: Status: RO Just thought you'd like to know. In yesterday's Wall Street Journal, total US sales were listed for most manufacturers, including LR. LR is up 200% year to date as compared to last year. Looks like they're on a run rate to sell between 12-15,000 Land Rovers here in the US in calendar 1994, compared to about 5000 last year. So is the Disco doing well? Absolutely! Could they sell more if they had more? Absolutely! Sounds like Defenders are moving out too... So who needs BMW? ;-) Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 13:47:34 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 11:38:41 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: DEBROWN@srp.gov, lro@team.net Subject: Re: LR Discovery question/concern... X-Status: Status: RO In case nobody else dives into this -- I assume you would have to go to the British version of Consumer Reports for the reliability info. I am sure it will not be up to Toyota standards, but not as bad as earlier British cars. Re the merits of the Big "T", I haven't driven one but the reports I have read indicate they are a biton the large side for some off-road conditions, but very capable. They may have more ground clearance at the diff, but that's not often a limiting factor in my view. More important are breakover angle (Land Rover wins hands down) and departure angle (assuming decent approach angles which they both have) -- here again the Land RTover is much better, especially if the Toyota has a trailer hitch fitted, as they all seem to, underneath the bumper. They also have the spare tyre hanging down at the back. Regarding ground clearance at the diff -- the Land Rover has both diffs cleverly placed on the same side of the vehicle, so you have high clearance under the driver's side front and rear. This helps a lot in practical negotiation of rocks etc -- you just aim at them! Suspension compliance and travel -- another thing you won't find mentioned in the Toyota sales literature -- Land Rover wins comfortably, obviating the need for the multiple diff locks used in the Toyota. The Land Rover has a shorter wheelbase and a narrower track -- both advantages off road. The Toyota Land Cruiser was the first 4x4 to attempt an imitation of the Range Rover/Discovery/Defender suspension, and is no doubt a pretty good machine. I have never seen it claimed, however, that it is the equal of a Land Rover off road. But if you want a larger vehicle and lower maintenance bills, it's probably an excellent choice. John Brabyn Mill Valley, Ca 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 14:40:57 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 12:29:04 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: lro@stratus.com, mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net Subject: Re: Land-Rover-based Ibex vehicles X-Status: Status: RO I have read an article about the Ibex in a British off road magazine -- I could probably dig it out and fax it if you want it. Basically it is indeed a L coil sprung Rover chassis (2 different wheelbases I believe) with its own aluminum bodywork, bigger tires, etc. and oriented more specifically towards off road use, although the guy who builds them is not a keen off-roader himself. I think it's basically hand made to order, and I forget how much it costs. I remember the approach and departure angles were extreme. Let me know if you'd like more info John Brabyn Mill Valley, Ca 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 16:12:59 1994 X-Sendmail-Version: 8.6.9 X-Authentication-Info: costales@localhost From: costales@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (Bryan Costales) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 12:15:42 -0700 To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Stuck up Disco Owners? X-Status: Status: RO +------------ + From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Date: Fri, Aug 5, 12:13 1994 + ... + A week later and + not even a thank you. It looks like the average Discovery owner is just + about as friendly as the average Range Rover owner (netters excluded). I + guess I won't be waving to them either. + Some Disco owners never owned a Land Rover before. It is understandable that they don't understand the tradition of waving, one Land Rover to another. I, on the other hand, graduated from my Series III, 88, to a Disco and do understand. So please wave to Disco owners too. Some (most?) of them remember and are friendly. -- Bryan Costales -- Systems Manager, International Computer Science Institute Internet: bcx@icsi.berkeley.edu BITNET: bcx@ucbicsi 37 degrees 52.193 minutes north by 122 degrees 16.277 minutes west From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 16:40:40 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 13:59:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: whatsit To: landrovers Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO I got me a real poser here....It is a land rover,that much is sure...and it is no great mystery,nor some one off prototype with the steering wheel in the center or such,but,I wonder if anyone can explain what year this buggy might really be...here we go..... the registration document from Quebec (Canada,folks,for a while anyway) says it is a 1969 109 pickup....this is in french,of course.... it is a 109 but this is what I see....evwrything apears to be original Narrow lights in the grill,glass parking and turn signal lenses in front with the turn lenses being amber....Later 2A radiator with the ribs in the tank going left and right,metal over flow tube,generator,solex carb w/heater element, Sealed crankcase with diaphram type PCV valve,CB type masters for clutch and brakes,Kodiak Mk.3 heater,seperate wiper motors, Plastic caps over the windscreen hold down nuts(not wing nuts)No seatbelt mounts,early metal spoked steering wheel, Everything seems to point to a 1964ish car except the PCV stuff and the Plastic nuts on the windscreen.....the chassis#(which I forgot to bring) shows it being built after 1962...but nothing else (the Number plate is AWOL.....I have no doubt that this vehicle is *NOT* the one on the paperwork.....Did canada (or anywhere else)have,or require PCV valves in the mid sixties? It *is* a solex manifold (they are different) with the full PCV system on it...so even if it is a later engine,it is still strange as USA spec. vehicles got Zenith carbs when they got the emissions stuff..... any thoughts here.......(I know numbers would help,but it's raining out there and the block is a mucky mess....) steve...... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 16:19:53 1994 Date: Fri, 05 Aug 1994 16:58:04 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Rover miles X-Status: Status: RO Here's a question for the group...what constitutes a high mileage Rover? I've heard of million-mile Mercedes, but how about for LR's? Mine has about 200,000 miles...just getting broken in as it were. How about others? *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 17:24:25 1994 Date: Fri, 05 Aug 1994 17:24:39 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Disco facts X-Status: Status: RO Several people have written in about Discovery facts/reliability factors and whatnot, and John Brabyn mentioned the wheel travel, approach and departure angles. In the review of the Disco in the September '94 issue of "Four Wheeler" they found that it has the most wheel travel of *all* stock vehicles (8.5" front, 11" rear) with the exception of the Ramcharger pickup truck and that was by but a fraction. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 16:36:28 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 14:30:46 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: costales@icsi.berkeley.edu, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Stuck up Disco Owners? X-Status: Status: RO The sam applies to Range Rover owners -- most of them haven't had a Land Rover before, don't know about the tradition, and don't even know their vehicles are Land Rovers. They need to be gently educated. At least RRNA changed its name to LRNA so the Land Rover name is now more visible than when Range Rovers first appeared in the U.S. How about a LRNA advertising campaign incorporating the waving tradition? Does anyone know Charley Hughes? John Brabyn Mill Valley, Ca 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 16:50:43 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 14:42:06 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: whatsit X-Status: Status: RO In message Steven M Denis writes: >> > the registration document from Quebec (Canada,folks,for a while anyway) > says it is a 1969 109 pickup....this is in french,of course.... > > it is a 109 but this is what I see....evwrything apears to be original > Narrow lights in the grill,glass parking and turn signal lenses in front > with the turn lenses being amber....Later 2A radiator with the ribs in > the tank going left and right,metal over flow tube,generator,solex carb > w/heater element, Sealed crankcase with diaphram type PCV valve,CB type > masters for clutch and brakes,Kodiak Mk.3 heater,seperate wiper motors, > Plastic caps over the windscreen hold down nuts(not wing nuts)No seatbelt > mounts,early metal spoked steering wheel, Everything seems to point to a > 1964ish car except the PCV stuff > and the Plastic nuts on the windscreen.....the chassis#(which I forgot to > bring) shows it being built after 1962...but nothing else (the Number > plate is AWOL.....I have no doubt that this vehicle is *NOT* the one on > the paperwork.....Did canada (or anywhere else)have,or require PCV > valves in the mid sixties? It *is* a solex manifold (they are different) > with the full PCV system on it...so even if it is a later engine,it is > still strange as USA spec. vehicles got Zenith carbs when they got the > emissions stuff..... > any thoughts here.......(I know numbers would help,but it's raining out > there and the block is a mucky mess....) > > steve...... Well, the plastic spoke steering wheel came in late '67. Solex carbs lasted through '67, as did the duel wiper motors. I believe the radiator you are desscribing was in use in '67. Early SMOG stuff started appearing on US spec cars during the early 60s. The Kodiak heater was a popular option in areas that get cold winters. People may fake an older registration to pay cheaper lisencing or cheaper taxes/import duties (which is what i think happened to my Canadian spec LR when it came to the US). Dealers are known to regularly up the registration year of a car that doesn't sell new when the newer car is identical-ish. It accounts of all those registered '63 Triumph TR3s when no TR3s were built for the '63 year. OOOOOMMMMMMMMM......... My best guess is that this is a US spec early '67, delivered to a Northern US dealer's lot in mid '67. It sat on the dealer's lot for a year until late summer '68. The dealer changed the papers to indicate it was a new '69 (already announced and starting to show up in showrooms). It got sold as a '69 and made its way to Qubec. How is that for a guess? I think mine is a late '67. Equipment is identical to your description except mine has the plastic spoke steering wheel and being Canadian spec never had the SMOG stuff on it. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 21:17:54 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 15:38:06 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Re: insanity? Cc: lro@team.net X-Status: Status: RO >I think a Land Rover would fit into this quite nicely. > > Welcome to the fold. My older brother owned three or four Tigers. I drove one (new Series I) and rode in another (used Series II). Lots of fun. There is a fellow (Dan) in my area (Mendocino County, CA) who has a rather trick (if somewhat ratty) Tiger and also a (very ratty) Land-Rover (Series II 88" hardtop). He has some other strange stuff too. I will keep your address and that of the Tiger guru you plugged and try to give them to Dan. Enjoy! Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last! From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 21:16:38 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 20:15:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Jan Hilborn Subject: Re: Rover miles To: MR ALEXANDER P GRICE Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <013.01069318.CXKS46A@prodigy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO how can anyone ever be sure how many miles are on their rover... i mean, my speedo's been broken so many times i couldn't begin to make an accurate guess... Witt's read 87k when i bought him back in, um, 89 I think. I put about 25 on that first year, about 30 the next. The next three years I've been driving about 40-50k a year. That puts me up toward 275k miles I can account for. Considering g Witt was over 20 years old when I bought him i'm guessing that 87k may not have been accurate. And in those 200,000 miles probably just about everything has been replaced so am i even driving a '67 88" anymore? inquiring minds want to know... jan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 19:41:21 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 17:34:48 -0700 (PDT) From: James B Russell Sender: James B Russell Reply-To: James B Russell Subject: Re: whatsit To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU, lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408052142.AA18009@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO My 1966 IIA 88 SW has/had the plastic spoke steering wheel, a Kodiak Mk IV heater, individual wipers, Solex carb, PCV stuff, and the plastic cover for the windscreen nuts. It was very, very original when I got it in '76. This would leave me to believe that "whatsit" is a '65 or earlier vehicle. The glass amber front turn signals are almost certainly a replacement for the original clear (something I did on my vehicle). I don't know when PCV stuff was first required but since it is on mine I have to assume it to have been '66 or earlier. It may well have been 65. Of course it is obviously not a '69 unless it received a whole lot of doner parts from older vehicles. The very latest I would call it would be an early 66 or late 65. One other theory is that someone had a 1969 more or less at the same time as this and either intentinally or unintentionally mixed up the papers and/or licenses at some point. Who knows, someone out there may have a '69 with with ~65 papers. Does the chassis number match the paperwork? Jim Russell ==== jrussell@netcom.com (Seattle -- San Francisco) On Fri, 5 Aug 1994, TeriAnn Wakeman wrote: > In message Steven M Denis > writes: > >> > > the registration document from Quebec (Canada,folks,for a while anyway) > > says it is a 1969 109 pickup....this is in french,of course.... > > > > it is a 109 but this is what I see....evwrything apears to be original > > Narrow lights in the grill,glass parking and turn signal lenses in front > > with the turn lenses being amber....Later 2A radiator with the ribs in > > the tank going left and right,metal over flow tube,generator,solex carb > > w/heater element, Sealed crankcase with diaphram type PCV valve,CB type > > masters for clutch and brakes,Kodiak Mk.3 heater,seperate wiper motors, > > Plastic caps over the windscreen hold down nuts(not wing nuts)No seatbelt > > mounts,early metal spoked steering wheel, Everything seems to point to a > > 1964ish car except the PCV stuff > > and the Plastic nuts on the windscreen.....the chassis#(which I forgot to > > bring) shows it being built after 1962...but nothing else (the Number > > plate is AWOL.....I have no doubt that this vehicle is *NOT* the one on > > the paperwork.....Did canada (or anywhere else)have,or require PCV > > valves in the mid sixties? It *is* a solex manifold (they are different) > > with the full PCV system on it...so even if it is a later engine,it is > > still strange as USA spec. vehicles got Zenith carbs when they got the > > emissions stuff..... > > any thoughts here.......(I know numbers would help,but it's raining out > > there and the block is a mucky mess....) > > > > steve...... > > Well, the plastic spoke steering wheel came in late '67. Solex carbs lasted > through '67, as did the duel wiper motors. I believe the radiator you are > desscribing was in use in '67. Early SMOG stuff started appearing on US spec > cars during the early 60s. The Kodiak heater was a popular option in areas that > get cold winters. > > People may fake an older registration to pay cheaper lisencing or cheaper > taxes/import duties (which is what i think happened to my Canadian spec LR when > it came to the US). Dealers are known to regularly up the registration year of > a car that doesn't sell new when the newer car is identical-ish. It accounts of > all those registered '63 Triumph TR3s when no TR3s were built for the '63 year. > > > OOOOOMMMMMMMMM......... > > My best guess is that this is a US spec early '67, delivered to a Northern US > dealer's lot in mid '67. It sat on the dealer's lot for a year until late > summer '68. The dealer changed the papers to indicate it was a new '69 (already > announced and starting to show up in showrooms). It got sold as a '69 and made > its way to Qubec. > > How is that for a guess? > > I think mine is a late '67. Equipment is identical to your description except > mine has the plastic spoke steering wheel and being Canadian spec never had the > SMOG stuff on it. > > > > TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world > twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards > LINK: TWAKEMAN > 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, > MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 22:56:03 1994 From: Russell Burns Subject: Re: Stuck up Disco Owners? To: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 94 20:46:50 MDT Cc: costales@icsi.berkeley.edu, land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408052130.AA29763@skivs.ski.org>; from "John Brabyn" at Aug 5, 94 2:30 pm X-Status: Status: RO I have waved to couple of older rovers, and I just get ignored.... Russ Burns 91 Range Rover sooon to be a 20 year old truck.... > > The sam applies to Range Rover owners -- most of them haven't had a Land Rover > before, don't know about the tradition, and don't even know their vehicles are > Land Rovers. They need to be gently educated. At least RRNA changed its name > to LRNA so the Land Rover name is now more visible than when Range Rovers > first appeared in the U.S. > > How about a LRNA advertising campaign incorporating the waving tradition? Does > anyone know Charley Hughes? > > John Brabyn > Mill Valley, Ca > 89RR > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 6 18:24:38 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: lro@stratus.com Date: Sat, 6 Aug 1994 16:19:01 +1100 Subject: Re: land rovers Cc: lro@stratus.com X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > Date sent: Sat, 6 Aug 1994 09:45:42 -0800 > To: mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk > From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) > Subject: land rovers > Copies to: lro@stratus.com > Hello sir! > > My wife, son and I have made plans to be in england at the end of august. > I have started making a list of things I want to do/see. One is check out > the Land Rover Factory (Solihull) and get a ride (as described by Ludovico > awhile ago) in a Land rover at the demo site. I plan to check out some > book stores and pickup a book or two on Land Rovers (I'll check out the FAQ > for actual addresses). > > Would you care to offer suggestions for things to see? They need not be > exclusively Land Rover but.... We have motel accomodations for three > nights in London somewhere. After that we plan to head out, making > arrangments as we go (Is that really stupid? We don't want to set an > itinery now while at home, but would rather just make phone calls and > reservations when in england.). > > At this point we are considering a rail pass to get out of cities but > haven't eliminated the idea of renting a car. I also have this fanatsy of > perhaps buying an old LR and shipping it home. However, I don't know > anything about this and don't think it would save me any money in getting a > nice 109. > > Comments welcome and encouraged. If I don't come up with things to do, > I'll spend the whole time looking at hedges and quilts ;^). > > John Hess, PhD Phone me 916 752 8420 > Dept of Human Anatomy FAX me 916 752 8520 > University of Calif Email me jfhess@ucdavis.edu > Davis, CA or leave me alone, your choice. > John, Last year we went to England, France and Spain. While in England, one can get rail passes fairly resonable. The Brit-Rail system, at least last year, was not part of the Eurail system - strickly British. We had no problems going to virtually any small town in England. At or near each rail station is a tourist bureau or such that will inform you of all of the hotels or B&B's in that town. They even have photos of each accomodation with their rooms and will make reservations for you. Some charge for this service, but it is minimal and well worth it in time saved! Most of the hotels have a breakfast buffet which is included with the price. While in London, we stayed at the Adelphi Hotel in the Museum District. All of the museums are within walking distance from this hotel. Double decker buses took us everywhere else. As far as bringing over a Land Rover, 1967 or older is the ticket, otherwise one must spend a small fortune modifying the Rover to today's emmission standards. It costs about $1,000. US to ship one to USA's west coast. If you buy something worth $50. or more, like in Canada, before your trip, you will be taxed at a different duty rate for the Land Rover. Otherwise, one pays full duty. There are also dealers in GB that specialize in shipping Land Rovers overseas. See LRO magazine for their advertisements. Good luck, John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 6 12:48:16 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 6 Aug 1994 09:45:42 -0800 To: mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) Subject: land rovers Cc: lro@stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO Hello sir! My wife, son and I have made plans to be in england at the end of august. I have started making a list of things I want to do/see. One is check out the Land Rover Factory (Solihull) and get a ride (as described by Ludovico awhile ago) in a Land rover at the demo site. I plan to check out some book stores and pickup a book or two on Land Rovers (I'll check out the FAQ for actual addresses). Would you care to offer suggestions for things to see? They need not be exclusively Land Rover but.... We have motel accomodations for three nights in London somewhere. After that we plan to head out, making arrangments as we go (Is that really stupid? We don't want to set an itinery now while at home, but would rather just make phone calls and reservations when in england.). At this point we are considering a rail pass to get out of cities but haven't eliminated the idea of renting a car. I also have this fanatsy of perhaps buying an old LR and shipping it home. However, I don't know anything about this and don't think it would save me any money in getting a nice 109. Comments welcome and encouraged. If I don't come up with things to do, I'll spend the whole time looking at hedges and quilts ;^). John Hess, PhD Phone me 916 752 8420 Dept of Human Anatomy FAX me 916 752 8520 University of Calif Email me jfhess@ucdavis.edu Davis, CA or leave me alone, your choice. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 7 01:03:58 1994 Date: Sun, 7 Aug 1994 00:04:58 -0600 (MDT) From: Stevens Subject: 4 Sale/Canada - 88" P/U To: LRO_List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO I just returned from a brief visit with some family in southern British Columbia, and ever-watchful for Land Rovers as I search for one to call my one, I happened across the following. Details are limited as I did not have much time for a detailed inspection/verification. The following is as stated by current owner or from my cursory look-over. 1960 SWB pick-up 1966 engine (ran okay when vehicle put up _three years_ ago, but carb could use re/re.) - some welding done to chassis - top and side of left-hand front fender separating - interior looks complete (but upholstery sports tufted/exploded look) - non-standard indicators and the like. - fabulous collection of spider webs. - no o/d or winch The owner wants $1500 for the thing, which seems way out of line, but I'd like to get some opinions on that pricing. I'm not interested myself, as I'm holding out for a 109 (non p/u), so I'll post the owners name and phone number below so those interested can reach him directly. If anybody wants additional information, e-mail me and I'll see if I can provide it, otherwise...call: Brian Marsh Castlegar, B.C. (604) 365-7650 Disclaimer: I don't know the owner and have no stake in the vehicle's sale. I just happened to spot the thing sitting in his yard. -- Henry ================================================ /==============\ Henry Stevens | | | stevensh@cuug.ab.ca [|______|_______|] Calgary, Alberta, CANADA /___/^^^^^^\___\ |(@) [####] (@)| Have '64 MGB, want LWB Land Rover | o [####] o | ======%%%%====== "Without a real car, I'm only {*}={&&}====={*} half a man." -Dean Jones {*} {*} "The Love Bug" ================================================ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 7 02:17:47 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: LR current cites To: lro@stratus.com Date: Sun, 7 Aug 1994 01:08:24 -0600 (MDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1274 X-Status: Status: RO Here's the latest, lifted from UNCOVER (details below in case you want to subscribe to their REVEAL service or have the articles faxed to you): Petersen's 4 wheel & off-road. SEP 01 1994 v 17 n 9 No Whimps Allowed. Page: 86 The Warn Transylvania Trophy. 0162-3214(19940901)17:9L.86:WA;1- > UnCover Article No.: 251,036,159,136 Petersen's 4 wheel & off-road. SEP 01 1994 v 17 n 9 V8 Sport/Utility Shoot-Out. Page: 102 Jeep and Land Rover duke it out. 0162-3214(19940901)17:9L.102:VSS;1- > UnCover Article No.: 251,036,159,141 -- The REVEAL Table of Contents service is supplied to you by the UnCover Company. If you desire further information or assistance, please phone us at 800.787.7979 (outside the US at 303.758.3030), or electronic mail to: uncover@carl.org. Thank you for using REVEAL. _________________________________________________________________________ If you don't know about REVEAL, and it looks pretty impressive to you, don't get your hopes too high: Petersen's is one of the few (perhaps only) 4x4 titles that they index. T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 7 12:07:02 1994 From: Dan Chayes Subject: More Roof Racks To: lro@stratus.com Date: Sun, 7 Aug 94 13:00:43 EDT Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.25] X-Status: Status: RO How about some more info on roof racks - Thule makes a series for land rovers, vans and busses model 420 10.5" clearance model 421 17.5" model 423 30.0" these gutter mount racks have feet that extend almost vertically. the problem is the price, list for the 420 model is 278USD. and the cross bars are another 19USD. thule number is east coast 800-238-2388 west coast 800-848-5322 you can special order thule racks and components thru REI. No, I don't work for thule, I was looking for a good locking ski rack for my 88 hardtop, but gave up when I figured out what it was going to cost. Yakama make some extenders for their standard racks, REI normally stocks these units. Hope this helps Dan chayes@acm.org From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 7 12:22:25 1994 From: Dan Chayes Subject: RR manuals To: lro@stratus.com Date: Sun, 7 Aug 94 13:15:01 EDT Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.25] X-Status: Status: RO I finally did it - i sold the aging bmw 325e and i'll be getting my "NEW" '89 range rover sometime next week, as soon as the dealer fixes the "lifter noise" problems So - a couple of questions Does anybody know whats available for service manuals for the range rovers? Does anybody know the speaker "size" for the factory installed units? Sure seems to be a lot of people trading/selling older rangies for the newer LWB models in the washington dc area dan chayes@acm.org '74 Series III 88 - with right front sph appart '89 Range Rover - expect delivery next week '84 R100RS - sure hope it the rain storms are limited From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 7 22:49:21 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc.dixon@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: Roco toys From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sun, 07 Aug 94 21:37:37 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO The other day i announced the arrival of two new Land Rovers from Roco. This is a more detailed description for those of you who might be interested. Roco is an Austrian company who manufactures vehciles for the model railwway enthusiast and wargaming types primarily. the themes are either Austrian , Germanic, soviet or American by and large. Their products are all 1:87 scale, injection moulded plastic. The vehciles come assembled BUT are designed to be taken apart again so that you may customize them yourself, ie paint schemes etc. Over the years there have been special releeases as some people buy Roco just to collect this stuff beleive it or not. Two recent releases fall into this category, these are what I am going to talk about right now. Number 1720 is classed as a SERENGETI Land Rover. the vehicle is a ser 3 109 station wagon left hand drive. the cost in my local store is $11.99 CDn Dollars plus 15 % taxes. The vehicle is the same base vehicle that Roco have been putting out for about two years now, each time a little different . this one has a very striking paint scheme in that it is white with black stripes that run up the sides and over the roof and hood to the other side and down again. That is except for the rear of the vehcile that the stripes slope rearwards. When you look at the rear end on it looks like you are looking at the rear of a zebra!! Tail and all! Neat effect. This one come with the standard wing mirrors loose for you to install but with a winch that can be mounted up front aswell. They have not offered a winch before. Number 1585 is the Schwarzbau land Rover. Exactly the same vehcile as above, including winch except for paint job. Body is alight pea green with the safari roof mouled in grey. On the front doors and hood are the name Scwarz which is obviously a company and with the word Geometer on the doors perhaps this has some geological link. As Roco's stuff is all linked to real vehciles I presume somebody will probably recognise the company name. The price for this one is 9.99 dollarts plus taxes etc etc. Why the differreence I do not know , that is very typoical of Roco. No one can ever explain this to me. These can be hard to order as it is low volume for most hobby shops and has to be special ordered. I have a good local supply and would be happy to get supplies in at cost plus psotage if anyone cares to contact me direct my e mail for more info. If you want these move soon as stoicks of this stuff is usuallly very limited and will dry up soon. this is not a marketing ploy just real life! Regards Robin Craig, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 07:43:43 1994 Date: Mon, 08 Aug 1994 08:28:39 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Gearbox and OVLR To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com, debrown@srp.gov Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO David asked: >> What are "The Gearbox and OVL"? Can I get a copy e-mailed to me? If so, I'm at: debrown@srp.gov >> David, The Gearbox and OVLR (Ottowa Valley Land Rovers) are the best and most consistent club newsletters in North America. The Gearbox is the Virginia Club's publication and seems to contain a surprising amount of insider info well a head of time. It is published quarterly and I look forward to each issue. This group will be running the largest Rally on the east coast this fall. OVLR is published monthly (or is it bi-monthly?.. it comes pretty often). Lots of good content with some pretty entertaining copy about the antics of the local club members. Even though I have not been able to participate in any of the club events I really get a laugh reading who did what to whom and what they've done to their vehicles. They also seem to come up with new product info well ahead of time. While I'm at it... I also get the Bay State Rovers publication. Very good newsletter but it hasn't been as consistent as it could be so far. That should change as the editor, Jim Pappas has just left his job as a merchant seaman and should have more time for the newsletter (should be quarterly-looks like it will be 3 issues this year). Includes a subscription to the British Marque- a pretty interesting newsletter covering all British cars (British Marque comes monthly). Solihull Society - The Colorado club. Used to be pretty good. Lately it's been a compilation of photo copies of magazine articles. I keep renewing as I hope to relocate out there some day and I could use all the information/ contacts I can get. Comes quarterly. Land Rover Owners Of North America. Used to be VERY good, and VERY inconsistent. '92 or '91 was the last year I subscribed. I got 1 issue for my $20 subscription. Most are $15 or $20 US/yr. Bay State is $40. You can contact the editors at the addresses below: Ottawa Valley Land Rovers (OVLR) c/o Mike McDermott 1016 Normandy Crescent Ottawa, Ontario, K2C 0L4 CANADA (Canada's oldest and largest Land Rover club) dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Bay State Rovers Association c/o Jim Pappas P.O. Box 342 North Scituate, MA, 02060 (No E-mail ID that I know of) Rover Owner's Association of VA (Gearbox) c/o Sandy Grice 1633 Melrose Parkway Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA CXKS46A@prodigy.com Sorry for the delay in responding. I was locking up my desk to run out the door when your message popped up. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 06:46:22 1994 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 1994 12:35:17 +0000 From: mfarrall@well.ox.ac.uk (Martin Farrall) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: LR and visit to England in late summer Cc: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 1215 X-Status: Status: RO 1) The UK rail strike could well carry on and become progressively more disruptive so I would make the decision of buying a rail-pass as late as possible. IMHO it might be more cost effective to hire a car in any case, if there are "3 up" and you want to pack a lot in. An alternative budget way to get around would be to go by coach. 2) The Gaydon Heritage Motor Museum in Gaydon (just off the M40 south of Warwick) might be of interest. Also, within 30 - 40 minutes drive are Warwick castle, Stratford (Shakespeare's birthplace and historic town), the Cotswolds (e.g. Broadway, Chipping Campden etc. with their traditional architecture and antique shops as well as beautiful countryside for walks) Oxford, Blenheim Palace and so on. Solihull is also about 40 minutes drive from Stratford, which would make a good centre. 3) Also prepare your self for a shock, Discovery's were the top "executive" car in the UK last year, this means that they are seen in swarms on the motorway, you will also see truckloads of the buggers heading south from Solihull any week day a.m. I hope that seeing too many of them doesn't put you off when you're driving on the left. Hope you enjoy your visit. Martin Farrall From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 10:24:03 1994 Date: Mon, 08 Aug 1994 10:50:01 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Gearbox and OVLR X-Status: Status: RO Bill Maloney writes: >OVLR is published monthly (or is it bi-monthly?.. it comes pretty often). >Lots of good content with some pretty entertaining copy about the antics >of the local club members. Even though I have not been able to >participate in any of the club events I really get a laugh reading who did >what to whom and what they've done to their vehicles.... Hey Dixon, why don't you post the story of "Bates" vs "the bear". It had me laughing for days! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 09:57:07 1994 Date: Mon, 08 Aug 1994 10:50:17 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Stuck up Disco Owners? X-Status: Status: RO John Brabyn writes: >Does anyone know Charley Hughes? [Pres., LRNA] Yeah...I met him a couple of times. He even sat in my '72 88" on one ocassion. He actually wondered what all the levers were for! ("...and what's the red one?....") So much for Range Rover owners/corporate presidents knowing about the heritage of Land Rovers! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 11:38:43 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Mon, 8 Aug 1994 09:31:54 +1100 Subject: Need a 5-door County Body X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO LRO's, I have a 110" 1987 rolliing chassis. I need a complete 5-door County Body including bulkhead, interior, etc. It must be shipped to USA. Any suggestions? Thanks, John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA 509.747.0692 (H) 509.353.2700 (W) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 12:48:07 1994 Date: Mon, 08 Aug 1994 13:27:59 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: US 110 Defender for Sale To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO A couple of weeks ago someone asked about the price of a US 110 that was going for I believe $43,000. I stopped by the Rover dealer in Parsippany NJ and saw one for $39,000 with 22,000 miles on it. I've forgotten who asked but if you're still interested the number is 201-575-7750. It looked pretty nice on the outside. However, when you consider that the dealer cost on the new 110s was $32,000, it seems like a lot of cash. Bill From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 13:11:34 1994 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 94 11:04:42 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: dan@hp8c.nrl.navy.mil, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: RR manuals X-Status: Status: RO Congratulations! Asd a matter of interest (since mine also is an 89) what are the lifter noise symptoms and diagnosis/cure? Re manuals -- I use the factory manual available from the dealers (about $110 but worth the price). I haven't seen a Haynes one but something like that must exist, at least in the UK. Speakers -- there are 6 with 3 different sizes; which one do you want? Good Luck! John Brabyn Mill Valley, Ca 89 RR "Stealth Rover" From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 13:12:28 1994 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 94 11:07:56 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: CXKS46A@prodigy.com, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Stuck up Disco Owners? X-Status: Status: RO Re Charlie Hughes -- I wondered because I tried top call hiom once but his secretary wouldn't let me through. John From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 14:58:11 1994 Date: Mon, 08 Aug 1994 15:39:05 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Stuck Up LRNA Executives To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Sandy Writes: >> John Brabyn writes: >Does anyone know Charley Hughes? [Pres., LRNA] Yeah...I met him a couple of times. He even sat in my '72 88" on one ocassion. He actually wondered what all the levers were for! ("...and what's the red one?....") So much for Range Rover owners/corporate presidents knowing about the heritage of Land Rovers! >> ... and John writes: >> Re Charlie Hughes -- I wondered because I tried top call hiom once but his secretary wouldn't let me through. John >> I remember a conversation with Chris Velonis of Massachusetts a couple of years ago, when the US 110 rumors were in their infancy. Chris decided he was going to get through the Mr. Hughes directly (couldn't make it through the switchboard) and started dialing numbers that were close to a LRNA number he had in the hopes of getting through to Mr. Hughes. Well, he made it and immediately began questioning Mr. Hughes about the intro of the 110, and expressed his intrest in placing a deposit on a vehicle. Mr. Hughes confirmed that the vehicle was about to be announced (Chris does have a way with people and words) then asked "How the hell did you get my number???!!!" (I think the word was "hell" but it could have been something else). Sure gave me a chuckle. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 15:43:22 1994 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 94 16:34:40 EDT From: "THE X WINDOW SYSTEM: A VMS FOR THE 90S" To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Apparently-To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: quick oil pressure question X-Status: Status: RO I replaced the oil pressure sending unit this past weekend on Flashman. The old one had never worked during my ownership so I'm wondering what the normal readings should be for a 2.25l petrol engine at idle and cruise RPMs.... tnx monty From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 15:56:10 1994 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 1994 16:46:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: whatsit To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408052142.AA18009@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO The 109 has had repairs done to the frame at the front spring hangers....and the frame numbers are gone or covered up...the number plate is missing so all I have is the Reg. document.... The compiniation of the solex carb,glass lenses, narrow eye front end.and steel spoked wheel (all early stuff) with the plastic caps and emmision controls (late stuff) is my question....did a rover with this group of"stuff"ever leave the factory or is this a "bastard"....Btw..this rig was a tow truck of some sort...a real professional look with whats left.... steve.... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 16:17:43 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: whatsit From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Mon, 08 Aug 94 08:55:49 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Steven M Denis writes: > the registration document from Quebec (Canada,folks,for a while anyway) > says it is a 1969 109 pickup....this is in french,of course.... We all know how accurate that can be eh? :-) > it is a 109 but this is what I see....evwrything apears to be original > Narrow lights in the grill,glass parking and turn signal lenses in front > with the turn lenses being amber.... Turn signals had to be white up until about '67-68 in Canada, then the turn signals went amber. Dale has a Late IIA. It has amber lights for turn signals. This is correct for 1969. > Later 2A radiator with the ribs in the tank going left and right, > metal over flow tube,generator, This too is correct for the year. > solex carb w/heater element, Could be either Solex or Zenith. A toss for this year. Zenith were on their way in at this time. > Sealed crankcase with diaphram type PCV valve, This is the only really strange thing on here. It shouldn't be there as Canadian Land Rovers were not subject to pollution controls (or seat belts for that matter) until 1972. The U.S. did start to require thgis stuff, so as a result for ease of production we did get some of this junk, but it is not required. > CB type masters for clutch and brakes,Kodiak Mk.3 heater,seperate wiper > motors, plastic caps over the windscreen hold down nuts(not wing nuts) > No seatbelt mounts,early metal spoked steering wheel, Everything seems > to point to a 1964ish car except the PCV stuff and the Plastic nuts on > the windscreen..... Everything points to a vehicle that is almost the same as Dale's, but the PCV valve makes it curious. Granted, there are two courses of action here. Either the PCV is correct and someone has changed a lot of things, or the rest of the stuff is original, and this PCV valve is the interloper. (The third is that the production line ran out of the stock cover, so grabbed one from the Rover 2000 car line destined for California and rammed it on...) > plate is AWOL.....I have no doubt that this vehicle is *NOT* the one on > the paperwork.....Did canada (or anywhere else)have,or require PCV > valves in the mid sixties? It *is* a solex manifold (they are different) > with the full PCV system on it...so even if it is a later engine,it is > still strange as USA spec. vehicles got Zenith carbs when they got the > emissions stuff..... It is pretty close however. It is the pollution control crap that makes it interesting. Could be an American LR, as they started to go into this pollution stuff five years before we did. I have not seen am American pollution set-up. I would be interested if you could take a picture of this mess on the engine and send it up. WOuld be rather interesting to see. Rgds, Dixon PS. Solex manifold is different? Interchangable. The enith used an adapter plate on top of the manifold to turn it 90 degrees. Remove the adapter from a Zenith manifold and you drop the Solex on. As per engines, the only change over the IIA period was the change from 7:1 to 8:1 head. This is easy to check. Just look at the head on the top left side, between the cover and carb., in the centre from fore to aft. If there is a large raised portion "dividing" the exposed portion of the head, it is 8:1. If there is no raised piece of metal, it is a 7:1 head. (Note: many heads state 8:1 on them, but not all heads had it stamped on.) PPS. Newsletter arrive? -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 17:10:43 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: US 110 Defender for Sale To: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) (maloney) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 94 18:04:29 EDT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: ; from "maloney" at Aug 08, 94 1:27 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] X-Status: Status: RO > > A couple of weeks ago someone asked about the price of a US 110 that was going > for I believe $43,000. I stopped by the Rover dealer in Parsippany NJ and saw > one for $39,000 with 22,000 miles on it. I've forgotten who asked but if > you're still interested the number is 201-575-7750. It looked pretty nice on > the outside. However, when you consider that the dealer cost on the new 110s > was $32,000, it seems like a lot of cash. > > Bill > .......and there is one in the most recent sunday NY times for a mere $45K. #492/500, as if that makes a real difference.......if it does to any of you perspective buyers, a friend of mine has #5/500 (ohhh, one of the *early* ones....when they either hadn't yet made any assembly mistakes or didn't yet realize they had!).......he is still trying to decide if it is up for sale-the finance wants him to sell it to help pay for the new home but he is resisting. We'll see how long he holds out! rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 18:58:42 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: Discount From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Mon, 08 Aug 94 17:30:48 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO I have receicved some flyers that give you a 20% discount on prices for Land Rover World magazine, while I will be keeping one for myself. This flyer is available to anyone who e mails me. I'll let you know if I am sending one out of if you were too late. I think ther are about 5 fleyrs. Send your snail mail address with your e mail. Robin. -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 18:07:43 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: quick oil pressure question To: brandenberg@wrksys.enet.dec.com (THE X WINDOW SYSTEM: A VMS FOR THE 90S) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 94 18:55:28 EDT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408082033.AA01706@easynet.crl.dec.com>; from "THE X WINDOW SYSTEM: A VMS FOR THE 90S" at Aug 8, 94 4:34 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] X-Status: Status: RO > > > I replaced the oil pressure sending unit this past weekend on > Flashman. The old one had never worked during my ownership so I'm > wondering what the normal readings should be for a 2.25l petrol > engine at idle and cruise RPMs.... tnx > > monty > Idle? Does this thing idle?? On "hand throttle assisted" idle, Nige pumps about 20 psi or so, maybe less. Regular running/cruising he throws in the 45-80 range (some out there say 80ish is getting too high and the pressure relief ball may be sticking, but it does top out and go no further, so its working to some extent). Most often it runs about 65 psi. The RoverRoach does about the same. If down a half quart or so it tends to drop a tad. rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 8 22:26:30 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: discounts From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Mon, 08 Aug 94 21:19:27 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO OOPS! I only have two flyers so be quick! Robin -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 01:26:32 1994 >From: Benjamin Allan Smith To: lro@team.net Subject: How nice Rovers are to work on... Reply-To: ranger@ugcs.caltech.edu Date: Mon, 08 Aug 1994 23:19:30 -0700 From: Benjamin Allan Smith X-Status: Status: RO I'm getting ready to drove to Fort Collins, colorado next week and in order to use my parents minivan (160,000 miles and noengine problems until now) I needed to work on it. At every junctur so far I have come to the conclusion that my SIII is much nicer to work on. The problem is low compression, so the head had to come off. Hey remember me doing this 2 months ago to the Rover twice. Well, I get to pull another head. So I sat down to read the service manuel. How to pull head 1)pull air pump, 2)pull air pump belt 3)take out bolts in proscribed order. Then I thought to myself, what? So I thumbed back to the beginning of the engine section. Almost all engine work assumes that first you pull the engine out and work on it from a stand. This assumption is bad because 1) I don;t have a hoist and 2)no engine stand. First nice thing that Rover's have that other cars don't is nice flat wings and area infront of radiator to place tools and open books. This way the tools don't fall all over the engine bay and the ground and get lost and the book doesn't close and fall on the greesy engine. The second thing is that the bolts and nuts are of reasonable size and are accessible. not the 10mm manifold nuts of which half can be gotten out using a 1/4" drive socket because its the only one that would fit and a two foot lever arm to loosen unrusted nuts! Of course the onter half can not be removed while the manifold are in the engine bay. I busted a 10mm socket and drive just getting the bloody thing out. of course my temper wasn;t the best when I had to remove the 4 nuts holding the carb on that hat to go at least 25 turns 1/12 of a turn at a time with a wrench. Finally after two days the head is out and ready to have a valve job and a new camshaft. I liked this little bit of engineering. In order to replace the timing belt, I need to jack up the engine and remove an engine mount. The third thing that I like about Rovers is that for me I don't stretch and strain too much to get into postion to work on the engine. then again I'm 6 foot 4. On the Minivan I was leaning and streatching all the way out to get to things. I'd hate to see a persion a foot shorter doing this. All of this reminds me of a story from my grandfather. Apparently he wasthinking of buying a MG A twincam. He got as far as looking over the repair manuel. For some simple job such as replacing the points or a certain spark plug my grandfather claimed the manuel when like this: 1)Remove owner from sight of the car. 2)Jack up the car and remove a certain tire. 3)torch hole though the fender... Now I can't vouch for the accuracy of the story, but as current cars seem to fit engines in with a shoehorn, I wouldn't be surprised if was true on some car out there. Ben (who after dring 4400 miles in a Land Rover last month, would rather drive the 3600 miles to Ft. Collins and back in the Rover, but the Rover doesn't get 27 mpg) -Benjamin Smith ranger@ugcs.caltech.edu 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 12:48:05 1994 Date: Tue, 09 Aug 1994 13:14:23 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: No Mail Today? To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Dixon, Have you received any mail from the LRO list since last night? Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 14:26:09 1994 X-Sendmail-Version: 8.6.9 X-Authentication-Info: costales@localhost From: costales@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (Bryan Costales) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 1994 12:03:18 -0700 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? (TANGENT) X-Status: Status: RO I have had great luck with the mylar liners from boxes of wine. They are silver with a soft plastic removable lid/valve. I have used them for camping and intertational travel and have never had one fail. They are tough as nails and last forever. A good size is 5 liters. Easy to cary and small enough to toss anywhere. You can even tie a rope around one corner and suspend to create a camp fauscet. The silver exterior tends to keep the water cool. I once tossed on on my front bumper behind the license plate (88 rover), and it stayed put for the entire trip from Berkeley to Salt Lake City. +------------ + From: shibumi@cisco.com (Kenton A. Hoover) + Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? (TANGENT) + Date: Tue, Aug 9, 11:50 1994 +------------ + At 16:22 02/08/94, ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu wrote: + >Dale Desprey was bold enough to point out... + >>These are available new, at Sir Plus. They have a plastic cap instead of + >>a cork. Also the cord doesn't last very long. If you can't find one + >>locally, let me know. + + The GoreTex company made canteens out of GoreTex during the Gulf War. The + working principle is the same as the canvas water bag, but you didn't have + to wet the bag to get it started. I haven't seen them for sale for a year + or so, but you might contact W. L. Gore to ask them if they are still in + production. -- Bryan Costales -- Systems Manager, International Computer Science Institute Internet: bcx@icsi.berkeley.edu BITNET: bcx@ucbicsi 37 degrees 52.193 minutes north by 122 degrees 16.277 minutes west From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 15:06:31 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Tue, 9 Aug 1994 12:58:11 +1100 Subject: RE: Canvas Water Bags X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO RE: Canvas Water Bags Dear LRO Owners: I bought one made with Scottish Flax w/cork stopper at a local military surplus store. It looks great strapped on the brush guard on my 88. However, it leaks - even after soaking. Saturday, I found another one made by a different manufacturer in new condition at our local Goodwill. I bought it, soaked it, filled it, and placed it on the brush guard. It also looks great.... except it too leaks. So much for canvas water bags. The wine box liners sound like a better 1990's solution! John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 16:15:53 1994 Date: Tue, 09 Aug 1994 15:29:11 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Whatsit & Whatnot To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO TeriAnn Writes: >> Well like I said, early '67 US spec, or at least California spec had all the stuff you mentioned. Mine fits the description but has a plastic spoke steering wheel, and no SMOG (Mine is Canadian spec). By, '63, if not earlier, California spec cars had closed crankcases and a tube with one way valve going to the air cleaner on most cars (My '63 VW bug was set up that way). On the other hand maybe the car is hot and the people who spirited it away had '69 registration papers from a dead LR. >> Hmmm...sounds suspiciously like the mystery car parked behind OJ's Rolls one fateful night. While we're on the subject of Rovers & OJ... What's the difference between Tang & OJ? Tang won't kill you. OJ & Jeff Dahmer are collaborating on a new book: How to Kill Friends & Dismember People. (Just a couple of things kicking around the office, and tasteless things they are). Bill From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 16:17:41 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 9 Aug 1994 11:50:42 -0700 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) From: shibumi@cisco.com (Kenton A. Hoover) Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? (TANGENT) X-Status: Status: RO At 16:22 02/08/94, ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu wrote: >Dale Desprey was bold enough to point out... >>These are available new, at Sir Plus. They have a plastic cap instead of >>a cork. Also the cord doesn't last very long. If you can't find one >>locally, let me know. The GoreTex company made canteens out of GoreTex during the Gulf War. The working principle is the same as the canvas water bag, but you didn't have to wet the bag to get it started. I haven't seen them for sale for a year or so, but you might contact W. L. Gore to ask them if they are still in production. | Kenton A. Hoover Senior Systems Administrator | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1 415 324 5249 | |===========================================================================| | It seemed like a fun game -- until one of them lost their soul... | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 16:23:06 1994 Date: Tue, 9 Aug 94 11:02:27 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: whatsit X-Status: Status: RO In message Steven M Denis writes: > The 109 has had repairs done to the frame at the front spring > hangers....and the frame numbers are gone or covered up...the number > plate is missing so all I have is the Reg. document.... The compiniation > of the solex carb,glass lenses, narrow eye front end.and steel spoked > wheel (all early stuff) with the plastic caps and emmision controls (late > stuff) is my question....did a rover with this group of"stuff"ever leave > the factory or is this a "bastard"....Btw..this rig was a tow truck of > some sort...a real professional look with whats left.... > > steve.... > > "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." > > "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis > " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 > " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA > " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 Well like I said, early '67 US spec, or at least California spec had all the stuff you mentioned. Mine fits the description but has a plastic spoke steering wheel, and no SMOG (Mine is Canadian spec). By, '63, if not earlier, California spec cars had closed crankcases and a tube with one way valve going to the air cleaner on most cars (My '63 VW bug was set up that way). On the other hand maybe the car is hot and the people who spirited it away had '69 registration papers from a dead LR. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 18:14:34 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Gearbox and OVLR From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 09 Aug 94 13:13:45 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) writes: > >Bill Maloney writes: > >OVLR is published monthly (or is it bi-monthly?.. it comes pretty often). Monthly or I get shot. They know where I live... :-) > Hey Dixon, why don't you post the story of "Bates" vs "the bear". It had > me laughing for days! I'll dig it up from the archives and post it here. Bates still wants to kill the bear everytime this comes up in conversation, but then again, Bates has given us so much material to work with over the years... Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 16:22:49 1994 Date: Tue, 09 Aug 1994 16:59:43 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Water bags X-Status: Status: RO Regarding the thread on canvas/flax water bags, they're *supposed* to leak. Evaporation of the moisture on the outside is what keeps the stuff inside cool. The mylar bags are 'pret near puncture-proof, but they don't keep the contents cool. In the words of the immortal W. C. Fields "...don't drink water, fish fornicate in it...." or "...I remember a time in the wilds of Afghanistan. We lost our corkscrew. We were forced to live on food and water for many days...." *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 16:44:37 1994 Date: Tue, 9 Aug 94 14:35:24 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: BENHAM@wfoclan.usbm.gov, LRO@Team.net Subject: Re: Canvas Water Bags X-Status: Status: RO In message <1A068F109B@wfoclan.usbm.gov> "John R. Benham" writes: > RE: Canvas Water Bags > > Dear LRO Owners: > > I bought one made with Scottish Flax w/cork stopper at a local > military surplus store. It looks great strapped on the brush guard > on my 88. However, it leaks - even after soaking. Saturday, I found > another one made by a different manufacturer in new condition at our > local Goodwill. I bought it, soaked it, filled it, and placed it on > the brush guard. It also looks great.... except it too leaks. So > much for canvas water bags. > > The wine box liners sound like a better 1990's solution! > > John R. Benham > Spokane, WA USA John, they ARE SUPPOSED TO LEAK. Though they should do it slowly. As they leak slowly, the leaking water is evaporated, cooling the bag and the water inside. If you are in a warm dry wind, such as the front of a car traveling through the inland during summer you can get quite a bit of cooling. Without the leadking, you just get hot water. They are for cooling water being stored for a short time for drinking. You have nice cool water to go with the stew you just cooked on your exhaust manifold (Just like the 1930's) When you get a new one you do want to soak it and change the water frequently to get rid of residues before using. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 9 19:26:24 1994 Date: 09 Aug 94 20:14:25 EDT From: "Stephen O'Hearn" <72700.3262@compuserve.com> To: Land Rover Owner Subject: lro-digest X-Status: Status: RO SUBSCRIBE From caloccia@tornadic.sw.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 07:16:43 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: rich@online.comm-data.com To: jimmyp@netcom.com (Jimmy Patrick) To: C Taylor Sutherland III To: gridley@netcom.com (Frank Gehrke) To: Kenneth Stricklin To: jlehman@torrey.umm.maine.edu (Jim Lehman) To: IAN@lab0.vet.edinburgh.ac.uk To: jhumphre@creek.astate.edu Cc: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu To: jmm@wales.bbc.co.uk Subject: Welcome to the land-rover-owner list !!! Date: Wed, 10 Aug 94 08:14:59 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO >> Sorry for the delay in adding you to the list, as I've been on holiday. Cheers, -B Hi ! Welcome to the land-rover-owner list: You should receive one copy of this message, directly. For questions or submissions to the list send mail to land-rover-owner@team.net OR lro@team.net for administrative stuff (subscirptions, etc), allow two weeks and send to land-rover-owner-request@team.net OR lro-request@team.net This brings the number of subscribers to 127+ (of which ~1/5 are digest subscribers). We presently have subscribers from the AU,CA,DK,FI,IS,IT,NL,NO,NZ,ZA, US and in the UK, who have Rovers ranging from a '52, military light-weights, to current Defenders, Discos, Range Rovers, and a 101FC kit. (How about a 127" ? ) Feel free to post an introductory note about you and/or your truck. Traffic on this list tends to be rather light. (Like, I don't think there has been a message in months, guess everyone is off roving...) --bill caloccia@Team.Net caloccia@Stratus.Com Stratus Computer Ltd tele: +44 81 570 4433 Central Hse, Lampton Rd fax: +44 81 569 4755 Hounslow, Middx. TW3 1HY; UK N R 1 3 2 H "Land Rover's first, becuase | +--|--| | | Land Rovers last." '69 Mk.IIa 88" OD 2 4 4 L land-rover-owners-request@Team.Net Ps thanks for waiting, I'm doing list add requests once every couple weeks. --------- Land Rover Owner Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) ----------- A subscriber to the list, Dixon Kenner has an assembled some FAQ documents for (potential/) Land Rover Owners. It focuses on older North American vehicles and includes a bibliography and list of North American clubs and dealers, some in the U.K. These FAQS are available from the FTP site triumph.cs.utah.edu (155.99.208.4) [login "anonymous", and use your mailing address as the password] Current files include: pub/sol/Land_Rover_FAQ.txt -Land-Rovers: Introduction and buyers guide. landrover.faq -Land-Rover FAQ (New files may appear from time to time.) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 10:37:41 1994 Date: Wed, 10 Aug 1994 08:23:22 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: lro-digest X-Status: Status: RO I saw a posting this morning which said "lro-digest subscribe." What's lro-digest? Also, I promised a friend that I would post this ad for tire/wheel package. Should be of interest to some of you who have posted questions about up-gearing your 88s: Michelin XCA 7.50x16 radials, set of four, mounted on L.R. rims (part no. 231601). Low mileage. $400.00. Call John (707) 894-5367 (northern California). From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 11:32:09 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: whatsit From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 10 Aug 94 01:04:03 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO > In message Steven M Denis writes: > > The 109 has had repairs done to the frame at the front spring > > hangers....and the frame numbers are gone or covered up...the number > > plate is missing so all I have is the Reg. document.... Further discussions with other people up here point to the vehicle being legitimate. The PCV valve is inteesting, but lookig at the plethora of changes on our vehicles within this time period, it is entirely possible that this was produced for left-hand drive export to North America. To sum up, you have a valid title, and the specs you cite are acceptable for a Canadian Land Rover of that vintage, model, and type. Why try and disprove what the people here in Canada find perfectly acceptable when compared to comperable vehicles? Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 12:47:33 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Subject: Re: Road-kill cook book Date: Wed, 10 Aug 94 13:31:02 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO There was a companion book, the guide to identifying Flattened Flora and Fauna, complete with ink blots in appropriate shapes. :-) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 15:33:45 1994 Date: Wed, 10 Aug 1994 13:20:09 +0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: jimmyp@netcom.com (Jimmy Patrick) Subject: import land-rover Content-Length: 1083 X-Status: Status: RO I am presently in the market for a land-rover. I am most interested in a swb station wagon. series II, IIA or III. I also may have occasion to spend 3-6 months in London for business. My question is this: Should I try to buy the land-rover here? (Any ideas on where to look?) Or should I buy one in the UK, drive it around for a few months, and then ship it back here (california), hassle with the DMV, pay taxes, etc. etc.????? Do any of you have experience with this kind of activity? I think I can get the vehicle shipped here for around 800 pounds or $1200. I have the feeling that this may just be the tip of the iceberg in terms of time/money/hassle factor. I have also heard that it is easier (possible) to import pre '68 models and harder (impossible) to bring in later models. (I did run into a fellow at the Hayward show who had imported an 88(?) Camel Trophy diesel 110, and he had run into MAJOR hassles. I wish I knew who that guy was.) Any thoughts, comments, suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks in advance. Jimmy Patick -- jimmyp@netcom.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 16:28:56 1994 Date: Wed, 10 Aug 1994 16:11:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Mag ads X-Status: Status: RO I found this under rec.autos.antique, maybe somebody could use it. >From: Bill McBride >Subject: Original Magazine Ads for Sale >Date: Sun, 7 Aug 94 20:22:26 -0500 > >We offer original magazine ads for vintage cars, trucks, etc. to you on >approval. Here's how it works: you email us your specific wants (Example: >1965 Imperial ads; 1937 Packard ads, 8cyl. only; Pontiac ads 1946-48, etc.) >We send you a packet of original ads from Life, POst, Car&Driver, Sports >Illustrated, etc. that meet your needs. Ads are priced $3.00/color page; >$2.00/black-and-white page. Postage is $2.90 per shipment, U.S.A.; extra >for international shipments. On receipt of our packet, you select the ads >you want, return the ones you don't along with a check or moneyorder or >Visa or Mastercard # & expiration date for the value of the ads you keep. >We've been offering this service to the Old Car hobby since 1976 but this >is our first adventure on Internet. Hope it works. We ask that returns be made >within three weeks of our mailing date. We need your postal address as all >shipments are made via Priority Mail for speed and safety. Please: no >requests for lists of ads we have for sale. Our stock of over 175,000 ads >makes list-making impossible. We will, however, accept your list of ads >you already have and send you only ones you don't have listed. By the way, >Corvette ads are not sold on approval; we send a catalog once a year; prices >run >$8.00/color page and $5.00/black & white page for Corvette ads only. Let's >hear from you-all about your ad needs from 1899-present. Best, McBride >Auto Ads, 585 Prospect Avenue, West Hartford CT 06105. Later Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 16:33:05 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: land-rover-owner@team.net Cc: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu Cc: caloccia@sw.stratus.com Subject: 'Desert' Water Bags && l/r and visiting the UK Date: Wed, 10 Aug 94 17:23:57 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? (TANGENT) > I have had great luck with the mylar liners from boxes of wine. They are > silver with a soft plastic removable lid/valve. I have used them for campin Well, they may work fine for keeping water in, but they don't >> functionally << replace a canvas water bag. As noted, the canvas water bags need to be _wet_ to hold water Why ? cause that is when the fibers swell up to seal it Now, if your canvas water bag is wet, then as you travel some water will be wicked away through the canvas and will evaporate on the surface. In evaporating, it will draw some heat out of the water bag. (evaporative cooling - that's how the 'swamp' coolers work in arid areas). Water won't wick through the mylar and evaporate, and if you hung it outside your truck cab on a wicked hot day, in the sun, I don't think it would stay cool - silvered or not. > The GoreTex company made canteens out of GoreTex during the Gulf War. New goretex is permiable to water vapor but not to water, so does that mean the surface evaporation occurs within the bag ? ---------------------------------------- Subject: Re: l/r and visiting the UK > From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) > My wife, son and I have made plans to be in england at the end of august. > I have started making a list of things I want to do/see. One is check out > the Land Rover Factory (Solihull) and get a ride (as described by Ludovico > awhile ago) in a Land rover at the demo site. Well, I haven't been in the UK all that long, but after three months, I've got a bit of a clue, I'm working and living about half way from LHR (Heathrow) to the city. (Four miles to LRH, ~6 miles to ground zero - (For cabbies that's Charing Cross, bug I digress)) Coming at the end of August, you are in a particularly good position to get some L/R action if you seek out the right place. The last weekend is August is a three day weekend ('Bank Holiday (Monday/weekend)') and many of the (numerous) L/R clubs have Rover events with camping, caravaning, and off-road courses -- you might be able to hook up with someone on the net or one of their friends if you want to find your way to Land Rover folks driving about a farm in some part of the UK for a few hours. | PS: checking off the 'I have visited a farm while abroad' box when returning | to the U.S., will get your luggage an all-expense paid trip to an X-ray | machine at US customs, and a free inspection of the shoes which you were | wearing during your visit. The Southern L/R club has an event that weekend with the British version of off-road racing - 'cross country vehicle trials' and modified trials, I've been invited up to (sp?) Penaine for the w/e event there and will probably go there. --------- > book stores and pickup a book or two on Land Rovers There is a book store off of St.Martins (Near Picadily or Leicester Sq.), and if you head back toward Regent St/Oxford Cir. there are a couple large book stores (Foyles comes to mind as having a vast auto section). Be sure to stop in the St.Martins Model shop on your way to the book store. Unless you find something that you can't get in the States, you're probably better off to get it via Motorbooks or RN. I've hauled a lot of books back from trips to NYC (mostly photo books on sale), and travelling with an additional 20# of books isn't the most fun. YMMV. Unless you figure out how to get the VAT (value added tax := 17.5%) back (I haven't) you might end up paying a premium and carrying it back to boot. (The larger department stores do 'tax free for tourists', and if you spend at least #100, they will do the paper work and you'll get about 10 of the 17.5% back and they'll keep the rest as a 'processing' fee. I don't know how of if this works at corner shops, and, by the way, export customs may request to inspect the goods at the airport, so you 'should' be prepared to carry them on.) | US residents, can bring back $400. each duty free, the next $1000. is a | a flat rate of 10%, then they set duties on items as necessary. + UK was allowing some combination of alcohol, tobacco, perfumes, and other + items valued up to #138 when I entered last week (aside from your stuff). > Would you care to offer suggestions for things to see? I'm partial to the theatre, there is lots of it, and you can get cheap tickets downtown mid-afternoon if you're about the place that does that... Even full price for some seats isn't that bad (~$30 per) > After that we plan to head out, making arrangments as we go If you are planning on travelling during the Bank Holiday Weekend, it might be a bit harder, but in general, I've gotten away with it in my travels. (Near every town of any size has a a tourist information office, who knows about the area, and can even make reservations for their 'recommended' B+Bs and Inns. I've also just 'found' places with 'vacancy' signs... > At this point we are considering a rail pass to get out of cities but > haven't eliminated the idea of renting a car. As long as the signal men get their contract by the time you get here, trains would be ok. If you want to go to Southern or Central Wales or something, it would probably be easier to drive. ------- Travel Tips: London: Map: A-Z fold out tourist map of central London - includes tube stations (with line colors), as well as landmarks, etc. Tubes: Day passes work after ~9am and are the way to go. Get a pocket map at a tube station or good hotel lobby. Tubes have more pick-pocket awareness advertising than Boston's Green-Line. Elsewhere: Cars: Drive on the left, and keep to the left. Watch your mirrors whilest in the #1 and #2 lanes of multi-lane highways. Passing on the inside is generally not done, and speed differential between #1 and #3 lanes is often 30-40mph (~85mph -> 50mph) (As I recall CalTrans numbers lanes out from the median(1).) Trains: Generally Reliable. At the present time the Railway Signalmen's Union is on Strike, taking off from Tues. noon to Thurs. noon, and screwing up most of the trains during that period. Word has it they ought to settle soon, or change the days they take off (last word was they're looking for a weekend off). I'm with Mike on the advice to purchase rail passes as late as possible, if you decide to do that. > I also have this fanatsy of perhaps buying an old LR and shipping it home. Well, you're not alone on that one... It might save you money, but it would certainly chew up a lot of time. Ex-Mod 109"s are plentiful at #2500, but are not old enough to be exported to the states, unless you imported it as parts, or maybe got some of those dodgey Canadian papers for it :-) If you spend time in Southern England (Bournemouth/Poole), check out the National Motor Museam at Billeau (sp? prounouned Bu-Le), about 1.5 hours by car from Heathrow. Cheers, - Bill caloccia@stratus.com Stratus Computer Ltd Central House, Lampton Road Hounslow, Middlesex, TW3 1HY, U.K. tele: +44 81 570 4433 fax: +44 81 569 4755 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 17:00:22 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 10 Aug 1994 14:51:44 -0700 To: William Caloccia , land-rover-owner@team.net From: shibumi@cisco.com (Kenton A. Hoover) Subject: Re: 'Desert' Water Bags && l/r and visiting the UK Cc: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu X-Status: Status: RO At 14:23 10/08/94, William Caloccia wrote: >> The GoreTex company made canteens out of GoreTex during the Gulf War. > > New goretex is permiable to water vapor but not to water, so does > that mean the surface evaporation occurs within the bag ? > The water in the bag becomes water vapor and travels thru the GoreTex membrane. Same idea as the sweating bag, except the water loss would be much lower. | Kenton A. Hoover Senior Systems Administrator | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1 415 324 5249 | |===========================================================================| | "I remember a time in the wilds of Afganistan. We lost our corkscrew. | | We were forced to live on food and water for many days" -- W.C. Fields | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 10 19:03:36 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: lro@team.net, jimmyp@netcom.com (Jimmy Patrick) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 1994 14:07:41 +1100 Subject: Re: import land-rover X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > Date sent: Wed, 10 Aug 1994 13:20:09 +0800 > To: lro@team.net > From: jimmyp@netcom.com (Jimmy Patrick) > Subject: import land-rover > I am presently in the market for a land-rover. I am most interested in a > swb station wagon. series II, IIA or III. I also may have occasion to spend > 3-6 months in London for business. My question is this: Should I try to buy > the land-rover here? (Any ideas on where to look?) Or should I buy one in > the UK, drive it around for a few months, and then ship it back here > (california), hassle with the DMV, pay taxes, etc. etc.????? > Do any of you have experience with this kind of activity? I think I > can get the vehicle shipped here for around 800 pounds or $1200. I have the > feeling that this may just be the tip of the iceberg in terms of > time/money/hassle factor. I have also heard that it is easier (possible) to > import pre '68 models and harder (impossible) to bring in later models. (I > did run into a fellow at the Hayward show who had imported an 88(?) Camel > Trophy diesel 110, and he had run into MAJOR hassles. I wish I knew who > that guy was.) > Any thoughts, comments, suggestions will be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance. > > > Jimmy Patick > > -- > jimmyp@netcom.com > > Jimmy, A friend just brought in a pre 1968 L. Rover plus a large amount of parts from England via container. It cost him around $1,000 US for shipping. The only unusual item U.S. Customs made him do was to clean the dirt off of the frame and under carriage before driving back from the Port of Seattle to Spokane, WA. If you want to contact him directly, E-Mail me a personal request for his name and number. You may find it difficult to locate a LHD unit in England. However, there are specialty used Rover outlets that advertise in LRO magazine that cater just to your needs. You may want to contact them before your trip. In the past, one would pay a higher rate of duty on a $50.00 US or greater value item. Then during the next 12 months, one is charged a lesser rate on the next import item. Contact the U.S. Customs people for their latest changes. Good Luck, John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 08:54:23 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: purchasing us import rovers from warwick (uk) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 09:41:12 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO ------- Forwarded Message From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Message-ID: <940811133513_71773.3457_FHM59-1@CompuServe.COM> JIMMY Patick asked about bringing back a LR from the UK. A few months ago I brought back a re-done 1962 88 LR that i purchased from Warwick 4x4 in the UK. If you want all the details contact me ;407-831-4040. benjamin g. newman.md ------- End of Forwarded Message From ccray Thu Aug 11 09:32:02 1994 Subject: LULU has a new set of shoes... To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 09:32:02 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2962 X-Status: Status: RO LULU is ready for tall cotton: WAS: 15" rims with bias, recaps. IS: 16" rims with 750x16 radials. WOW, what a difference a day makes. RIDE, HANDLING NOISE-LEVEL, GROUND-CLEARANCE, APPEARANCE, STEERING are all an order of magnitude better. I would recommend this conversion to any serious LRO. So, the rest of the story is: 1. rims bought used in UK for 25-pounds for qty=5. 2. shipped to US via air freight (ok, so this isn't the best way, but I wanted to find out how things worked). 145-pounds for shipping and packing. (but there were other things on the pallat -- say, 100-pounds for the rims). Currency conversion applies here and also to #1. 3. gas, 1/2 days vacation, $15 customs fees, $15 airport handling fee cause I live 120 miles from the airport. 4. Aircraft stripper ($19.95 for a gallon) to take off about 4 coats of NATO green. 5. About 3 evenings to sand blast them down to bare metal and hammer out a few dings. 6. I galvanized them. Steve (notajeep) said "do it" as I recall. And Mark (stl) worried about metal warpage. I think they both were right. 4 turned out great, and the 5th has serious wobble. (but it might have been there all along). OK, $60 for the galvanizing (at $0.35 per pound) but I had some other things in there -- say $45 for the rims. Probably should include $20 for gas to the galvanizing place. The rims sure looked fine when they came back. So-o-o shiny, I thought I had aluminum rims. I was tempted to put them on that way for effect, but, no. I knocked down the nubs with a carbide bit in an air grinder and put about $10 of etching acid on them The acid turned 'em a dull grey. Still looked good and thought about mounting them that way, but no. 7. Masked 'em and painted the front only Limestone white. Two coats of self etching primer plus 3 wet coats of Dupont Centari. Used an eyedropper to get paint into the cracks. The back and inside (where the tube is) is still dull grey. 8. Put a small bead of silicone on the back in the crack. 9. Know a man in the tire business -- He got me 4 Kelly Safari 750x16LT radial tires (someone on the net said he was happy with them) for $98 each and I put radial tubes in 'em for $8.50 each more. 10.Am afraid to go thru the final math. Anyway, thats how I did it. A couple of days ago, there was an offer for 4 16" rims with tires for $400 (shipping extra) and that sounds like an interesting offer -- but that's hindsite. LULU is now an interstate cruiser and these rims/tires should take a couple of hours off of the Utah trip. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 09:43:36 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: manifold menus To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 09:33:49 -0500 (CDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1970 X-Status: Status: RO OK, we got the "Manifold Destiny" booklet described by an earlier thread. It was pretty wimpy, but it did manage to drive home the cooking technique. The recipes in the back gave one a warm feeling that it might work, but most of them required prep work at home. So, at the local pub, Jan (thats the wife) and I made up the following menu that LULU is going to cook for us on the Utah trip. The plan is to take about two of the meals from home in the cooler, wrapped and ready. Some of the other meals will be 1) bought in a supermarket on the way, 2) seasoned and otherwise prepared, and 3) cooked with minimum flair. LULU's engine compartment got a gunk-down last night -- she sparkles and is cleaner than the house kitchen. 1 lunch cornbeef hash (canned) eggs potatoes bread 2 lunch polish sausage onions green peppers buns 3 lunch chicken pieces rolls onions, carrots frozen peas 4 lunch hotdogs chili buns 5 lunch ribs potatoes sauerkraut 6 lunch bbq pork tenderloin potatoes bread 7 lunch cornish stuffed hens salad from gerbes bread 8 lunch roast beef carrots, onions, potatoes, bread Of course, if this fails to meet expectations, there is always the truckstop hash-houses that do meet expectations. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 09:43:11 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: canvas bags revisited. To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 09:34:54 -0500 (CDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 947 X-Status: Status: RO Lots of cool water on the road, thanks to TerriAnne. McGukin Hardware 2525 Arapahoe Ave Boulder, CO 80302 303 443-1822 303 443-0297 (fax) Well they didn't get me the larger size (18x15), but they did deliver yesterday a "1-gallon 10"x10" scottish flax" waterbag. Cost was $14.99 with a whopping $9.50 UPS charge. It has a nice cork, but the plastic rope is going to be replaced with a manila rope this afternoon. And, I am going to fashion up some sort of hook that comes off the spare tire mount up on the bonnet. My expectations are for good cooling action in the western high country. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 09:45:15 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: test From: ludovico.magnocavallo@galactica.it (Ludovico Magnocavallo) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 94 12:53:00 +0100 Organization: GALACTICA PROFESSIONAL COMM. +39-2-29006150 X-Status: Status: RO Test message From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 18:27:43 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 16:15:47 +1100 Subject: Woodstock/60's/Land Rovers X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Dear LRO's, My first Land Rover encounter was in 1968 by a friend who owned one. Both of us were attending NAU at Flagstaff, AZ. He convinced me they were the `best 4x4 by far', however, being a graduate student, I could not afford a new one. After seeing the film `Dark of the Sun' - which featured and exposed me to Land Cruisers, I found out they were affordable at $3,000. vs $3,800. for a LR. That was a sizeable difference back then. Hence, I purchased a new 1969 Land Cruiser. So what's the Woodstock tie-in?? During the June of 1969, a bunch of us went hiking into the Grand Canyon. At a rest stop, I pulled out my keys which had a can opener on it to have lunch. Another long haired hiker saw that I had a Toyota key on my key ring and asked if I had a Land Cruiser. After confirming my choice of 4x4, he stated that he always wanted a Land Rover, but could only afford a Land Cruiser. He went to some New York state university - a 3rd year medical student. Later, Woodstock happened - and as with most youth then, we did not attend. But, when you view the film `Woodstock' closely, my New York med student friend is seen driving a new Land Cruiser offering medical help! If Land Rovers were cheaper then, you would of seen a Land Rover in the film! John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 12:12:09 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 10:40:17 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Rover Importation To: 71773.3457@compuserve.com, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Ben, Would it be possible to post the details of your experience with Warwick? I'm very curious as to what you had to go through and what you learned during your experience. Did you get a coil sprung chassis or stock? What engine did you choose? How do you like it? Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com >> ------- Forwarded Message From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Message-ID: <940811133513_71773.3457_FHM59-1@CompuServe.COM> JIMMY Patick asked about bringing back a LR from the UK. A few months ago I brought back a re-done 1962 88 LR that i purchased from Warwick 4x4 in the UK. If you want all the details contact me ;407-831-4040. benjamin g. newman.md ------- End of Forwarded Message >> From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 11:39:51 1994 From: C Taylor Sutherland III Subject: lro-digest To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 10:50:14 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text Content-Length: 69 X-Status: Status: RO If such a beast does exist, please sign me up on it. Thanks Taylor From preid@csi.compuserve.com Thu Aug 11 11:24:04 1994 Date: 11 Aug 94 12:20:29 EDT From: "R. Pierce Reid" To: "INTERNET:ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu" Subject: LULU has a new set of shoes... X-Status: Status: RO Ray: thanks for the info on the upgrade. I bought the tire/wheel set advertised for my 88 military . I drove my dad's fully restored 88 military earlier this year with the big tires and was sold. I do a lot of interstate driving and even with the OD, the military gearing is really low. these tires will be the perfect addition. I can't wait to get the net set on mine. I am currently running a bias-ply 6.5 x 16 on a military split rim. Goes anywhere, but it is noisy as sin and I can;t find good 6.5 X 16 tires here in the US. Cheers, R. Pierce Reid Columbus, OH ('62 ser IIa 88 Military. Full Mechanical Restoration... Cosmetic restoration next summer!) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 12:43:53 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 10:32:45 MST From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV To: lro@team.net Subject: Any word on '95 Discovery? X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: Any word on '95 Discovery? Has anyone heard any information on the '95 Discovery? I'm FINALLY to a point where I can add myself to the waiting list, but am now wondering if I should wait just a little more to get a '95 model. I'd like to know: 1.) Any new features? Design changes? 2.) Cost increase for '95? Also, for the UK subscribers: Any problems? (Since the Disco's been around for a while there.) And for you California subscribers: What is the sales tax for the L.A. area? Thanks, *** **** **** "Some men see things as they are and say why? * * * * * I see things as they never were and say why not?" * **** **** *** * * * -Robert Frost From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 14:21:07 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 14:37:24 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Rover on TV X-Status: Status: RO Just got back from two days of filming segments for the "Archaeology" series on The Learning Channel, a subset of the Discovery Channel. The Rover features prominently in the 'teaser', prologue and epilogue for *eight* shows, a dozen promos and at least fifteen tags for local cable TV systems...yours truly even got to be a paid extra in four episodes. The narrator is John Rhys Davies, owner of four Land Rovers and a consumate professional in front of the camera...that is until we pulled an on-camera practical joke on him and the mooned the entire crew. The premier episode (Antietam Battlefield) is Sept. 26. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 14:22:50 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 13:09:55 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: What is Happening X-Status: Status: RO Thanks to everybody that replied to my test posts. I was going into serious, as opposed to joke, withdrawl with no owners net. Apparentlly Denver had a problem with the mail server. No surprise for corp level stuff. Well I finally got myy engine back from the machine shop. After having to take up a new head rather than pin the cracked one, it is all new to include hardened seats on the exshaust side. I had the head pressure tested and magnafluxed. It is nice. Hope it preforms as good as it looks. It will probably be sometime in Sept before I get the thing put together and back in the Rover. If anybody is interested I have an itemized shop bill that I can post. This may give a general idea of what it will cost to do a rebuild. Saw the news show last night regarding Woodstock II, I spotted two Rovers. The organizer of both Woodstocks was driving a Series III, but was unable to see if it was an 88 or 109. Then they shot part of a stand-up at the front fender of a Range Rover. It was complete with Rhino bars and all. Didn't know that New York had problems with Rhino. But it might just be those wild milk cows. Anybody confirm the need for Rhino bars in rural New York? Well one more time the army is trying to send me to Korea. So I am hopeful of seeing some UN or at least Brit Rovers while in country. As a professional 46Q army photojournalist I will have my cameras with me just in case an interesting Rover comes by. Plus I will be out of artillery range, with a confirmed return airline ticket. For those that missed out, I am still collecting names of Rovers so drop me a note to be included. Have a bunch but will wait till I come back from the mystic east before a write up a list. Roy - Rovers in the Rockies and packing for the mysterious orient. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 14:53:13 1994 To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com From: Jules@learnlink.emory.edu (Sean P. Murphy) Organization: Project LearnLink: Linking Educators Everywhere! Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 15:43:29 EST Subject: Transporting a Rover? X-Status: Status: RO Does anyone in NA have any suggestions on a good method to transport a Land Rover across the continent? I'll be in Washington State in the next few months and want to bring back a Rover to Atlanta, but it's one helluva distance to drive and I don't necessary need a running Rover. Any suggestions on the cheapest way of getting one from one coast to the other? How would I find out about trucking costs and where would I arrange to have it picked up and dropped off? /========/ Sean Murphy, LearnLink Administrator !! !! !! Internet/Telnet: Jules@learnlink.emory.edu !! !! !! Phone: (404)/727-2259 /========/ For information, mail Info@learnlink.emory.edu From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 14:59:05 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 15:52:43 EST To: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ), lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: What is Happening Content-Length: 563 X-Status: Status: RO Roy writes > Then they shot part of a stand-up at the front fender of a > Range Rover. It was complete with Rhino bars and all. > Didn't know that New York had problems with Rhino. But it > might just be those wild milk cows. Anybody confirm the > need for Rhino bars in rural New York? Well, if you were driving into a mob of 100,000+ middleage hippie throwbacks looking for a good time, wouldn't *you* want the full rhino package and flamethrower option? ;-) Just remember, if *you* can remember the '60's you probably weren't at Woodstock... Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 16:28:43 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 14:16:37 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: llevitt@idcresearch.com, rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com, ROY@apple.com, CALDWELL@apple.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: What is Happening X-Status: Status: RO In message <9407117766.AA776645563@ccmailin.idcresearch.com> writes: > > > Just remember, if *you* can remember the '60's you probably > weren't at Woodstock... > > Lee > Your right. I remember the sixties. My room mate claims I never left them. But I seldom got farther East than the Height in those days Peace TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 15:28:00 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 16:17:31 EST To: Jules@learnlink.emory.edu (Sean P. Murphy), lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Transporting a Rover? Content-Length: 575 X-Status: Status: RO Sean, I'm just looking into this myself. Grab a copy of Hemmings. In the front under services there are a number of shippers listed. My understanding is that if you are flexible wrt time, you can piggyback onto another shipment. Prices listed start at $800 or so cross country but will vary significantly by carrier, actual start/end and time of year. Maybe someone has experience (good/bad) with specific cross country shippers. Who should we avoid, who's good. I'm looking into moving a car from Florida (panhandle region) to Boston. YMMV and of course, TIA, Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 17:12:01 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 17:34:46 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Rover on TV X-Status: Status: RO Lee writes: >Can they show that on public TV? ;-) That bit will be on "TV Bloopers and Practical Jokes". John Rhys didn't moon the camera...just us 'behind him' on the set as it were...while the rest of the crew howled! John Rhys is quite a character...once started on the subject of Land Rovers, he wanted to talk for hours! The art director had to come in and shoo him along to wardrobe change several times. Gave him a ROAV T-shirt and even got him to join the club! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 17:11:28 1994 Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 14:57:58 PST From: Brad Krohn To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: Transporting a Rover? X-Status: Status: RO Text item: Text_1 >Does anyone in NA have any suggestions on a good method to transport a >Land Rover across the continent? We shipped my wife's car from Texas to Oregon about four years ago at a cost of about $900. Look for "automobile transporters and drive-away companies" in the yellow pages. A simple process of dropping it off at a specified site, they load it on a flat-bed or car carrier, and then let you know when it arrives and where to pick it up. Brad Krohn From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 11 20:17:20 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: manifold destiny again From: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Dale Desprey) Reply-To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 11 Aug 94 18:11:31 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO I went to the library and picked up Manifold Destiny. Opened the cover and I could see where someone had erased a sentence once written in pencil. "A very poor book," was one reader's critique. Undaunted, I read on. The first part of the book deals with the practical "how to." The latter part consists of the recipes. What I liked: The book encourages the reader to try cooking in the engine bay. It was humorous at times. There were detailed instructions how to wrap the food in aluminum foil. Common sense rules. On the last page, "Will someone who can afford a Range Rover please send us some game recipes?" What I did not like: There seems to be a lot of self serving argument about "ready- made" vs. "ready-bought" food. The book contains a lot of what I would call "filler." Using the "finger test" to see which part of the engine is hot. If you touch a part and your finger burns, it's hot. (Sorta like putting a gun to your head and pulling the trigger to see if it is loaded). IMHO If you don't know what part is hot, and you feel you have to find out, use the back of your hand. "Manifold Destiny" is light reading. I will not know if it is a good book until I try to cook with engine heat. If you're thinking of trying cooking while you drive, pick up a copy at your library. After all, as the cover says, it is "The one! The only! Guide to cooking on your car engine!" _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Dale Desprey _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ AL045 -------- -- Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 00:22:30 1994 >From: Benjamin Allan Smith To: lro@team.net Subject: Land Rover 90 on CNN Reply-To: ranger@ugcs.caltech.edu Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 22:15:14 -0700 From: Benjamin Allan Smith X-Status: Status: RO As opposed to the usual Land Rover in the background in CNN they actually mentioned it by name. I was watching something and the comercial break hit so I figured that anything is better than commericals and I found this... The Green Buyer's Guide just came out with a list of cars. they were judged on 1)gas mileage 2)smog emmissions 3)ozone depletion materials 4)recyclability The Land Rover Defender 90 was the worst car that they listed. OH well, we can't win them all. -Benjamin Smith ranger@ugcs.caltech.edu 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 04:24:53 1994 Subject: Re: Any word on '95 Discovery? To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (LRO list) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 1994 09:53:12 +0100 (BST) From: Richard Jones In-Reply-To: <199408111731.NAA04566@transfer.stratus.com> from "DEBROWN@srp.gov" at Aug 11, 94 10:32:45 am Organization: Apricot Computers Limited Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1141 X-Status: Status: RO DEBROWN@srp.gov writes: > > FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov > Computer Graphics Specialist > AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 > SUBJECT: Any word on '95 Discovery? > > Has anyone heard any information on the '95 Discovery? I'm FINALLY to a > point where I can add myself to the waiting list, but am now wondering > if I should wait just a little more to get a '95 model. I'd like to know: The current shipping model is the '95 model year. > 1.) Any new features? Design changes? > 2.) Cost increase for '95? > > Also, for the UK subscribers: Any problems? (Since the Disco's been around > for a while there.) > > And for you California subscribers: What is the sales tax for the L.A. area? > Thanks, -- _ __ Apricot Computer Limited Tel: (+44) 21 717 7171 ' ) ) / 3500 Parkside Fax: (+44) 21 717 0123 /--' o _. /_ Birmingham Business Park / \_<_(__/ <_ BIRMINGHAM B37 7YS Email: richardj@apricot.co.uk Richard Jones United Kingdom ..!uknet!apricot!richardj From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 08:48:55 1994 Date: Fri, 12 Aug 1994 09:37:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: whatsit To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408091802.AA26873@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Oh TeriAnn...A hot land rover?....I think not...The customs people didn't want me to bring it in the country ......it seems I would have to identify and declare the agricultural products that were *growing* in the bed......If Dixon's neigbors steal rovers in this kind of shape, they have a side line of stealing garbage cans...no,...stealing the garbage *from* garbage cans.... :-)....."neads work" explains alot....it may be a "two into one" deal...could explain the "wrong engine"....but I'm still unclear on the Solex manifold with the PCV valve....has anyone ever seen this and if so what year was it? baffled...(but I'm used to that....) steve..... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 09:21:39 1994 Date: Fri, 12 Aug 1994 10:04:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: What is Happening To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: llevitt@idcresearch.com, rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com, ROY@apple.com, CALDWELL@apple.com, lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408112116.AA24934@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Ummmm yesterday I went through Woodstock and the place was dead...(*non* greatful) ...saw One rover(mine) seems all the locals have fled(mom *is* stayin' put but is like 12 miles away and litle bro showed her how to work the M-1 carbine....) Btw I ran a Repair shop in woodstock back in the late 70's and the place was crawling with landies....they all seem to be gone now....Saabs and Acuras only steve... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Thu, 11 Aug 1994, TeriAnn Wakeman wrote: > In message <9407117766.AA776645563@ccmailin.idcresearch.com> writes: > > > > > > > Just remember, if *you* can remember the '60's you probably > > weren't at Woodstock... > > > > Lee > > > > Your right. I remember the sixties. My room mate claims I never left them. > But I seldom got farther East than the Height in those days > > Peace > > > TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world > twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards > LINK: TWAKEMAN > 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, > MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 16:00:37 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Gearbox and OVLR From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Fri, 12 Aug 94 09:20:51 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) writes: > Hey Dixon, why don't you post the story of "Bates" vs "the bear". It had > me laughing for days! This year was the skeleton in the loo Sunday morning. Pam Haigh took it rather well I understand. However, two years ago it was a different story... From the July 1992 newsletter: Highlight of the weekend was the spectacular noises Al (Bates) Pilgrim made about a 5am Sunday when he thought he was going to be breakfast for a roving black bear. Bates was awakened by a rustling outside his tent and peeked out to see the bear standing over his camp trailer. The naked porker--because he can't get jammies to fit anymore-- almost zippered off his thingie trying to squeeze into his coveralls. In his has to dress for dinner, Bates managed to fall on his face and, through a gap in the tent flap, saw a second pair of black legs behind his Land Rover. Horrors... it was a family affair. Looking around the tent for a weapon, he grabbed the first blunt instrument he found. She told him bluntly to be quiet and go back to bed of she'd braid his ears. But Bates is of the Olde School and honour demanded he protect his loved ones --- whether they wanted it or not. So, armed with an AM/FM radio and country music splitting the tranquil dawn, he emerged from the tangled tent to do battle with Smokey. Then Harry started snickering. We're still not sure where he fount the five foot taall stuffed bear, but, as Harry scampered across the morning dew in his black jogging pants with an enraged Bates in hot pursuit, it was obvious we were all watching the beginning of a whole new anniversary tradition. -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 10:07:18 1994 Date: Fri, 12 Aug 1994 07:53:05 -0700 (PDT) From: James B Russell Subject: Re: whatsit To: Steven M Denis Cc: TeriAnn Wakeman , lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Well, my 1966 IIA 88 Station Wagon had the Solex and PCV valve. Still think the steering wheel (assuming it is original) puts it in the pre-66 catagory. Jim Russell ==== jrussell@netcom.com (Seattle -- San Francisco) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 13:15:27 1994 Date: Fri, 12 Aug 1994 14:03:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: llevitt@idcresearch.com, rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com, ROY@apple.com, CALDWELL@apple.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: What is Happening In-Reply-To: <9408112116.AA24934@apple.com> X-Status: Status: RO __ __ \ \ / / \ \ / /_ _ \ \/ /| | | ***** **** * **** **** /\ - - * * * * * * * | \ \ / ***** **** * * * **** \ - / * * ******* * * \ / * **** * * **** **** | | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 14:20:27 1994 From: phile@stpaul.gov (Philip J Ethier) Subject: Land Rover Discovery (fwd) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Date: Fri, 12 Aug 1994 13:53:13 -0500 (CDT) Cc: Andrew@pharm.sunysb.edu Reply-To: Andrew@pharm.sunysb.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 676 X-Status: Status: RO Forwarded from british-cars: > From: "Dr. Andrew Morris" > Subject: Land Rover Discovery > To: british-cars@autox.team.net > > I realise that the above-mentioned vehicle doesn't fall into the > classic category but I was wondering if anyone on the list has > recently purchased one and would be prepared to discuss their > opinions about the car. I am particularly interested in the manual > gearbox version (performance, fuel economy vs automatic). > Cheers, > Andrew Morris. > Department of Pharmacology, > SUNY-Stony Brook, > Stony Brook, > NY 11794. > Telephone: 516-444-3022. > FAX: 516-444-3218. > Email Andrew@pharm.sunysb.edu. > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 17:16:06 1994 Date: Fri, 12 Aug 94 13:34:02 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: Andrew@pharm.sunysb.edu, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Land Rover Discovery (fwd) X-Status: Status: RO Don't apologize for not buying a "classic"! This list covers all Land Rover models. I'm sure someone can help. John Brabyn Mill Valley, Ca 89 RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 12 16:07:30 1994 Date: 12 Aug 94 16:55:28 EDT From: "R. Pierce Reid" <70004.4011@compuserve.com> To: Landy Subject: Land Rover Heater X-Status: Status: RO Folks: Does anyone out there have a parts vehicle that they would like to sell the heater and accessories out of? Or a heater and related parts sitting in a box somewhere with nowhere to go? I I just moved to Ohio from Texas and come November - April, I am really going to wish I had a heater, esp. in a softtop! It is for a 2.25 L. '62 Series IIa Military. It has never been equipped with a heater, so there are no connections, etc., but the block is configured for heater hoses, etc. TIA R. Pierce Reid CompuServe (70004,4011) (614) 538-4571 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 13 11:30:24 1994 Date: Sat, 13 Aug 1994 13:22:25 AST From: DAVID SPENCER To: lro@stratus.com Subject: clutch plates X-Status: Status: RO seems to me that someone on LRO is driving a SeriesIII with a series IIA trans. ? I bought such a beast on friday...I could'nt pass it up for $250.00 Cnd.....Monday I am ordering a clutch plate so...which one? ....perhaps I should take the old one out first. Thanks David S. Antigonish, Nova Scotia From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 13 16:04:15 1994 Date: 13 Aug 94 16:55:21 EDT From: Alberta Science Centre <72662.3726@compuserve.com> To: RoverVille Subject: Roving Roger X-Status: Status: RO Just a quick note to say Hi! Rachel and I are in Calgary at the science museum and happened across a display hooked into Compuserve, so I thought I'd send off a quick message to let everyone know we're still alive. Had a great trip so far... We've only seen 4 Land Rovers, though. 2 in Vancouver, a 90 in Edmonton, and a billboard advertising the Disco in Edmonton. Strangely enough, we were stopped at Lynn Canyon in Vancouver, and pulled up next to a mini-van. Didn't think twice about it until we got back to the Rover and there was Dave (VE4PN) whom we'd parked next to! Imagine that! After an all too brief chat, we parted ways, but I hereby dub Lynn Canyon the official, ultra-cool Land Rover meeting place in Vancouver. Anyway, gotta let someone else play with this, so I'll be back on the net in a week or so. (Please don't reply to this address or someone else will get rather confused. ) Take Care! Uncle (if this is tuesday, this must be belgium) Roger From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 13 20:53:20 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: 2BVPZ&Courier.10cp.Roland.Raven@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: WPCP From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sat, 13 Aug 94 19:55:16 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO D%X@USUS2N#|x Thanks to all of you who asked for toys, find your messages in your mailboxes. I was in the toy store the other day and found a supply of myfavourite Range Rover again. It is made by galoob and is from their micro machines range of toys. It is a "smash up" toy. The toy is about 2 inches ling and represents a current 5 doorRange Rover in an awfull set of brichts stipes with gawdy decals on it. What is a blast about this one is that the front bumper sticks out a bit far and when you push it rearwards it actuates a soundgenerator ( run on wee battteries) that makes a breaking glasssound!! This one is always a real hoot to show off. It retails for CDN $7.99 . If you want one .......... You knowwhat to do! There are about five available. In other news.... I spent the best part of Friday on the road and in the bush withtwo AM General Hummers. Let me limit my comments as this is a LandRover net (What is the name of the 4 X 4 bbs somebody please?). The Hummer is in a class of its own. Extremly impressive piece ofkit. Incredible performance off road. If money was no object....this sucker would be part of the stable line up for sure! It appears that there are alot more closet toy collectors out therethan those who care to admit it.!!! Thats it for the minute, Rgds Robin Craig -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 13 20:24:22 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: off to the national To: lro@stratus.com Date: Sat, 13 Aug 1994 19:17:08 -0600 (MDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 588 X-Status: Status: RO I've been feverishly putting my LR pieces together. I now have a '59 tranny in my '66 109. I hope it all holds together. I already have one unexpected leak. The whole thing will have to come out again (later). So I'm off to the national -- practically in my back yard, but it could be as bad as a desert island if I break down. Wave if you see the brick-red beast with the experimental bikini. Thanks to all for springs advice, etc. T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 01:04:41 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: quick oil pressure question Date: 14 Aug 1994 05:56:06 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <9408082033.AA01706@easynet.crl.dec.com>, THE X WINDOW SYSTEM: A VMS FOR THE 90S wrote: > >I replaced the oil pressure sending unit this past weekend on >Flashman. The old one had never worked during my ownership so I'm >wondering what the normal readings should be for a 2.25l petrol >engine at idle and cruise RPMs.... tnx > >monty Monty, Sorry to say, the electric gauges were never accurate--but 40 to 60 psi is acceptable. I have a mechanical gauge and it runs 75 psi, which is on the high side. Randy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 08:52:26 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: in the movies From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sun, 14 Aug 94 07:31:33 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO I went to watch Harrison Ford in Clear and Present Dangerthe other night. As usual, much to my wife's amusemnet we could not get through the night without Solihull's product showing up here and there. Before the movie began we sat through the previews of what is coming out in the near future. During the promo for Slyvester Stallone's new movie called the specialist there was a snippett that showed what appearred to be a 109 station wagon getting blown off a road and falling in flames of a great height. It only lasted about 2 1/2 seconds but that was plenty of time to id it as a Land Rover for me! On to the main attraction, sadly Harrison Ford is still driving Mercury / Ford products, but the bad guys, well thay have more taste. They use a pair of light blue four door Range Rovers throughout. I stayed right to the end of the movie to see if there were any credits for the supply of the Range Rovers, if there was I didnt see it. While I was at a Land Rover function recently I had the chance to talk to Glen Campbell who runs Land Rovers California based product placement program. He was saying that this was the kind of movie that they would not loan vehciles for as it was the bad guys who profit from drugs who would be using the vehciles. he was well aware that if the Director really wanted the vehciles he would get them somewhere else, but this was not the kind of image that the company wanted to be associated with. Catch you all later, Robin Craig, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 10:33:29 1994 From: rich@online.comm-data.com (Richard P. Biby) Subject: Hello (I'm new) and are WTB/WTS OK? To: lro@stratus.com Date: Sun, 14 Aug 1994 11:26:24 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2859 X-Status: Status: RO Hello all. Greetings from Washington, DC. This is kind of a strange Rover town in that we have a lot of diplomats and others who have lived in countrys where Land Rovers were a way of life. No place to actually use the 4W part of 'em, but everyone like them. I've had a 57, 72 & a 67. I brought the 67 over from England -- also something easy to do with a large port nearby. I've got one more on the way. Long story, but I guess it don't cost anything to send, and you can always hit 'n'. I'm one of those over zellest weekend-wariors who always gets into project thinking I actually have the time, interest, money and working space to fix these things. Not the case :-( So I've managed to dump/trade or sell everything that is not in TOP shape. That is why I don't have a Rover now :-) So with a little more money then smarts, my old Rover mechanic (vertually the only guy in the DC area) is living in Denmark and searches for a clean Rover every now and then for his old pals. Guess I'm lucky. I'm getting some series III sight unseen. Kind of exciting. Kind of fund. Kind of a danger. I'm hoping for the best. Yesterday morning another friend of mine (old VW nut like myself) towed a series II up from North Carolina for me. I did not ask for this,but he figured he owed me one. I'm still not sure what he thought he owed me, but I got a Rover sitting in front of my house I don't want. So this leads to my next question: Are Want To Buy and Want to Sell articles welcome? I'll take a chance on this (I can take the flames if it's not OK). One RED Series II pickup with a Chevrolet engine FOR SALE in the DC area. Reasonable prices assured. One more thing -- I don't know what happened, but my wife is HOT to get a Disco. We have been through the entire list of 4WDs, from Suzukis through Monteros (sp?) and have absolutely fallen for the Disco (like I'm supposed to be REAL unhappy about it). Problem is (as most of you know) getting your paws on one to drive is next to impossible. So, I'm looking for someone selling one, some dealer who will actually let me test drive one, or the best thing, some kind disco owner who will share comments with me. I've seen a lot of requests for comments but folks here over the past couple of seeks, but I have not seen many reply comments. Any help would be great. Well, Rover on! I look forward to being an active member of this list and thank everyone for the comments I am sure will be coming (flames are inevitable if you ever mention WTS). -- Rich Biby | Communications Data Services, Inc. rich@comm-data.com KD4DSX | 6105-E Arlington Blvd, Falls Church, VA 22044 we are the people | (703) 534-0034 FAX:(703) 534-7884 (800) 441-0034 people our parents | "I am not an idiot, but I play one on usenet!" warned us about | Root Emergency Procedure: type "rm -rf / " From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 16:35:23 1994 Date: 15 Aug 1994 09:23:06 +1200 From: DAVID DEAN Subject: Power Take Off Info for SI/SII? To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Reply-To: "David L. Dean" Organization: Lincoln University X-Envelope-To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO LROers, I'm looking for any information regarding the utilisation of the power take off facility on the older LRs. If anyone has any experience or info sources on parts, kits, or attachments, please let me know. I'm especially interested in hooking up a log splitter (screw or hydraulic) Please cc me directly as I'm on the Digest mode and won't get the message until tommorow. Cheers, ------- (David L. Dean - Department of Economics & Marketing) ------- ----------- (Lincoln University, Canterbury, New Zealand) ----------- --- ("sober fearless pursuit of truth, beauty, & righteousness") ---- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 17:22:11 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: PCV's and Solex's From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sun, 14 Aug 94 16:40:46 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Steve, I went down to see my little hord of Land Rovers today (a friend is interested in buying one of them to restore) and while looking under the bonnets guess what I came across... Yes, a 109 pick-up with the Solex and PCV valve assembly. The 109 is a '68 I believe, so it puts it right near where yours should be. This is a Canadian LR, as opposed to the US spec, so if yours is a close brother it should have markers on the side of the front wings. (Note: markers, not marker lights. Reflector could be a better term.) I believe this aspect was the only one that made you suspect the registration. Everything else matched, and this puts the last point to bed. Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 17:22:07 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Hello (I'm new) and are WTB/WTS OK? From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sun, 14 Aug 94 16:46:27 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO rich@online.comm-data.com (Richard P. Biby) writes: > Hello all. Greetings from Washington, DC. This is kind of a strange > Rover town in that we have a lot of diplomats and others who have > lived in countrys where Land Rovers were a way of life. No place > to actually use the 4W part of 'em, but everyone like them. I had a taxi driver do a very sharp u-turn and come back up tto me at a set of lights near Dale's the other night. A black chap, obviously a recent arrival from east Africa, started off by exclaiming "This is my history! Where can I get one!, Is this for sale? Where can I get one?". Sadly I told him the big green beastie isn't for sale, but there are available and there is a club, so I sent him off to McDermott's place seeking Land Rovers... :-) This is the second time this has happened to me this month... :-) Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 11:21:31 1994 Date: Mon, 15 Aug 1994 09:14:14 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: lro@stratus.com, x92nca@esseX.stfx.ca Subject: Re: clutch plates X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 506 X-Status: Status: RO > > seems to me that someone on LRO is driving a SeriesIII with a > series IIA trans. ? I bought such a beast on friday...I could'nt > pass it up for $250.00 Cnd.....Monday I am ordering a clutch plate > so...which one? > > ....perhaps I should take the old one out first. > > Thanks David S. > > Antigonish, Nova Scotia > The clutch is part of the *engine*. But maybe they changed the fly wheel too. In any case you're better off with the 9.5" clutch from the series III. Regards, Bill G. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 14 23:54:05 1994 To: "David L. Dean" Cc: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Power Take Off Info for SI/SII? From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sun, 14 Aug 94 22:24:41 -0500 In-Reply-To: <2814471451F@kea.lincoln.ac.nz> Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO DAVID DEAN writes: > I'm looking for any information regarding the utilisation of the power > take off facility on the older LRs. > > If anyone has any experience or info sources on parts, kits, or > attachments, please let me know. > > I'm especially interested in hooking up a log splitter (screw or hydraulic) I have not see the pto used in this fashion. The usual course of action as I have seen it done is to put a hydraulic pump on the lh top of the engine and get a larger fan belt. The hydraulic pump would use a resevoir either welded to the frame inside the engine bay, or mounted to the front bumper. (My 88 pick-up has the resevoir mounted on the frame inside the negine bay, my 88 hardtop has it mounted on the bumper. Georges 109 pick-up used a 6" channel tube for the resevoir/bumper assembly). The log splitters have either hung forward, like a long ram, or crosswise along the bumper. These arrangements saves one the problems with actually finding a pto in the first place, and you can utilise standard hydraulic parts from automotive supply houses. Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 17:53:49 1994 Date: Mon, 15 Aug 1994 15:43:49 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu, rsrose@cco.caltech.edu Subject: Re: clutch plates X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 1349 X-Status: Status: RO > > Determined by the throw-out mechanism, which is part of the transmission, > so I would guess to be IIA. But to check, look for the clutch slave > cylinder. It its bolted to a bracket on the right side of the bell > housing, pushes down on a lever, the lever attaches to a shaft, > the shaft goes into the bell housing, > and if you can see all this clearly on the outside of the bell housing, > then get IIA parts. A series III slave cylinder will be bolted directly > to the bell housing in a front to back orientation, and no mechanism > will be visible; it's all in the bell housing. Get III parts if this > seems like the case. At this time, IIA and III used 9.5 clutches. > The disks are the same, but the pressure plates differ in that the > III is minus a collar attached to the diaphragm spring; this collar meets > the throw out bearing. I have ordered a IIA cover, and removed the collar > for a series III, but it is a chore and must be done not to damage the > spring. > > Randy > Sorry, but I disagree with this. The sIIa throwout mechanism will work the diaphram clutch pressure plate of the sIII just fine*. This is the best of both worlds; the sIIa throwout (runs in the trans oil, won't burn out, water proof) with the sIII 9.5" diaphram clutch (less likely to slip). R, bg * Mine's been working for 50K miles From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 02:16:17 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Mon, 15 Aug 1994 08:08:21 +0100 From: IAN@lab0.vet.edinburgh.ac.uk Mmdf-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at uk.ac.ed.castle Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@stratus.com Date: Mon, 15 Aug 1994 08:07:55 +0000 Subject: Re: Thoughts on the Discovery Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > One more thing -- I don't know what happened, but my wife is HOT to > get a Disco. We have been through the entire list of 4WDs, from > Suzukis through Monteros (sp?) and have absolutely fallen for the > Disco (like I'm supposed to be REAL unhappy about it). Problem is > (as most of you know) getting your paws on one to drive is next to > impossible. So, I'm looking for someone selling one, some dealer > who will actually let me test drive one, or the best thing, some > kind disco owner who will share comments with me. I've seen a lot > of requests for comments but folks here over the past couple of seeks, > but I have not seen many reply comments. Any help would be great. Well, this is probably not what your after, but I've driven all 4 of the main types of Landrovers (88/109, 90/110, Discovery & Range Rover). The leaf-sprung have the most charisma, but are the hardest to drive with their pretty rigid suspension. The 90/110 are great working vehicles, but lack a number of luxury items. The Dicovery is a great vehicle but I find the narrow, high body sways uncomfortably on the road (this could be just a perception thing -- the 110 is supposed to be a working vehicle and can therefor do without refinements ;-) The Range Rover I find the best: It doesn't have the bucket seats of the discovery, so it's comfortable to sit in; it's wide, so you don't notice the body-roll so much; and it's got most of the luxuries the Discovery has. The 'Rovers only down side is it's image -- it's a toffs car :-( ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. #======================================================================# Land Rover: A work-horse that was meant to survive the charge of an adult bull rhino and be field-stripped in the jungle with essentially a screwdriver and a crescent wrench. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 07:50:52 1994 From: Robert Meredith Subject: Any info on landies in Aus To: land-rover-owner@team.net Date: Mon, 15 Aug 94 13:38:10 BST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85.2.1] X-Status: Status: RO Hi, I've got a friend who is going to work near Sydney for a year from the UK. He has looked into shipping his 1976 109" 2.25l out but he thinks the cost is prohibitive, about »1400. What he would like to know is this, 1) The address of any land rover clubs, magazines etc in Australia. 2) The rough price of series IIa's and III'si and their availibilty around the Sydney ares. 3) Anything else that a landie fan should know before going to Australia. Cheers, Rob Meredith. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 11:12:14 1994 From: /G=Hui/S=Ben/OU2=IL02M/OU=ILBH/P=MOT/A=MOT/C=US/@email.mot.com Date: 15 Aug 94 10:58:43 -0600 To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: those little models X-Status: Status: RO the other day i was at the local swapmeet and found myself a mint condition matchbox series one with the matchbox box, identicle to the one in lrw. what a great find!!!! i suppose the 18.00 seemed a bit much to pay for one little model until i got home and double checked the value of the thing against the one in the magazine.wow what a difference the magazine suggested the average price for a mint car in the box was worth 25-35 pound!!! hope i can find a couple more From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 13:10:03 1994 Date: Mon, 15 Aug 94 11:03:47 MST From: DEBROWN@SRP.GOV To: lro@team.net Subject: Test... please ignore X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: Test... please ignore test. *** **** **** "Some men see things as they are and say why? * * * * * I see things as they never were and say why not?" * **** **** *** * * * -Robert Frost From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 13:31:31 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 15 Aug 1994 11:15:30 -0700 To: ranger@envy.ugcs.caltech.edu, lro@team.net From: shibumi@cisco.com (Kenton A. Hoover) Subject: Re: Land Rover 90 on CNN X-Status: Status: RO At 22:15 11/08/94, Benjamin Allan Smith wrote: >The Green Buyer's Guide just came out with a list of cars. they were judged >on 1)gas mileage > 2)smog emmissions > 3)ozone depletion materials > 4)recyclability >The Land Rover Defender 90 was the worst car that they listed. >OH well, we can't win them all. > >-Benjamin Smith > ranger@ugcs.caltech.edu > 1972 Land Rover Series III 88 Re: (4) But since it will last forever, you'll never need to worry about recycling. :-) | Kenton A. Hoover Senior Systems Administrator | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1 415 324 5249 | |===========================================================================| | "I remember a time in the wilds of Afganistan. We lost our corkscrew. | | We were forced to live on food and water for many days" -- W.C. Fields | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 00:23:08 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Starting a 2.25 Diesel! To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 15 Aug 94 15:12:34 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO Hello all, Well I nearly have my Series 1 going, but I cannot start the Diesel, and I believe that the motor is not cranking over fast enough. So has any-one out there ever rebuilt a 2.25 Diesel, and if so, did they have trouble starting it the first time, and was it easier to start the second time? I tried putting a fully charged N70Z heavy duty battery on it on the week-end and it gobbled up in one attempt, and I did not even crank it over for 1 minute!! I cannot roll start it yet, as I have to get an engine pipe made for it, so can any one think of another way to start it, besides putting 24V through the starter motor? I do not wish to put 24V through it as the starter gets quite hot as it is, and I had to mail order the current starter motor from South Australia, as the only place in Victoria that would sell me a starter, wanter $1200! or $900 with a trade in. Also should it be this hard to start? Also could any one that owns a 2.25 diesel, give me an idea of what sort milage to expect out of the motor. ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 15:48:15 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: clutch plates Date: 15 Aug 1994 20:40:34 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <00982E36.D263FEA0.7040@essex.stfx.ca>, DAVID SPENCER wrote: >seems to me that someone on LRO is driving a SeriesIII with a >series IIA trans. ? I bought such a beast on friday...I could'nt >pass it up for $250.00 Cnd.....Monday I am ordering a clutch plate >so...which one? > >....perhaps I should take the old one out first. > >Thanks David S. > >Antigonish, Nova Scotia Determined by the throw-out mechanism, which is part of the transmission, so I would guess to be IIA. But to check, look for the clutch slave cylinder. It its bolted to a bracket on the right side of the bell housing, pushes down on a lever, the lever attaches to a shaft, the shaft goes into the bell housing, and if you can see all this clearly on the outside of the bell housing, then get IIA parts. A series III slave cylinder will be bolted directly to the bell housing in a front to back orientation, and no mechanism will be visible; it's all in the bell housing. Get III parts if this seems like the case. At this time, IIA and III used 9.5 clutches. The disks are the same, but the pressure plates differ in that the III is minus a collar attached to the diaphragm spring; this collar meets the throw out bearing. I have ordered a IIA cover, and removed the collar for a series III, but it is a chore and must be done not to damage the spring. Randy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 20:23:39 1994 Date: Mon, 15 Aug 1994 20:04:03 -0500 (CDT) From: David John Place Subject: Re: whatsit To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU, lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408052142.AA18009@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO I haven't read all the replys in my mailbox since I have been on holidays, but for the Quebec LR, why not check the spring shackle serial number on the passenger side. It will tell you exactly shat year you have. Post the number and someone from Europe (sorry don't have the name in front of me) who bought the micro fiche info on the production runs will tell ;you exactly when it was built and whn shipped etc. Dave VE4PN From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:22:42 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 10:18:25 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com, CXKS46A@prodigy.com Subject: Re: clutch plates X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 1590 X-Status: Status: RO > the "fingers" are naked. > You can't run a Series III plate on the IIa That's the point, almost. My sIIa "runs in oil" throw-out pushes directly on the "naked" fingers. You can run a sIII plate on a sII. When I changed the clutch, I also changed the fly wheel because I wanted the three dowel pin alignment. There was a disscussion awhile back about that subject. The sII(a) has two pins @ 180 degrees. The sIII has three pins on 120 degree spacing. To put a sIII 9.5" diaphram clutch on a sII(a) you have three choices. 1) pull one pin; This can work but, you run the risk of having the pressure plate be off or slip off center, causing some imbalance. 2) drill for two pins; Requires a machine shop to set up the f' wheel on the mill with a rotary table. The best solution if done right, the worst if done wrong. 3) change to a sIII fly wheel; Identical to the sII(a) f' wheel but the timming marks are missing. I hand stamped them on the one I had. The flange of the throw-out bearing sleeve just pushes on the "naked" fingers just like the silly plastic thing of the sIII bearing does. There is virtually NO wear between these two parts because as soon as they come in contact, they spin together, with the forces taken on the ball bearing, swimming in the spa of 90 wt gear oil inside the trans. If you measure carefully, you will see that the important distance from the face of the fly wheel to the top of the fingers is within spec. R, bg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 15 23:25:54 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: trouble in paradise From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Mon, 15 Aug 94 21:58:38 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Ok boys and girls, here's some thing that I think we will see little of because of the furore it will cause. According to what I understand, from a number of trade sources and from a litlle rooting around of my own there is an almighty stink at Solihull that the factory would like to keep under the carpet. Apparently over the years a number of vehicles have dissapaeared from the factory in some way or another. Whether they were sold to a scrap merchant and supposed to have been destroyed or ones that have been spirited away, rumours of this kind of activity have been around for donkeys years. With marque such as Land Rover some one will always try to lift some thing eventuallly. Kind of li ke the Johnny Cash song, one piec e at a time. Well good thiungs always come to an end, and through greed and stupidity or perhaps double cross and jealousy some body has been rumbled. Appararently a White Dsicovery that was a "press" vehicle was the item that was recognised on the streets. I can not mention names as all of this is before the courts as I understand. it will be interesting to see if the big two LRO and LRW do anything on this. It might be a bit close to home for them. What can any of you in the UK tell us about this, I think for somebody accross the pond in the "mother land " there may be more info on the grapevine. In other news I understand that Mike Hallett is on the move to International Off Roader magazine, he has been the technical man at a couple of "other" 4 X 4 mags in the UK for a long time, will be interesting to see what becomes of this. Best regards Robin Craig, Ottawa, Ontario, Canada -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 03:06:03 1994 Date: 16 Aug 1994 08:50:28 +0000 From: Duncan Rose Subject: Range-Rover Diff Oil Level To: LRO - post message X-Status: Status: RO Differential Oil Level - Any Help / Experience I run a 1972, 3.5 litre V8, R-Rover based, Eagle RV kit car. This is basically a CJ7 lookalike fibreglass body sitting on a 3x2 inch box chassis with full range-rover running gear and suspension. I changed the oil in the front diff last weekend, but was uncertain about the maximum fill level. I filled via the highest plug near the UJ as specfied in the haynes manual, however this consumed over 2 litres of oil compared with the stated 1.7 litre capacity. However, on the front of the diff there is a second plug about 2 inchs lower, not mentioned in the manual, is this the max fill level ? - any help ... (( Modifications are: shortened prop shaft, heavy duty RR springs, PAS, RS5000 shockers, 16 inch electric cooling fan and a small 1500kg winch. This weekend I plan to replace the twin Stromberg 175's with a milled down inlet manifold and a single big Weber. This should give better low end performance combined with better fuel consuption. )) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 08:43:11 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 09:21:53 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: clutch plates X-Status: Status: RO I think we are talking about two different pressure plates here. The Series II and IIa mechanism (which runs in oil) and is basically repairable has a triangular-shaped flange where the "fingers" of the pressure plate meet. The throw-out bearing rides on this. For the Series III with the replaceable (non-serviceable) throw-out bearing made of some [shudder] plastic resin :-0, the "fingers" are naked. The confusion is brought about by the fact that there was both a 9" disc for the II-IIa, supplanted by the 9.5" for the late IIa (date of change, anyone?), then the Series III revision in late 1971. You can't run a Series III plate on the IIa mechanism, but you can run a 9.5" disc/pressure plate. Here are some part numbers I have: Series IIa pressure plate 9.5": Borg & Beck 75698 Vera 75698/11 Series III pressure plate, 9,5": Vera 75699 9" clutch disc: Arrow 86 Borg & Beck 52509 9.5" clutch disc: AP NHB 1527 CEW 51226/36 Vera HB1527 Note the similarities on some of the part numbers. Clutch discs/plates must be very similar to bearings in that the same number is used across a number of manufacturer's lines. This makes it easy to "cross-over" parts. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 09:02:34 1994 Date: 16 Aug 94 09:53:53 EDT From: "R. Pierce Reid" <70004.4011@compuserve.com> To: Landy Subject: Land Rovers sighted in sci-fi movie X-Status: Status: RO Folks: In case noone has seen it, probably one of the best Land Rover Movies is called "A Crack in the Earth." It is a prototypical '50s sci-fi movie (with the same cast and director as the Night of the Triffids). The movie is really kind of humerous (when you look at it from today's perspective) and a really entertaining sci-fi movie (even if you are not a sci-fi fan!) The movie is FULL of Land Rovers -- mostly Series 1's. I am not sure what year it was made, so I can't tell if I saw some II's or IIa's, but the close-ups were Series I's. There are some great Land Rover scenes, with Land Rovers dodging falling boulders (as an aside, some of the rocks were real and the star almost got killed when a "fake" land slide turned into a real one and dropped rocks all over the front of his Landy). Other scenes have Landy's splashing splashing through rivers, etc. The movie plays fairly regularly on AMC (American Movie Classics) on Cable. This network has no commercials, so taping it is a breeze if you are so inclined! I bet Blockbuster video also has it, but never checked. It was just on this past sinday, and for Land Rover fans, it's a don't miss. Cheers, R. Pierce Reid From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:10:38 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Subject: Upstate NY: Bambi Bars In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 12 Aug 94 07:55:23 BST." <199408120655.HAA13842@chunnel.uk.stratus.com> Date: Tue, 16 Aug 94 13:01:34 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO > Range Rover. It was complete with Rhino bars and all. Didn't > know that New York had problems with Rhino. But it might just > be those wild milk cows. Anybody confirm the need for Rhino > bars in rural New York? Well, I've seen more than a few deer-mangled cars, and I've seen a Kawasaki speed bike that was totaled (dead cow in the middle of the road - bent frame, rider broke his arm and/or collerbone). When they're in season (grazing season) there is a 15 mile stretch of the NYS Thruway (I-90 from the Mass. border) where they regularly kill 10 or so deer or cars (or both at the same time) per night. (Personally, I'd rather hunters got 'em than the motorists, though re-populating timber wolves would be better than either of those...) ---- As for '95 disco's: were the 300 Tdi engines introduced in '94 or '95 ? From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 14:28:55 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Crack in the World To: 70004.4011@compuserve.com (R. Pierce Reid) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 94 13:02:05 EDT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <940816135353_70004.4011_FHT78-1@CompuServe.COM>; from "R. Pierce Reid" at Aug 16, 94 9:53 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] X-Status: Status: RO > > Folks: > > In case noone has seen it, probably one of the best Land Rover Movies is called > "A Crack in the Earth." It is a prototypical '50s sci-fi movie (with the same > cast and director as the Night of the Triffids). The movie is really kind of > humerous (when you look at it from today's perspective) and a really > entertaining sci-fi movie (even if you are not a sci-fi fan!) > > The movie is FULL of Land Rovers -- mostly Series 1's. I am not sure what year > it was made, so I can't tell if I saw some II's or IIa's, but the close-ups were > Series I's. There are some great Land Rover scenes, with Land Rovers dodging > falling boulders (as an aside, some of the rocks were real and the star almost > got killed when a "fake" land slide turned into a real one and dropped rocks all > over the front of his Landy). Other scenes have Landy's splashing splashing > through rivers, etc. > > The movie plays fairly regularly on AMC (American Movie Classics) on Cable. > This network has no commercials, so taping it is a breeze if you are so > inclined! I bet Blockbuster video also has it, but never checked. It was just > on this past sinday, and for Land Rover fans, it's a don't miss. > > Cheers, > > R. Pierce Reid > > > Actually, it is called "A Crack in the *World*", and was made in '64 or '65 (I think). I can *vaguely* recall seeing it when it first came out at the drive-in in our '60 SII 88 soft top. (Someday I will write up an account of our Rover at the drive-ins.....). "The Dah" was in one of his usual pesky-moods (now where did I get mine from??) and kept on flashing his headlights at the screen everytime a Rover passed by (as we typically did then and now to real rovers). Needless to say, the crowd was not amused, but we sure were! We've got this thing on tape but I've never been able to sit through it all in one sitting.....it is boring as all hell, except for the Rover shots (esp the opening caravan) and the part when they blow the thermo- nuclear device down deep to bust through the mantle of the earth (they are trying to tap into a rich source of energy-the molten center of the earth).....that approach does not work and they cause all sorts of trouble for you and me. rd/danige From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:13:04 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 13:04:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: whatsit To: David John Place Cc: TeriAnn Wakeman , lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Ok ......I figure the repair job on the right front frame horn went like this: "Hey! what do we have around here in the way of steel,I gotta weld up this frame!" ....Let's see...I've got a lenght of old rail road track, the end of a coal shovel,a rusty roll of bailing wire ,two dozen bent nails,and four square feet of 3 inch armour plate... which do you want?" "Bring it all and turn on the welder,will ya'? "....... Ummmmmm I think the numbers*might* be hard to read....... steve..... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:19:03 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 13:12:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Steering Relay X-Status: Status: RO Hi all, just a simple quick question. (if there is such a thing) How do you lubricate the steering relay with 90weight? The RN parts book sez "requires regular lubrication" but in looking at it, It dosen't look that easy. Every thing else seems ok. steering box, SPH's etc. But I can feel that something needs lubed and the bottom of the relay shows oil seepage. Thanks for all help Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:22:41 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 13:15:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: clutch plates To: MR ALEXANDER P GRICE Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <013.01117893.CXKS46A@prodigy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO And the plot,like the oil in my swivels, thickens............ *IF* you have a *late* 2a DIAPHRAM pressure plate (no more little rovers?) which is the one with the little tapered fingers holding the release collar,uou can remove the collar and *PRESTO* you have a series 3 pressure plate....really I wonder about the distances between the 2a bearing face and the series3 release fingers....the plate on the late 2 a being the same as the 3 with the interposition of a release collar would have me worring about the mechanism running out of travel...... the 2a will take a S3 clutch housing,I believe....... but I babble....... steve..... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:33:28 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 10:22:05 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Must we nickname the Land-Rover? X-Status: Status: RO I've tried to hold my peace but can't. I know I'm not alone in finding the nickname "Landy" to be most offensive. I feel that this sort of term puts the Land-Rover in league with tacky, nasty little beasts such as the Daihatsu Rocky and the Suzuki Samuri, not to mention the Isuzu Amigo. I've seen "Rangey" too. Yuck! Must we? In the latest newsletter from the Northwest Land-Rover Group (Washington State), there is a hot news tidbit that Land-Rover has actually been working on a project to compete with these tow-behind-the-RV and zip-around-the-high-school- parking-lot toys. Actually sounds like a good rig, using Defender 90 axles, aluminum body (naturally) and a 16-valve, twin-cam four-cylinder engine (a diesel to be available, too). One of the features of the Land-Rover that should be a big selling point to the RV crowd (big market in the U.S.) is that you can put free-wheeling hubs on all four wheels which makes for nice towing. Apparently the infusion of BMW cash has breathed life into a stalled project. Let's hope that the Land-Rover Marketing types have better sense than to take advantage of the already available and most egregious nickname of "Landy" for this new product. I certainly give BMW credit for having better taste. Jeeps are only famous, the Land-Rover is legendary. Let's treat it with more respect, not reduce it to side-show infamy. Thanks for your ear. Granville ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ [ Granville Pool | 52 80" Series I (gutted, project) ] [ mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net | 59(?) 88" hardtop (parts) ] [ 2601 Road I, #0 ("Road-I-Land") | 61(?) 88" Ser IIa sta wag (project)] [ Redwood Valley, CA 95470 | 70 88" Series IIa "station wagon" ] [ (707) 485-7220 | 73 88" Series III hardtop ] [ Land-Rover's first because | 74 88" Series III hardtop (project)] [ Land-Rovers last! | (?yr) Ausin Champ 4x4 (project) ] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 12:29:39 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 13:24:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: off to the national To: "T.F. Mills" Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199408140117.TAA22045@mercury.cair.du.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO oh no.....i hope he didn't put the late throw out bearing housing on the early bell housing.....the studs all line up ......*but* the gasket surface misses the mark for a half of an inch on the bottom....could this be the leak????????stay tuned folks.......and guys? *PLEASE* don't you ever do that.......my neighbor did.....had the tranny out 3 times ...I learned some *REALLY* bad words....... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Sat, 13 Aug 1994, T.F. Mills wrote: > I've been feverishly putting my LR pieces together. I now have a '59 > tranny in my '66 109. I hope it all holds together. I already have > one unexpected leak. The whole thing will have to come out again > (later). So I'm off to the national -- practically in my back yard, > but it could be as bad as a desert island if I break down. Wave if > you see the brick-red beast with the experimental bikini. Thanks to > all for springs advice, etc. > > > > T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu > University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 13:00:38 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 13:51:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: Starting a 2.25 Diesel! To: Craig Murray Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9408150512.AA18877@emu.ocs.cpsg.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO ummmmmm I guess you were away when I had my last Rover"desesel"tirade..... sigh..... I don't think you should be cranking the starter for that long...I believe that 30 seconds is the recomended time...with 2 to 5 mins. between attempts... 1. you *must* have fuel to the distributor pump....see the priming directions in the book.. 2. you must have fuel to the injectors..break loose the fitting at the injector while cranking and watch for spray..*DANGER* they say,as this is enough pressure to force fuel through you skin or eyes....take the normal precautions! gloves and eye shields etc ! 3. the glow plugs gotta work....all of 'em!.....leave 'em on for a dog's age, and feel the end where the wires go on and they should be warm(ish) 4. This puppy has to *SPIN* to start....no "ungrunkagrunkagrunka" stuff here,gotta have"wirrrrrrrootaarootarota!"check for grounds and stuff ....the bad connections get hot! so it can be easy to find them... 5. 24 volts will work fine...for a short time...do not crank for more than 10 seconds...there is a device that gives 24 volts for starting and switches to 12 for running and charging..little bro. has used one for years on his MB 240-D...(and you thought Rover starters are expensive?!?) 6. feel free to use a torch to heat the intake manifold...this is common practice on larger engines that do not have glow plugs....some engines(the old ford transit,for instance) had one *huge* glow plug in the inlet manifold....heaven help the fool that sprayed starting fluid in that one!(NO starting fluid in the rover,..OK?) My rebuild started on the 3rd revolution.......but it never ran worth beans....20 t0 22 US mpg......not worth the trouble in my book.....(now that little Nissan.....) steve....... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 13:03:20 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 13:57:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: those little models To: /G=Hui/S=Ben/OU2=IL02M/OU=ILBH/P=MOT/A=MOT/C=US/@email.mot.com Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <"Macintosh */PRMD=MOT/ADMD=MOT/C=US/"@MHS> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Did anyone post about the *REPRODUCTION* series 1 matchbox ? I can buy them here at toys R us for less than 3 dollars.....it comes with the repro. box and all......i hope your find says "made in England" on the bottom and not "made in China" for the folks that didn't get in on Jan's"roverfest"...this is a good chance to pick up your own mini rover....its a real boffo piece...no gummy man...he's metal in this one......:-( steve.... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 13:22:33 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 14:15:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: Steering Relay To: Jon Humphrey Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO which style?......some have a bolt in the top of the shaft and another at right angles to it in the top side...take them both out,introduce the oil into the side hole and stop when it glooops out the top one.....(old) others you remove 2 of the bolts around the top ring and splooge it in one side and watch the other..(new) I use a trigger oil gun...they are sloooow with the 90wt in them,but you don't make such a piggy-mess that way..... steve...... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Tue, 16 Aug 1994, Jon Humphrey wrote: > Hi all, just a simple quick question. (if there is such a thing) > How do you lubricate the steering relay with 90weight? > The RN parts book sez "requires regular lubrication" but in looking at it, > It dosen't look that easy. > Every thing else seems ok. steering box, SPH's etc. But I can feel that > something needs lubed and the bottom of the relay shows oil seepage. > Thanks for all help > Jon > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 13:51:16 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 94 11:24:24 PST From: Bruce Harding To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Steering Relay X-Status: Status: RO You remove 2 of the bolts on top of the relay. You dump 90wt. in one of the bolt holes. The othe hole act as a vent. Fill until 90 wt starts comming out of this vent hole. Bruce Harding Hi all, just a simple quick question. (if there is such a thing) How do you lubricate the steering relay with 90weight? The RN parts book sez "requires regular lubrication" but in looking at it, It dosen't look that easy. Every thing else seems ok. steering box, SPH's etc. But I can feel that something needs lubed and the bottom of the relay shows oil seepage. Thanks for all help Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 15:12:40 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 15:57:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Steering relay X-Status: Status: RO Thanks every body, for the help. I think I can get oil in it it now. One note of something I rigged up for getting 90w into the transmission and it works for the steering box in the wing also. I took a 90degree brass compression ell, like for a dishwasher, and put on a length of some 1/2" clear poly tubing. If you take out the rubber hole plug on the side of the trans cover, the tube fits right in the fill hole on the side of the trans case and you can sit in the drivers seat and fill up the trans till it flows over. It's a little harder to judge on the steering box so you might get a little overflow. Maybe this could make life a little easier for all. Thanks again Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 21:14:43 1994 Date: Tue, 16 Aug 1994 21:05:24 -0500 (CDT) From: David John Place Subject: Re: Steering relay To: Jon Humphrey Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO For putting 90wt oil into the trans and diffs etc. there is a unit made for this. It is a pump like you get with some hand creams etc. It is made for 1 gallon jugs and it screws on to the cap hole. You simply pump it and watch the oil in the clear plastic tube it comes with. Mine is a marine type and it comes with a screw fitting for putting into the fill hole on the leg of the motor. If you cant find it in an auto supply store, go to the marine dealers, they will have it. OMC for one make it and for about $10, it save lots of mess. I can fill my trans from the centre seat door using this unit so it is a nice rig for on the road type work. I think I saw one on Roger's Indy 1 rig when I met him in Vancouver lst week. Dave VE4PN From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 08:54:34 1994 Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 09:29:34 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: New Book X-Status: Status: RO I have just received a new book in the mail, one that will go onto the silent auction table at the Mid-Atlantic Land Rover Rally. So far I've resisted the urge to open it up, as I figure a sealed, clean book might sell for more than one with a bunch of grubby, 90wt finger prints all over the pages. Anyway, it is "The Great Adventure" a pictorial history of *all* of the Camel Trophy events. As it is published in Switzerland (in English, French and German), it is expensive, $65US. If I can get the price down in a bulk purchase, would anyone be interested, or is this just too much for a book? It's a large format, coffee-table sized book, maybe 12 X 16", 200+ pages and virtually all color prints. My college best friend who works at RJR came through with a bunch of Camel Trophy goodies that will be given away at the rally: T-shirts (with a really nifty image of a Disco bonnet-deep in the muck), web belts, pens, pins, even engraved Zippo lighters. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 08:43:27 1994 Date: 17 Aug 94 09:32:51 EDT From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com> To: ALL LRO Subject: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest X-Status: Status: RO --------------- Forwarded Message --------------- From: BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN, 71773,3457 To: INTERNET:owner-lro-digest@uk.stratus.com, INTERNET:owner-lro-digest@uk.stratus.com Date: Mon, Aug 15, 1994, 16:14 Subject: +Postage Due+The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Dear Folks: I have been asked to comment on my experiences in buying a Land Rover from Warwick 4 X 4. The bottom line is, the experience was wonderful and it went without any significant hitches. I wanted an 88", 3-door Land Rover which had to be a pre-1967 to be imported to the United States. Warwick acquired a 1962 Series II and redid it to Series III specifications. Sepcifically, they basically maintained the original body and fire wall and put that on a brand new, zinc, galvanized chassis. They reconditioned the gear box, converted to left-hand drive, added a new brake system including dual circuit, servo assist, disk brakes in front and Cupro-nickle pipes. They put in a new interior with high-back front seats and took out the useless middle seat and added a cubby box to it, which is very useful. They put a new interior with door trims, carpets, sound proofing and roof headlining. The entire vehicle was painted in my specific choice of color. I had an over-drive put into it and I decided to put in a Turner, rebuilt, 2.5 4-cylinder engine. It is my understanding that the Turner rebuilt engine is the finest in the world. Warwick 4 x 4 usually does not use Turner engines, but I found it an easy thing to do to contact Turner myself and have the engine delivered. The whole process took approximately 14 weeks. After the vehicle was completed and test driven, it was placed in its individual container and put on a ship that is organized by Warwick and shipped to the United States. On the receiving end, I called an export-import broker in Jacksonville, Florida and they made all the arrangements to have the container off-loaded, inspected by customs and, generally, have it ready for my pick-up. Surprisingly, it went well, without any hitch. The only problem customs had was they could not understand how a 1962 vehicle had 50 miles on the odometer. I have had this vehicle now for 2,000 miles and it is absolutely a marvelous piece of equipment without any significant problems. The only problem I had was it blew a fuse because the windshield wiper wires were reversed. Other than that, the engine works flawlessly, has not burned any oil and, believe it or not, thus far no fluids are dripping on my driveway. If anyone would like to have more details about this operation, please do not hesitate to call me or contact me via internet Benjamin G. Newman,MD 1962 88'series 111 1967 109' series 11A SW From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 16 19:58:25 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: Starting a 2.25 Diesel! To: denis@oswego.Oswego.EDU (Steven M Denis) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 94 10:50:01 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: ; from "Steven M Denis" at Aug 16, 94 1:51 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > ummmmmm I guess you were away when I had my last Rover"desesel"tirade..... > sigh..... > I don't think you should be cranking the starter for that long...I > believe that 30 seconds is the recomended time...with 2 to 5 mins. > between attempts... > 1. you *must* have fuel to the distributor pump....see the priming > directions in the book.. I already had the injector pump and injectors primed. > 2. you must have fuel to the injectors..break loose the fitting at the > injector while cranking and watch for spray..*DANGER* they say,as this is > enough pressure to force fuel through you skin or eyes....take the normal > precautions! gloves and eye shields etc ! > 3. the glow plugs gotta work....all of 'em!.....leave 'em on for a dog's > age, and feel the end where the wires go on and they should be warm(ish) Since the glow plugs are wired in series, if one don't work, they all don't work. > 4. This puppy has to *SPIN* to start....no "ungrunkagrunkagrunka" stuff > here,gotta have"wirrrrrrrootaarootarota!"check for grounds and stuff > ....the bad connections get hot! so it can be easy to find them... I have already checked the earths, and believed that it was one of the reasons my starter motor was cranking over sooo slow, so I added another. > 5. 24 volts will work fine...for a short time...do not crank for more > than 10 seconds...there is a device that gives 24 volts for starting and > switches to 12 for running and charging..little bro. has used one for > years on his MB 240-D...(and you thought Rover starters are expensive?!?) Any idea on where I could get one of these in Aust. and how much they cost? > 6. feel free to use a torch to heat the intake manifold...this is common > practice on larger engines that do not have glow plugs....some > engines(the old ford transit,for instance) had one *huge* glow plug in > the inlet manifold....heaven help the fool that sprayed starting fluid in > that one!(NO starting fluid in the rover,..OK?) How long should I heat up the intake mainfold? > > My rebuild started on the 3rd revolution.......but it never ran worth > beans....20 t0 22 US mpg......not worth the trouble in my book.....(now > that little Nissan.....) I though it would getter better than that, I know some one that gets 30MPG driving around on the road, and about 25MPG four wheeling up the bush, in his series III 88" with an overdrive, so I though I should be able to achive the same in my 86", since it is lighter. Besides, the main reason for the diesel conversion is that I was getting sick of my Holden six stopping in every puddle, or the inconveniance of the ignition melting half way up a rutted greasy hill! > > steve....... ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 13:57:51 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: New Rovers North toy... From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 17 Aug 94 12:38:44 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Reading the latest Rovers North flyer (Fall Specials Flyer 1994) I came across a device that I find slightly confusing. In fact I think that it is a pile of junk but am willing to be corrected. That the chap at RN didn't have a clue whether or not this device was for positive or negative earth vehicles was even more enlightening. The device in question if the "Rust Buster" It bills itself as an "Electronic Corrossion Control" device. They say it retards the oxidation process dramatically by delivering a small electric charge to the metal parts of your Land Rover. Free electrons are pumped into the metal bits of our Rovers, these electrons bind with oxygen atoms rather than the oxygen binding with the FE atoms. They then go on and say that this technology has been in use on naval vessels, pipelines and the oil industry and that they have customers that swear by the product. Well, enough of the advert. Starting at the end of the blurb, where this is used, what they say is true, but with a major provisio. We are talking about cathodic protectors here. Not rocket science. Their implication that they are the same is bullshit. Naval vessels use blocks of manganese (or something similar) welded onto the hull. These blocks serve as sacrificial chunks of metal, slowly "dissolving" away and protecting the hull of the ship. They work very well because a ship is sitting in a great bath of salt water (fresh water on the Great Lakes, but it works nearly as well) and there is near perfect conductance across the entire hull of the ship. Land Rovers don't live in salt water baths. Outside of OVLR Land Rovers on many weekends, they don't reside in fresh water baths either. Pipelines, the oil industry. Yeah, well oil and gas industries both use lots of pipelines. What do they do? Cathodic protectors are used. They comprise large cables welded to the pipeline. These cables run into a field of sacrificial metal blocks buried in the ground. They are arranged in fields of five to six units, forming a ground plane. Keeping a watchful eye on the sacrificial bits gives you a good indication how your pipeline is going to do vis-a vis rust/corrosion et cetera. Land Rovers do not live out their lives with cable welded from the metal bits to a ground plane sunk in the ground. So much for their advertising... That someone at RN didn't know whether these were for positive and negative earth vehicles was interesting, but really doesn't matter. What this little device is doing, just by reading their own copy is doing exactly what a positive earth vehicle does with the battery supplying electrons to the vehicle. Sacrificial blocks? The Land Rover is made of the stuff. Take a look at the galvanic action between the aluminium body and the metal bits sometime. That the aluminium is dissappearing is exactly what donor metal does in a case like this. Galvanic action is just showing that there is imperfect conductance throughout the Land Rover, probably because the Land Rover is not in a salt water bath or welded to the driveway. All in all, it is a lot cheaper to convert to positive earth from negative earth, or leave your Land Rover positive earth rather than blow $105US on this little device... How the same little device works on both positive and negative earth vehicles would be a bit interesting to see exactly what they are doing but why bother... Am I correct, or am I just confused about what I learned in chemistry class through high school and university? Anyone have a different opinion regarding this toy? Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 13:42:45 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: LRO mailing list Subject: RE: New Book Date: Wed, 17 Aug 94 11:31:00 PDT Encoding: 16 TEXT X-Status: Status: RO >Anyway, it is "The Great Adventure" a pictorial history of *all* of the >Camel Trophy events. As it is published in Switzerland (in English, French >and German), it is expensive, $65US. If I can get the price down in a bulk >purchase, would anyone be interested, or is this just too much for a book? I purchased this book through the LRO book shop, and I believe it cost me less than $65US (I'll double check when I get home). It is a fantastic book, if you like pictures. If you want to read about the Camel trophy, this book's not for you. The text is minimal. Now all I need is a good color scanner, and I'd have some wonderful Land Rover images for my desktop... John Rostykus john@data-io.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 14:43:26 1994 Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 15:36:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Jan Hilborn Subject: Re: Rust Buster (was new RN toy...) To: dixon kenner Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <03N8qc1w165w@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Dixon and everyone else - as far as i know this is not a "new" toy since i seem to remember asking for guinea pigs to test this thing out when i was the editor of the RN newsletter some few years ago. I didn't personally test it out since it wasn't free (even to the illustrious editor) and if i ever heard the results i forget them now. I'll scold Dirk (of RN) tonight about the vagueness of whoever you spoke to and find a little bit more about the damn thing... jan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 17:08:21 1994 Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 18:55:59 AST From: DAVID SPENCER To: lro@stratus.com Subject: RE:Clutch (thanks) X-Status: Status: RO Thanks for the comments and insights made about clutches, I should be into soon and will post any problems...not addressred in the digests. David S. Antigonish Nova Scotia (land of fishing villages but no fish) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 21:30:34 1994 Date: Wed, 17 Aug 94 19:24:18 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com From: jimmyp@netcom.com (Jimmy Patrick) Subject: Land Rover Poster X-Status: Status: RO If anyone is interested, I saw a poster you can order from (B.F. Goodrich ?) with a giant purple duotone of a Land Rover Def. 90. The poster is $7.50 and you can order at 1-800-677-3322. Standard disclaimer here. Jimmy Patrick -- jimmyp@netcom.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 01:26:45 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: galvanised steel. From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 17 Aug 94 22:37:01 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Recently there was some dsicussuion on the subject of galvanising wheels. As a fabricator and welder by trade i really wanted to jump in and give my opinion at the time. I resisted for a good reason, I wanted to get more information . Yesterday I visited a company that does galvanisng and spoke at lenghth with the big boos man abotu this. His opinion is this, he'll galvanise anything you bring in, but wheels he get a waiver signed on them. In his and his companies ipoion the cold formed rims are weakend and embrittled when the heating up to 850 degrees takes place. As such they do not the liability problems asssociated with disintegrating wheels in motion. I have also talked to a number of other sage persons who have alot of experience with galvanised material. Their view is that you can do it without any problems like those mentioned above. So there you have it, clear as mud. Robin Craig -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 01:27:10 1994 To: Jan Hilborn Cc: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Rust Buster (was new RN toy...) From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 17 Aug 94 22:52:35 -0500 In-Reply-To: Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Jan Hilborn writes: > as far as i know this is not a "new" toy since i seem to remember > asking for guinea pigs to test this thing out when i was the editor of > the RN newsletter some few years ago. I didn't personally test it out > since it wasn't free (even to the illustrious editor) and if i ever heard > the results i forget them now. It is not a "new" toy per say, but it is a new toy for RN to be offering. It has been around for a while, even JC Whitless has offered something similar in the past. However, the problem with this gadget, whether a passive or active system (and the description leads one to believe that it is an active system, much like a positive earthed electrical system and not passive as with blocks of sacrificial material like my door bottoms etc.), it will not work properly for one simple reason. The electrical circuit formed by all of the various bits of a vehicle, Land Rover or otherwise, is not perfect. There are discontinuities, drops in conductance from rusty parts bolted together and the like. Rust is not some vaguely understood process. It is a simple electrical reaction where electrons are moving between oxygen, iron, and in our case, aluminium chunks of metal. Our road salt just makes a better conductor for this entire reaction to take place when mixed liberally with slush and water. Just properly cleaning your Land Rover after a mud bath, oiling the frame every year, well painting the bits that are apart for refurbishment, basically proper case and attention will do a world of difference to the longevity of the vehicle. A device such as this will give the owner a false sense of security, allow them to become lazy, and get them really pissed when five years down the road they come to some sort of vague realisation that maybe it did not work as well as advertised. > I'll scold Dirk (of RN) tonight about the vagueness of whoever you > spoke to and find a little bit more about the damn thing... I'm protecting the guilty. I know who I talked to and am not that surprised that they didn't know much about this. They probably should, especially if a potential buyer starts asking all sorts of questions. I asked becuase I was familiar with them and was a bit surprised to see it for sale. The little ad makes all sorts of promises. Promises that, to my reading and talking with many people, just are not borne out by experience. As above, in theory it should work. Reality, as with so many things is slightly different. If the gadget in question is actually an "active" system, why does the ad mislead the reader with comparisons with passive systems as found on ships and pipelines? If it is passive (and I doubt it actually) how does it deal with the electrical discontinuities found within a Land Rover? If RN wants to supply parts that JC Whitless supplies, have them offer the propane heater for the winter. Now that sounds very interesting, especially when it hits -40 here and there isn't an electrical plug to be seen (probably buried under fifty thousand tons of snow and ice). That is useful. (BTW, speaking of winter, the 2.25l block heater that RN told me last fall was NLA can be purchased up here at Canadian Tire) RN makes a big deal about the genuine parts they supply, and about the quality of service they provide. Apart from discussion here and elsewhere on actual prices, they have been an excellent supplier. They should be more careful when it comes to gadgets like this, especially if someone can vaguely remember some bits from a high school e & m or chemistry cousre and some practical experince at what a typical frame (read circuit) looks like. When I think of problems I, and others, have had just because, something like, the starter wasn't grounding properly and then look at something that requires an ideal electrical circuit, you have to wonder about the gadget. RN can sell the thing, it really doesn't affect me, nor do I have any say, but people reading this advert in the latest flyer should have an idea what it is all about. It is not a solution as advertised. If it was, it would be a lot more popular as spoken about. For $140 Cdn, a brush attachemnt for the hose and a good oil job will be a fear better investment and a lot cheaper. Rgds, Dixon PS. Am still curious if they differentiate between positive and negative earthed vehicles. PPS. How did they test it out? Not an easy test to do. The vehicles would have to be very comparable, drive under almost identical conditions and then wait quite a while to see how the results turned out. -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 02:09:27 1994 Via: uk.ac.edinburgh.castle; Thu, 18 Aug 1994 07:56:54 +0100 From: IAN@lab0.vet.edinburgh.ac.uk Mmdf-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at uk.ac.ed.castle Organization: Vet-lab,The Univ of Edinburgh To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 07:56:19 +0000 Subject: Re: Land Rover Poster Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > If anyone is interested, I saw a poster you can order from (B.F. Goodrich > ?) with a giant purple duotone of a Land Rover Def. 90. The poster is $7.50 > and you can order at 1-800-677-3322. Standard disclaimer here. I've seen this poster too. I can't remember the context, but I *do* remember thinking "God, this is TACKY" As I remember, everything was purple except the tyres :-) BTW, it was the US spec '90. ----** Ian Stuart (Computing Officer) +44 31 650 6205 Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies, Edinburgh University. #======================================================================# Land Rover: A work-horse that was meant to survive the charge of an adult bull rhino and be field-stripped in the jungle with essentially a screwdriver and a crescent wrench. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 07:14:09 1994 To: lro@stratus.com From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: galvanised steel. Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 13:07:20 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO >Recently there was some dsicussuion on the subject of galvanising wheels. >His opinion is this, he'll galvanise anything you bring in, but wheels he >get a waiver signed on them. >In his and his companies ipoion the cold formed rims are weakend and >embrittled when the heating up to 850 degrees takes place. As such they >do not the liability problems asssociated with disintegrating wheels in >motion. >I have also talked to a number of other sage persons who have alot of >experience with galvanised material. Their view is that you can do it >without any problems like those mentioned above. Why take the risk? Just Waxoyl em. No rust. No weakening. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 11:38:05 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 10:24:46 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: re: The Great Adventure X-Status: Status: RO Mike Allen writes: >is it possible for a normal person to obtain any of the Camel Trophy >goodies directly from RJR...? Me...*normal*?!? I don't think *anyone* on this list is "normal!" :-) Anyway, here's the info on RJR...no chance. The Camel Trophy is currently being sponsored/funded by Camel Trophy Adventure Wear marketed by Worldwide Brands, a wholly-owned subsidiary of RJR (itself owned by Kohlberg, Kravis, Roberts from that leveraged buyout several years ago...but that's another story. Pssst!...hey buddy,...wanna buy a multi-national tobacco company?) Right now, the products are only marketed/sold in Europe. My friend was walking down a street in Germany somewhere and came across a storefront with nothing but Camel Trophy stuff in the windows...boots (*expensive* boots), jackets, shirts, whatnot. They were *flying* off the shelves. Like the early days of Land-Rover, the factories can't produce enough merchandise to meet the demand. So until they can build production (and find some way to advertise back here in the good ol' US of A or at least put an ad camapign together to counter that Marlboro 'Adventure Team' crap), don't expect the stuff over here. THE ONLY PLACE TO GET IT IS THE MID-ATLANTIC RALLY! And it's FREE! (How's that for an exclusive?) As to the book, it's published by SQP S.A. (who??), of St. Suplice, Switzerland (where??). I don't have the pub. no.- it's inside and I'm not going to open the sealed packaging. How's that for dedication? *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 14:28:21 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: LRO mailing list Cc: "Rostykus, Phyllis" Subject: Our new acquisition Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 09:52:00 PDT Encoding: 132 TEXT X-Status: Status: RO For the last year I've been working on purchasing an ex-military 90". It is now sitting in my garage, mostly assembled. After all the research, preparation and horror stories I've heard, everything worked out a lot easier than I ever imagined. Basically, it's a 1986 ex-RAF 2.5L diesel 90. It's brush painted NATO green, has 20,000 km on the clock, and is in immaculate condition (at least for an 8 year old military vehicle). It has NO rust. I hope to have it running within the next week. Are there any other pre-U.S. Defender 90 owners out there? I'd like to compare notes... John Rostykus john@data-io.com My wife, Phyllis, wrote up part of our adventure so far: ------------- The latest thing that has happened this summer has been something that actually sourced from last summer. The amazing Anniversary Present from last summer was the Camper 110 Land Rover that we happened upon last year. During the year, we sold it to a friend who moved to eastern Washington, a place it would really feel at home. Since that time John's been planning another Great Land Rover experiment. Basically, he called the guys he knew who knew guys who knew guys who could find a good, used diesel Land Rover in the UK. and figure out how to get all the parts for a diesel Land Rover over to the U.S. from England. I wanted a shorter car. He wanted a 90. All we have, right now, is the 2-door Range Rover, a 109 Land Rover pick-up and a Vanagon. I wanted something with a shorter wheel base and better turning radius that could be driven downtown and not take three hours to find a parking space for. He wanted a stable of Land Rovers. So he called the guys who called other guys who called other guys. After several conversations and fax echanges, a 20 foot container was put aboard a ship headed for the US. A couple weeks later, John also got a stack of shipping papers that had various parts listed on them. Two doors, a right wing, a left wing, a front windshield, a set of mirrors, another set of windows, sliders, an engine a carburetor, a wiring harness or three, etc. etc. etc... Lots and lots of parts that once had made an entire Land Rover, broken out into thousands of parts (sic). It was the same shipping list that Customs was to get, all simply parts for a Land Rover, along with a trailer, a hi-cap pickup bed for the 109, another engine for the 109, and various bits and pieces for the Range Rover and Land Rover, as the shipping was essentially free. We'd already paid for the 20-foot container, anything we could put into the container basically had free passage. All of which would probably have to go through Customs. Last Friday John got a call. 'It's through Customs and in port. When do you want it in your driveway?' Turned out that Customs hadn't really worried to much about it because everything was completely in order. John started bouncing off the walls at work. After straining through a day of delay in delivery, on Wednesday John rushed home to welcome a semi with a 20-foot container. That afternoon he was bouncing off the walls at work until he could get me home to look at it, too... and wouldn't tell me what was in the container at all. He just grinned at me. We got home, and had to park in the gravel parking area because the container completely blocked the driveway. John bounced over to the container doors and helped me open the bars and swing the door open. I gaped at the opening. There was a *whole* Land Rover back right at the door mouth. Not individual tires, panels, axles and the like, but the whole body of it in the matte, brush painted, radar absorbent green of an ex-Military vehicle. It looked nearly *whole*. I grabbed John and John grabbed me and we just danced right there in the driveway a whirling dervish of delight. It turned out that they'd only taken out the transmission, the engine and most of the front end. All of the parts they had taken off were packed in the completely whole trailer and pickup bed. The biggest hurdle next was the fact that everything in the 20-foot container was four feet off the ground, since it was still on the truck bed. John and his dad spent the next two evenings building a Ramp. It was about 12 feet long, and solid as a brick. They put planks all along the top of it, and as wide as the door to the container. Come Saturday morning, both John and I are a mass of sore muscles from the previous night's soccer game. John can't withstand the siren call of the container, though, so he's up at 7:30 pounding the last planks into the ramp. John's dad comes to help and there is no sleeping through the pounding of hammers, so I get up, and after the first cup of coffee feel kinda human again. I water the plum trees while they finish up prep of the ropes for the 90; and when I'm done with a set of laundry, I go out to help with the Unloading of the Container. Ben Freeman, another of the folks in John's Land Rover club, came over to help with the unloading as he'd just moved one of his Rovers using a U-Haul and had the equipment and interest to help us out. The back of the 90 has become a mass of ropes and towing ribbon and steel connectors. The ramp has a couple of stops as well. The main idea for bringing the Rover down is to have John basically just steer it down, backwards, using the brakes with the ropes and the blocks as safeties. We set up all the ropes. John climbs in, we all put ourselves in various places to help direct its course and then we give it a bit of a push to set it over onto the ramp. The beginning works just fine. No problem with the brakes or the steerage. Halfway down the ramp, and the Rover picks up a little speed, John pumps the brakes, the wheels slip on the wood planking, and I jump out of the way as the Rover slithers to a stop at the end of its ropes, two feet from the bottom of the ramp. Whew. Good thing it was all setup. Turns out that the Rover is easy to push up the ramp just enough to loosen all the ropes, so we do that, and just let it take the last two feet, no problem. A bit of maneuvering and we put it safely into the garage! Hurrah! Next, the trailer. Some careful work leveling it out in the container, and then pulling out all the parts that were carefully packed within it. The compact space of the trailer holds an amazing number of parts, which are soon scattered all over our front lawn. The trailer is relatively light and the four of us bring it down the ramp pretty easily and into the strawberry patch, or at least the part that we've cleared for this particular purpose. The engines go next, each with a slow-let down rope system, essentially a block and tackle setup with sledge runners under the engines to let it slide down the ramp in a controlled manner. I find that it's easiest for me to just sit on the floor of the container and push at the engine with my legs rather than try lifting any of it. Rollers and pry bars work the magic needed to get the engines onto blocks in the garage. The pickup bed was tied against the far wall of the container and is *heavy* with parts. Springs and pipes, exhaust systems and paneling all packed in with foam that, oddly, is shaped in exactly the same shape as seat cushions for a Land Rover. Kinda coool. :) We unload all the parts and soon the *entire* front lawn is covered with parts of all kinds. The bed is really light after it is unloaded and with one person on each corner we set it on the one clear corner of lawn we'd set aside for it. And that was that. One twenty-foot long container's worth of contents now covers nearly 400 square feet of lawn and a slot in the two-car garage. And we were all done with everything just after Noon as well. Quite a morning's work. ----- Phyllis From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 17 22:24:16 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Land Rover Advertising Print To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 13:12:05 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO Hi all, Just thought I would mail y'all to tell you that I just recieved 8 of the prints advertised in LRO, and two of the jigsaws (Not that I wanted them, buts thats another story), anyway, any-one that is thinking of getting some of these prints, don't (That's think) just get them, they are great. They are about A3 size and the colour is very vivid, so much so that I am getting 3 more (Mainly because I have to mail them about the cockup with the jigsaws)aswell as two others they did not send out. One of them I got is really great, say that the Land Rover is "by appointment to His majesty King George V", not used to hearing His majest. To those who replied to my plea for help to start my diesel, thanks, and it looks like I am going to have to try and roll start it, as even with a fully charged battery, it would not start, I think it is because the motor is know and "The rings are very tight", I can't use two men and a horse to pull start it as I don't know any-one that would lend me one! That's all for know! ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 13:56:09 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 13:27:54 -0500 (CDT) From: David John Place Subject: Re: re: The Great Adventure To: MR ALEXANDER P GRICE Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <013.01128928.CXKS46A@prodigy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO I was in Finland just before Xmas and I was also suprised by the amount of Camel stuff in the windows of the stores. I went in to one and because I was visiting from N.A. and because we had quite a bit of publicity for the Red Cross, the clerk gave me some nice Finish Nation Team stuff. My Lndy now has a Finland Nation Team 1994 sticker on the back window. I have been able to get almost all the tapes for the past trecks. I think my collection starts just after the Darian (sp?) Gap stuff. By the way, the Darian Gap has been on TV twice and I was not able to get a copy. Does anyone know where to order a tape in North American scan, and are the Camel Trophy races available this side of the pond in our scan system? I would like to complete my collection of tapes. I was able to get most of my tapes from someone on this side of the pond who had had them put into PAL or SECAM or whatever our system takes. We watch them so much at our house that they are beginning to show their age. HI HI. Dave VE4PN From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 13:50:19 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 11:38:28 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: drose@bt-sys.bt.co.uk, land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: Range-Rover Diff Oil Level X-Status: Status: RO I've found the fluid capacities to be way off the official ones in some cases. On the other hand, the fluid level hole is on the front of the diff-- I usually use it for filling as well. John Brabyn 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 15:49:51 1994 From: Malcolm956@aol.com Sender: "Malcolm956" To: lro@team.net Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 14:41:32 EDT Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping X-Status: Status: RO >So what does everyone else do?????????????? Your rig sounds very luxurious! Me? I sleep in the dirt. After camping for about 50 years, I have gone minimalist. I have tried back packing, tents, tent trailers, a VW camper, bicycle camping and now a 16 foot open Swampscott dory (the oceangoing equivalent of a Land Rover - it is slow, goes anywhere and gets you back home despite the roughest conditions). I have come to the opinion that too much equipment tends to block the view. Camping becomes the end in itself rather than merely a means of staying out where you can see a billion stars in the still desert air, fish at dawn, watch the phosphorescence when you drop your anchor after the dark, travel in wilderness, enjoy the smell of a campfire. Recently I did a business trip, by air, to California which was extended for a few days to get a better air fare. With time to kill and a rental car at my disposal, I brought along a camping rig based around my cycling gear: a small 1 person tent, a lightweight fleece sleeping bag, a tiny but efficient alcohol stove, a candle lantern, a 1 qt "billy" for cooking, plastic table ware, a couple of folding cups (one for tea, one for rum), clothes for the business trip (fortunately a casual one), and my bagpipes (Yes, pipes. I wouldn't kid about a thing like that). Everything went into a single carry-on bag with the sleeping bag strapped to the outside. The entire rig fit in the over-head carry-on bin on the plane. Spent one night next to the Pacific at Oceanside, one at Palomar and one at Joshua Tree. (Wished that I had my '65 88" Series IIa Land Rover at Joshua Tree.) The accountants are going to have trouble coping with $14 state park receipts instead of the usual $120 hotel bills. Look at it this way, if you have a mini camp that fits into a single pack basket, you have that much more room left over in the Land Rover for your 8x10 Linhof, accessories and portable darkroom. It worked for Matthew Brady and Ansel Adams. However, in spite of the fact that I would much rather do something interesting than be comfortable, I am not a complete fool. A dining fly is marvelous thing. For the Land Rover, fit a fore and aft pole (closet poles or hand rails work) to the side of your luggage rack. Secure one edge of a large blue poly tarp to the pole. Park next to your picnic table and set the tarp up as a roof over the table. One side is supported by the Land Rover and the other by adjustable tent poles, ropes & pegs. For a fast and dirty campsite, forget the tent poles, peg the tarp directly to the ground and call it a tent. Because one side is fixed firmly to the Land Rover, it is fast and easy to set up even in inclement weather. For traveling, roll the tarp up around the tent poles, guy ropes and pegs and strap everything to the pole on the Land Rover. A place to sit, sheltered from rain and sun, is true luxury. Another useful item is a gun rack - the kind you see in the back window of every other pickup truck. Gun racks are cheap, widely available, quite strong, and adjustable to fit Land Rover rear side windows. You may not be into guns, but the racks are ideal for umbrellas, fishing rods, bow saws, camera tripods, bagpipes, mailing tubes, kites and other long, thin things that otherwise get lost or damaged in the bottom of the Land Rover. They are superb oversize garment hooks. Drape the camera gadget bag strap or the handle of a backpack over a hook to keep it from falling off the side seats. Haversacks, purses, foul weather gear, fanny packs, jumper cables, a coil of rope - you name it. A bit off the subject, I have made a discovery of sorts. Cleaning up after meals has always been the worst part of camping. Now that my doctor has me on a virtually zero fat diet (lots of rice, beans, lentils, vegetables, etc.) I find that non-fat food is much easier to clean up when camping because there is no grease. Hot, soapy water is rarely needed. Wipe the pot out with a used tea bag, give it a quick slosh with cold water and you are done. Cheers from New Hampshire, Malcolm =====__ |[__]|_\_==_ | | | ] (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:{> x From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 15:22:23 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 11:50:27 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca, jhilborn@moose.uvm.edu Subject: Re: Rust Buster (was new RN toy...) Cc: lro@stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO What's the bit about oiling the chassis -- what does that involve?? John Brabyn 89 RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 16:59:59 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 14:40:20 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: Malcolm956@aol.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping X-Status: Status: RO In message <9408181441.tn84002@aol.com> writes: snip > > However, in spite of the fact that I would much rather do something > interesting than be comfortable, I am not a complete fool. A dining fly is > marvelous thing. For the Land Rover, fit a fore and aft pole (closet poles > or hand rails work) to the side of your luggage rack. Secure one edge of a > large blue poly tarp to the pole. Park next to your picnic table and set the > tarp up as a roof over the table. One side is supported by the Land Rover > and the other by adjustable tent poles, ropes & pegs. For a fast and dirty > campsite, forget the tent poles, peg the tarp directly to the ground and call > it a tent. Because one side is fixed firmly to the Land Rover, it is fast > and easy to set up even in inclement weather. For traveling, roll the tarp > up around the tent poles, guy ropes and pegs and strap everything to the pole > on the Land Rover. A place to sit, sheltered from rain and sun, is true > luxury. > snip > > Cheers from New Hampshire, > Malcolm > > =====__ > |[__]|_\_==_ > | | | ] > (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:{> > x > > > I was thinking of doing something simular to your suggestion. Since even my semi-retired Land Rover occasionally still has to do some work for its petrol I can not really put anything permanite in the back that would take much space or keep me from hosing it out. I was thinking of using thick wall 1/2 inch PVC piping to build shed shaped frame that would be about 5 feet longer than the top of my 109 and cover it with a blue tarp that would streach over the frame top and over the top of the 109. The extra length would go over the back. It would allow me to be able to set up and cook in the rain without water coming down between the frame and the LR. And the extra length over the back would allow me dry access to the back of the LR. If I wanted to drive off and leave the camp set up all I would need to do is unhook the propane line from the internal propane tank and the tarp from the LR. I could fasten the extra length of the tarp to the poles as a side & drive off. The poles would not be glued so it would disassemble and fit in the back of the LR. It would be too much work to bring out for a dry overnighter but it should work when I am spending some time in one location. Last month when I spent a week on the Oregon coast my outside stuff was treated to heavy dripping fog every night. A cover would have been nice and I keep thinking I can't be lucky enough not to get rained on while LR camping all the time. I agee with you about camping light. I used to chuckle at the people who brought the kitchen sink and a large rug to camp sites as I walked past with everything I needed for a week on my back. But lately I have started to question why I should travel like a back packer while car camping when I have a 109 two door to carry things. A stove that would let me make tea while cooking breakfast, and such things as lights bright enough to read by, a pillow and sleeping pad started to look like reasonable things when car camping in a 109. maybe I'm just getting to be an old lady and liking my comforts a little more. I would like to think that I've just gotten over my backpacker's chalvinism and decided to be practial for once in my life. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 17:58:35 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Rust Buster To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 18:44:52 EDT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: ; from "dixon kenner" at Aug 17, 94 10:52 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] X-Status: Status: RO > The little ad makes all sorts of promises. Promises that, to my > reading and talking with many people, just are not borne out by > experience. As above, in theory it should work. Reality, as with > so many things is slightly different. If the gadget in question is > actually an "active" system, why does the ad mislead the reader > with comparisons with passive systems as found on ships and > pipelines? If it is passive (and I doubt it actually) how does it > deal with the electrical discontinuities found within a Land Rover? Well, gee, maybe there's LOTS of wires that come with the thing so you can attach it to each and every metal bit on your Rover! OR, maybe they suggest you make a sea-worthy vehicle out of it...submerge and it oughta work (and watch your entire body disappear when it fails....) > > PS. Am still curious if they differentiate between positive and > negative earthed vehicles. I suspect it would not work at all on positive earth rigs......the flow of electrons being in the wrong direction (hey, maybe it'll rust even faster!). rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 18:13:45 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 19:07:38 -0400 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Apparently-To: lro@transfer.stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO > A bit off the subject, I have made a discovery of sorts. Cleaning up after > meals has always been the worst part of camping. Now that my doctor has me > on a virtually zero fat diet (lots of rice, beans, lentils, vegetables, etc.) > I find that non-fat food is much easier to clean up when camping because > there is no grease. Hot, soapy water is rarely needed. Wipe the pot out > with a used tea bag, give it a quick slosh with cold water and you are done. > and TeriAnn's contempt for those who bring "the kitchen sink" The absolutely most useful piece of camping equipment I own is a kitchen sink. A kitchen sink, you ask? Yes, a kitchen sink. It is basically the bottom half of one of those cheesey plastic beach-bags our mom's all used to have. I think I got it from REI years ago (maybe EMS). It folds up neatly into a tiny little triangle that fits into my cookware. Unfold, fill with water, wash the dishes, take a bath, do laundry, bob for apples, you name it. Get one and amaze your friends. rd/nige From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 19:38:12 1994 Date: 19 Aug 1994 12:11:02 +1200 From: DAVID DEAN Subject: Where do I find Tune Up Info? To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Reply-To: "David L. Dean" Organization: Lincoln University X-Envelope-To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO LROers, I remember sometime back there was a posting that had all of the timing and dwell information for several LR engines. I'm tuning up a 1960 SII this weekend for the local farmer and don't have the manuals. Is this information stored somewhere so I can retrieve through FTP or gopher? Please cc me directly as I am on digest mode and need the info before tommorrow (if possible, of course). Cheers, ------- (David L. Dean - Department of Economics & Marketing) ------- ----------- (Lincoln University, Canterbury, New Zealand) ----------- --- ("sober fearless pursuit of truth, beauty, & righteousness") ---- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 18 20:58:06 1994 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 20:47:33 -0500 (CDT) From: David John Place Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: Malcolm956@aol.com, lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9408182140.AA02810@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO I have found that the aluminum track for the side of trailers to hold the sun shade is great for Land Rovers. It is the type you pull rope through. I have pop rivited a piece on each side of my safari rack and I can put a tarp on it and with just two poles and some rope have a nice camp site. If you are really into comfort a screen room from a short 13 foot trailer fits well. To carry the poles, I use a piece of plumbing pipe about 4" across with a screw cap on each end. This is the way plumbers carry copper pipe on their truck racks. It is a great place for tent poles, fishing rods or other long stuff. You can roll your tarp up and put it in here s well. I have most often taken to sleeping on the safari rack because the 88 is too short. A good rack will take a "pup" tent quite well. Seeing the last few messages makes me wonder how old most of us are on the net. I am 48. Maybe I am fooling myself that most Land Rover owners are about 20 to 30 and still crazy! Hi Hi. Maybe there is hope for me yet. Dave VE4PN From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 01:20:54 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Rust Buster (was new RN toy...) From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 18 Aug 94 23:12:24 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) writes: > What's the bit about oiling the chassis -- what does that involve?? See mail message... For anyone else, OVLR has an annual frame oiler party whereby we put Land Rovers up on ramps and you get to spray the finest goop across your frame in preparation for the thousand odd tons of salt that get dumped about up here. Doing this extends the life of your frame by years. Application is easy. Just spray the stuff everywhere across anything that looks like it is iron derived. A good oiling job drips into February. If you don't mind becoming an oily mess for a couple hours, it really doesn't involve very much... Rgds Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 03:04:11 1994 To: lro@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 08:56:43 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO >>So what does everyone else do?????????????? >Your rig sounds very luxurious! Me? I sleep in the dirt. After camping for >about 50 years, I have gone minimalist. I have tried back packing, tents, >tent trailers, a VW camper, bicycle camping and now a 16 foot open Swampscott >dory (the oceangoing equivalent of a Land Rover - it is slow, goes anywhere >and gets you back home despite the roughest conditions). >I have come to the opinion that too much equipment tends to block the view. > Camping becomes the end in itself rather than merely a means of staying out >where you can see a billion stars in the still desert air, fish at dawn, >watch the phosphorescence when you drop your anchor after the dark, travel in >wilderness, enjoy the smell of a campfire. Yeah I couldnt imagine doing it any other way in the desert. Its great to be able to just chuck your bag in the dust and sleep under the stasrs (as long as youre awake before the harvester ants you chucke you bag on top of.....) But it doesnt work too well in the UK. Too many things fall on you - rain, bricks thrown by passing local yobs - and soenone will nick the Landrover while you're asleeep. Horses for courses. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 06:52:25 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 07:27:21 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Bill's VT Trip To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO I just returned from a long weekend in Vermont. What a great time. On the night before I was to leave, when I went to top off the tank of my 88, I discovered the 25 year old radiator was spraying out coolant in a big way. I yanked it out (thank god for air ratchets) and replaced it with the repaired radiator from my 109. After retightening some clamps it seemed to be holding up quite well, so I decided to go for it. On my way up early the next morning I expected to run into traffic on the throughway on the way past the Woodstock exit (First day of the concert). Fortunately it was pretty light. I did get passed by a number of psychedelic Dodge Caravans and econoboxes, but aside from some folks on the overpasses in tie dyed clothes waving peace sign banners (I gave them a honk and a peace sign as I passed making them much more animated), there wasn't much happening. On the overpass for the concert exit there was a steady stream of folks crossing the highway. North of the Saugerties exit there were dozens of school buses coming down the highway shuttling concertgoers to the festival. I was glad I had passed it. My idea of a vacation is getting away from crowds, not spending it with a couple of hundred thousand others. My first stop was ABP. They are expanding the parts warehouse area (Range Rover and Sterling parts are really picking up) and adding more staff. Dick told me about his Discovery. He said he would rather have bought a 90 now that he had gotten familiar with it. Dick felt that the gear ratios on the 5-speed were too closely spaced and that second was too close to first (keep in mind that Dick Taylor is more of a business man than an enthusiast). He did say, however that his wife and kids loved it. I also saw Bob Fischer in his shop next door. He's doing fine and had plenty to say about the welding on the front chassis legs on my 88, and none of it was complimentary. So much for making a guy feel good. Friday night I had dinner with Rich Zeigler (formerly of ABP). He had 2 88s in his driveway aside from his own that he was working on. One was getting a new rear crossmember and bulkhead & door alignment and the other was getting gearbox seals (leaking like a sieve between main box and transfer). He asked that I pass along that he's alive and well and doing Land Rover work in the Rutland area. His number is 802-773-1585. I stayed at My ski club's lodge just outside of Rutland. Nice place and cheap ($5/night for members). If you're interested in what it looks like, borrow a copy of "Mysterious New England" by Yankee books from your library. Look up the chapter titled "Spirit Capitol of the Universe". Lots of history. Lots of spooks. I'll never sleep in the old section of the house alone ever again. Never ever again. Did it once. Now I sleep in the new addition... with the radio on. Saturday I cruised up to Rover's North. What a beautiful drive. Mark is really expanding the place and adding new staff also. I got to spend some time with him searching for hinge pin parts (they're on sale now-keep an eye out for their flyer) as some of the parts locations had been rearranged. It was really fun seeing all the stuff they have in stock (like a kid in a candy store). Mark showed me his "new" 90 that he just put a 200 TDI in. What a neat engine. Starts right up, doesn't sound too noisy (but does sound authoritative) and the kit seems well engineered. I wished we could have gone for a ride but I had taken too much of his time as it was. He said that it was netting him 30 mpg at this point with only a few thousand miles on it, and pulled like a train up and over Smuggler's Notch (he felt it was stronger than a V-8, at least on steep hills). I could handle that. If you're interested and have the wherewithal, the kit runs $7000 (I'm interested, but don't have the wherewithal). I asked Mark about the Discovery 5-speed and he said he liked it better than the automatic. The only recommendation I could give is to drive one before you place your order. While I was there a pair of my fellow OVLR members (who shall remain nameless) arrived and proceeded to try to wangle Mark out of 109 rear brake backplate, cylinder, shoe, and drum combinations for $85. Gee, it sounded so good I thought I might spring for a pair myself and upgrade the front brakes on my 88. Mark, being a little too sharp for them, pulled the ad and pointed out that the drums were $60 additional. They hemmed and hawed and left with a little less than they came for. You just gotta watch out for those wily Canadians. I left Rover's North and headed south towards Stowe via Smuggler's Notch. Unlike Mark's TDI being able to climb the notch in 5th, I made it up in 3rd then 2nd, and used 1st briefly while navigating the boulders on the way down (Trucks and trailers are prohibited from the pass. At the top you have to negotiate a maze of boulders and one lane areas with sharp switchback turns that require full steering lock. Great fun but don't be in a hurry). After that I stopped in Stowe and biked their bike path. It runs about 6 miles one way and parallels and criss crosses the river going out of town. A very nice ride with lots of nice scenery and plenty of babes on bikes and blades. On Sunday I visited the Shelbourne Museum - lots and lots of Americana - pretty interesting, but with 37+ buildings, it got kind of tiring. Monday I cruised into Woodstock VT (where I saw a black Discovery) then hiked down Queeche Gorge. Beautiful place with spectacular vistas. Tuesday I headed home and was passed by a dark blue Discovery (nice color) along the way. Nice truck but it draws nowhere near the attention of a canvas topped 88. The 88 behaved very well throughout the trip and used a quart of oil in about 800 miles (Since I replaced the distributor gasket and cork ring, my oil consumption has dropped noticeably). It rode a lot nicer loaded up with tools and luggage than without and zipped along the interstates quite well at between an indicated 90-100kph on 235-R15s. The other folks at the ski club lodge I stayed at were surprised I drove all the way up from NJ in the 88. Aside from commuting to work, I wouldn't travel any other way. Except of course, in the 109. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 08:45:40 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Land-Rover-Owner@team.net Subject: Mileage for assorted rover power plants; UK used L/R dealers Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 09:38:30 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO Hi ! All right, so before I go all over the country side looking for an x-mod rover (109" or 110"), I just wanted to ask about mileages for 2.5 Turbo Diesels and county V-8s - would you folks have any experience there ? (Since the Sept LRO had that tidy looking V-8 110" pickup in the classifieds) US UK mpL mpg mpIg LWB Rack OD 2.25 petrol 4.3 16-18 20-24 -1.5 -1.5 +1.5 diesel 5.5 22 25 -1 2.5 diesel ? Tdi ? Carb. V-8 ? R/R EFI v-8 4.5 18 On the subject of UK used L/R dealers, Foley, Gott, Blanchard, Jackson, Vass, Brooklyn, Crook, etc, etc. are all reasonable sized advertisers in LRO (I always wonder if I should look at the 1/4 page advertisers first, 'cause I know those full pager advertisers are spending lots of quid, potnetially my hard-earned quid :-) Any advice from those with experience or close to it in the UK ? Cheers, - Bill caloccia@stratus.com Stratus Computer Ltd Central House, Lampton Road Hounslow, Middlesex, TW3 1HY, U.K. tele: +44 81 570 4433 fax: +44 81 569 4755 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 09:12:40 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 10:04:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@stratus.com, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Subject: Re: Rust Buster (was new RN toy...) In-Reply-To: X-Status: Status: RO Dixon wrote about the frame oiler party: > >> What's the bit about oiling the chassis -- what does that involve?? > > See mail message... For anyone else, OVLR has an annual frame > oiler party whereby we put Land Rovers up on ramps and you get to > spray the finest goop across your frame in preparation for the > thousand odd tons of salt that get dumped about up here. Doing > this extends the life of your frame by years. Application is easy. > Just spray the stuff everywhere across anything that looks like it > is iron derived. A good oiling job drips into February. If you > don't mind becoming an oily mess for a couple hours, it really > doesn't involve very much... SO what kind of oil do you guys use? Can I just do an Autumn oil change and use the gunky black stuff that is coming out of the sump? I have plenty of that stuff in my fancy plastic oil change container. The one where you take your old oil to some enviromentaly responsible recycler instead of dumping it in the weeds or in the storm sewer. Also do you use a plastic spray bottle, or a pump oil can, or some exotic air powered mechanism? As Jan Hillborne sez "Curious minds want to know" Thanks Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 10:09:19 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 08:29:28 -0600 From: Grettir Asmundarson To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net, john@Data-IO.COM Subject: Re: Our new acquisition X-Status: Status: RO [Beginning of quoted text.] We got home, and had to park in the gravel parking area because the container completely blocked the driveway. John bounced over to the container doors and helped me open the bars and swing the door open. I gaped at the opening. There was a *whole* Land Rover back right at the door mouth. Not individual tires, panels, axles and the like, but the whole body of it in the matte, brush painted, radar absorbent green of an ex-Military vehicle. It looked nearly *whole*. [End of quoted text.] So, what would have happened if Customs had cracked open the box, looked inside, and seen a nearly whole vehicle? Would there have been trouble or did you already have an idea of how much the vehicle had to be disassembled in order to come into the country as "parts?" Who did the shipping for you? Full of questions, Grettir From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 10:00:42 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 10:44:24 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Thank You Bill To: caloccia@stratus.com Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Bill, I just wanted to drop you a note to say thank you for keeping up the LRO mailing list. It's the one thing at my office that I look forward to and really helps break up the day. It's great to be able to come out of a stressful meeting and access my mail to find some fun stuff on Land Rovers. You put up with a lot in terms of impatient people trying to subscribe or unsubscribe while you're busy being bounced back and forth across the Atlantic. It must be a bit aggravating at times (considering what you're paid to administer the list) but you seem to take it in good humour. And I apologize for sending those "Help Me Please Subscribe" messages with the 20+ page breaks a while back. I'm not quite sure how that happened, but I do now check the length of my messages before sending them. I hope your search for a 110 goes well. You must let us know what you have to go through to get it over here. I would definately go for the TDI, but I would have the powerplant checked out first by experienced TDI mechanic before parting with my Ls. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 10:48:44 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 11:31:35 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: US Disco Accessories To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO When I was at ABP last weekend I picked up a list of Discovery accessories for a fellow at work who had placed an order for a blue automatic. If you're interested in a copy give them a call at 1-800-533-2210 or 2208. Bill From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 10:51:03 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 08:46:40 MST From: DEBROWN@srp.gov To: lro@team.net Subject: LR 110 first sighting... X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: LR 110 first sighting... Hi all! I'm relatively new to the LR world, and actually don't have one...YET! But I'm ready to place an order for one, a fully loaded Discovery. I must admit, though, that I have recently seen my first 110. In a word... "WOW!" I am in love! It even tempted me to think about a 110 instead of the Discovery. The one I saw was a '93, and according to the salesman it was kind of customized by (I forget who now) someone associated with Land Rover somehow. Anyway, it was immaculate, and they wanted $41K. It was gone within a few days! As for my imminent Discovery purchase, there's a 3 month waiting list at my local dealer. Does anyone know what the '95's will offer? I have heard that there will be a 5% increase in price :( and power seats :) which I would presume would be included and not an option. Has anyone heard anything else to confirm or dispute this??? How about any subscribers in the UK? I'd like any comments on the Disco, any problem areas? Who's got the most miles on one? Any news on the '95 models? I've been comparing the available sport utility vehicles sold in the USA and my conclusion is: There is no comparison. Anyone that chooses anything other than a Discovery (that could afford one) is a sick individual and should be committed to an institution and/or shot. (IMHO) I should clarify: For carrying 5 or more people, and commuting every day with it. Otherwise, for purely off road use, the Defender would be the vehicle of choice. Anyway... I'd LOVE to hear any comments that anyone has. Thanks!!!! #=====# "Never doubt that a small group of individuals |___|__\___ can change the world... indeed, it's the only | | | | thing that ever has." " "`O'""""`O'" -unknown From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 11:09:50 1994 From: "Rostykus, John" To: Grettir Asmundarson Cc: LRO mailing list Subject: Re: Our new acquisition Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 08:56:00 PDT Encoding: 58 TEXT X-Status: Status: RO >From: Grettir Asmundarson >To: Land-Rover-Owner; john >Subject: Re: Our new acquisition >Date: Friday, August 19, 1994 8:29AM > > > >So, what would have happened if Customs had cracked open the box, >looked inside, and seen a nearly whole vehicle? Would there have >been trouble or did you already have an idea of how much the vehicle >had to be disassembled in order to come into the country as "parts?" >Who did the shipping for you? > >Full of questions, >Grettir I have never attempted to do something like this before, so I was rather paranoid about doing it within the rules. For the record, I did not import a vehicle, I imported a lot of parts (~1 and a half vehicles worth). There is a point at which a disassembled vehicle becomes 'parts'. I relied on 'experienced' folks in England to decide how far to disassemble it (they have done this many times before...), which is why I wasn't quite sure how far they'd go. Basically, they removed the doors, engine, gearbox, prop shafts, wings, grill, bumper (roughly, everything from the firewall forward). They did a wonderful job of packing all these bits in a way that was easy to sort out, and they all survived shipping w/o damage. What if customs decided to inspect? I believe they would have considered them parts. This is purely speculation (I have no proof...), but from the various people I've talked to, I'm fairly confident of this. Note: I did this is for parts only. I do not have paperwork that I can use to turn around and title/license this vehicle. However, I now have a wonderful parts supply to rebuild a couple of rovers... I set up the shipping with a local company called 'Tower Group International'. I just looked up 'Freight Forwarders' in the Yellow Pages, and got a variety of quotes. In my case, I wanted 'door-to-door' service. This means they cover: dropping off the container at the vehicle site in England, take the loaded container to the ship, deliver to a US port, walk it through customs (this actually occured before the container arrived), handle all the paperwork (duty, extra forms, customs bond, etc.), ship the container to Seattle on a rail car, drop the container off in my driveway, and pick it up when I finished emptying it. This also included 'insurance' for the whole journey (a must, in my opinion). There are many ways to handle shipping. The cheapest is a roll-on/roll-off ferry, which can work if the vehicle is 'whole' (i.e. a pre-1968). If you go with a container, you can trade off 'door-to-door' for 'going to their warehouse' to load it. The nice thing about a container is, once you pay the flat shipping fee, you can literally pack it to the gills for no extra shipping charge. This is ideal, if you plan well, and get all your LR friends to place their orders for parts, and pitch in on the shipping. Hope this answers your questions... John Rostykus john@data-io.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 11:23:08 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 09:15:56 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: umplace@CC.UManitoba.CA, Malcolm956@aol.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping X-Status: Status: RO In message David John Place writes: > I have found that the aluminum track for the side of trailers to hold the > sun shade is great for Land Rovers. It is the type you pull rope through. > I have pop rivited a piece on each side of my safari rack and I can put a > tarp on it and with just two poles and some rope have a nice camp site. > If you are really into comfort a screen room from a short 13 foot trailer > fits well. To carry the poles, I use a piece of plumbing pipe about 4" > across with a screw cap on each end. This is the way plumbers carry > copper pipe on their truck racks. It is a great place for tent poles, > fishing rods or other long stuff. You can roll your tarp up and put it in > here s well. I have most often taken to sleeping on the safari rack > because the 88 is too short. A good rack will take a "pup" tent quite > well. Seeing the last few messages makes me wonder how old most of us are > on the net. I am 48. Maybe I am fooling myself that most Land Rover > owners are about 20 to 30 and still crazy! Hi Hi. Maybe there is hope > for me yet. Dave VE4PN Dave, You and I are the same age. I have resisted a roof rack because of the increased wind resistance it would create. And besides a 109 2 door should have enough space to store a weeks camping gear and my dog. I'm not sure what you mean by aluminum track. I've toyed with the idea of a widow shade like awning, like you see on RVs. It would be very fast to set up. But to get the kind of slope you need to have rain run off, I would almost have to move around on my knees. I would need to pick up 1 or 2 feet higher than the side of my 109 to get a good slope and stand up. Also, I would have to take it down anytime I moved the LR. Which is fine if I'm on the road and stop to cook a meal in the rain, but a pain if I'm spending time photographing from a base camp. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 11:53:10 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 09:43:03 PDT From: Murali_Venkat@Novell.COM (Murali Venkat) To: lro@team.net Subject: unsubscribe X-Status: Status: RO Plz unsubscribe me.. Thanks much From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 11:53:20 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 12:53:13 EDT From: sat@eng.tridom.com (Stephen Thomas) To: lro@team.net Subject: '95 Discovery (Was Re: LR 110 first sighting...) X-Status: Status: RO > Does anyone know what the '95's will offer? I have > heard that there will be a 5% increase in price :( and power seats :) > which I would presume would be included and not an option. Has anyone > heard anything else to confirm or dispute this??? FWIW, salesman at the local dealership said the only difference between '94 and '95 would be the serial number and the price. He'd didn't know (or wouldn't say) how much of a price increase, but I've heard 3% from another source. He also said that Ardennes Green and Caprice Teal were out as colors. Two new colors (he didn't know which) would replace them. _____________________________________________ Stephen Thomas AT&T Tridom (404-514-3522) email: sat@eng.tridom.com, attmail!tridom!sat From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 12:54:15 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 13:45:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: umplace@CC.UManitoba.CA, Malcolm956@aol.com, lro@team.net, "TeriAnn Wakeman" Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping In-Reply-To: <9408191615.AA04465@apple.com> X-Status: Status: RO TeriAnn needs an extra 2 feet above the land rover; > >I've toyed with the idea of a widow shade like awning, like you see on RVs. It >would be very fast to set up. But to get the kind of slope you need to have >rain run off, I would almost have to move around on my knees. I would need to >pick up 1 or 2 feet higher than the side of my 109 to get a good slope and >stand >up. Also, I would have to take it down anytime I moved the LR. Which is fine >if I'm on the road and stop to cook a meal in the rain, but a pain if I'm >spending time photographing from a base camp. Possibly the extension handles used for paint rollers could give you that extra two to three feet needed. They have them in any commercial paint store. They have them in fiberglass, or aluminum and the locking collars are quite strong as are the poles. Properly attached to the truck they could almost look nice. Just a design thought Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 15:31:16 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: forwarded mis-directed entry Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 14:03:54 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO Digest subscribers should be careful that the address on their replies is To: land-rover-owner@team.net ------- Forwarded Message Date: 15 Aug 94 16:13:39 EDT From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com> To: owner-lro-digest@uk.stratus.com Subject: Re: The Land Rover Owner Daily Digest Message-ID: <940815201339_71773.3457_FHM65-1@CompuServe.COM> Dear Folks: I have been asked to comment on my experiences in buying a Land Rover from Warwick 4 X 4. The bottom line is, the experience was wonderful and it went without any significant hitches. I wanted an 88", 3-door Land Rover which had to be a pre-1967 to be imported to the United States. Warwick acquired a 1962 Series II and redid it to Series III specifications. Sepcifically, they basically maintained the original body and fire wall and put that on a brand new, zinc, galvanized chassis. They reconditioned the gear box, converted to left-hand drive, added a new brake system including dual circuit, servo assist, disk brakes in front and Cupro-nickle pipes. They put in a new interior with high-back front seats and took out the useless middle seat and added a cubby box to it, which is very useful. They put a new interior with door trims, carpets, sound proofing and roof headlining. The entire vehicle was painted in my specific choice of color. I had an over-drive put into it and I decided to put in a Turner, rebuilt, 2.5 4-cylinder engine. It is my understanding that the Turner rebuilt engine is the finest in the world. Warwick 4 x 4 usually does not use Turner engines, but I found it an easy thing to do to contact Turner myself and have the engine delivered. The whole process took approximately 14 weeks. After the vehicle was completed and test driven, it was placed in its individual container and put on a ship that is organized by Warwick and shipped to the United States. On the receiving end, I called an export-import broker in Jacksonville, Florida and they made all the arrangements to have the container off-loaded, inspected by customs and, generally, have it ready for my pick-up. Surprisingly, it went well, without any hitch. The only problem customs had was they could not understand how a 1962 vehicle had 50 miles on the odometer. I have had this vehicle now for 2,000 miles and it is absolutely a marvelous piece of equipment without any significant problems. The only problem I had was it blew a fuse because the windshield wiper wires were reversed. Other than that, the engine works flawlessly, has not burned any oil and, believe it or not, thus far no fluids are dripping on my driveway. If anyone would like to have more details about this operation, please do not hesitate to call me or contact me via internet Benjamin G. Newman,MD 1962 88'series 111 1967 109' series 11A SW ------- End of Forwarded Message From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 15:31:22 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: lro@team.net Subject: newbie[@aol] Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 14:09:16 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO ------- Forwarded Message Sender: "BwanaE" Message-Id: <9408191117.tn131560@aol.com> To: land-rover-owner-request@stratus.com Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 11:17:14 EDT Subject: new member Howdy Rover nuts! Just read about this forum in the Spring issue of "the Aluminum Workhorse" and thought I'd toss my hat into the ring. The name's Eric Cope and my AOL address is: Bwana E , my Internet address is bwanae@aol.com . Current vehicles are: ' 72 SWB, 2 1/4 petrol, refurbished. ' 67 LWB , 2.6 NADA 6-cyl, station wagon, 100% restored. ' 63 SWB, 2 1/4 petrol, RHD, bad chassis and bulkhead, but hey... it was free (hadn't been driven in 4 years and was quietly rotting away in Bodega Bay, Ca.). I'm starting work on the ' 63 now and need a solid chassis and bulkhead to proceed.... anybody out there have any leads? I'm also always on the lookout for a spare 2.6 litre, NADA 6-cyl engine that I could overhaul and keep tucked away in the garage. Thanks, Eric. ------- End of Forwarded Message From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 15:30:44 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: land-rover-owner@team.net X-Copyright-1994: William Caloccia, All Rights Reserved. Subject: Rover Availability Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 15:04:34 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO At the AROC event, John and I met a Bill from the Penaine & Yorks. club, and he's landed a job working in the states (Buffalo) - don't know if any subscribers are from Buffalo. He'll probably join the list once he gets a computer sorted out over there. He's sold his trialler, and his Rangie and another vehicle are on the block. He's sorting out bits in his garage, 'cause he won't be taking all his bits with him. Evidently, he's quite handy repairing the innards of gear boxes & transfer cases and the like, and has a pile of parts from ones torn down, not to mention some spare engines and other bits to get rid of. I'll be up that way next w/e (Bank Holiday) to Wigan on Friday for a site visit, and then over the Penaines to Yorks for his club w/e. At the present time we're both in the market for LWBs - he is contemplating either a 109 or a 110. I'm looking more for a solid 109 at this time. I got the Septermber LRO yesterday and have been ringing up folks since. Basically, the business seems to be that most of the suppliers with ex-mod will buy them direct (at auction), and will then have them hanging about, with one or two that are checked and fitted. On inquiry, they'll show you an example of what they'll do before putting it on the road, etc., and you could buy one that is ready to go, or ask for whatever particular bits and pieces you want, and they'll build it to order. Some of the places will sell a 109" in running condition, other wise, they're 'as is' from the MOD. Some places won't sell one unless it's been gone over entirely (#4000 +). A couple of the larger places had lhd's in stock (some in quantity), but most siad they would do them to order, as they only stocked rhds. Prices are all for X-Mod 109" 2.25 petrol Soft-Tops, RHD, unless noted otherwise, w/ MOT & reg.papers. PA Blanchard #2500-3000 Cab diesel '81 #3950 Xmod SW '81 #3950 LW VASS #2650+vat truck cab #3000 L/R Center #4000 Crook Bros #3500-4000 Brooklyn #2500-3500 Jackson #3000-5250 N.London (not gone over) #2200 some going over #2500 So basically, I'll visit Brooklyn, maybe a couple other places. I haven't managed to sell all of the fleet in the states (including a '69 L/R, new foot wells and door posts presently in the rear awaiting welding...and an '85 XR4Ti), so the top-end at lhd,'81,5dr, only 30,000km for $7800 still seems a bit far away, but I'd prefer a 4 door... (I've only ever owned one four-door anything in eight cars.) I checked with the AA and got another insurance quote, the additional cost for LHD would be #34/year (~#535 for rhd), so that seems reasonable. I figure I can really screw up my mind for a couple years - driving on the left side of the road with a left hand drive and get away with it. -B From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 17:43:02 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 17:40:35 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Mid Atlantic Rally X-Status: Status: RO Trying hard to get out of town...5:30 and the report is almost finished...it'll save the state highway department a couple o' mil. As soon as it's in the post, I'm off to the site of the rally: we have a work weekend to put the finishing touches on the trials course. Got a skip loader to dig a suitable mud bog in a naturally boggy area, but with 3-5" of rain two days ago, that might be "coals to Newcastle". (I sure hope the construction materials for the Camel Trophy-style bridge didn't get washed downstream!) Then it's off for a week of four wheelin' in the western VA/NC mountains - no destination...just wherever the the road leads. See ya'll in a week. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 20:20:16 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Rust Buster (was new RN toy...) From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Fri, 19 Aug 94 19:53:43 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Jon Humphrey writes: > SO what kind of oil do you guys use? It has varied through the years. Last year was some kind of specialised Texaco stuff used for rust proofing. > Can I just do an Autumn oil change and use the gunky black stuff that is > coming out of the sump? I have plenty of that stuff in my fancy plastic > oil change container. The one where you take your old oil to some > enviromentaly responsible recycler instead of dumping it in the weeds or > in the storm sewer. I wouldn't use the stuff from the sump. It isn't the best stuff to use and probably has all sorts of junk in it. Used oil is sent for recycling whenever the city allows people to bring it in. > Also do you use a plastic spray bottle, or a pump oil can, or some > exotic air powered mechanism? We have a set of rather large steel ramps to drive the Land Rovers up on so you can easily get underneath the beast. From there is is a sprayer attached to a very large 5hp 2 stage compressor. It does quite a good job with what ever attachments happen to come along to the event. The Oiler is generally a day long event with a number of Land Rovers (plus an MGB that showed last year). The club kitchen trailer comes along for feeding the assembled people lunch et cetera. Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 19 23:14:48 1994 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 1994 22:09:48 -0600 (MDT) From: Stevens Subject: US-model Defender "90s" and prices To: LRO_List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Just noticed a correction notice in the Globe and Mail newspaper. It appears Land Rover Canada copy checkers let their ad get into Time magazine, World of Wheels mag and a couple of other mags with an incorrect (US dollar?) price. The correction says the price for the new 90 should be $33,800 (CDN). I checked the ad, and it says prices "starting around $27,900." I hadn't noticed it the first time I read the ad, and wonder how many people read the complete copy and ran down to order their "bargain" Defenders. By the way, Lone Star Motors, the Land Rover dealer here in Calgary has an ad in the local paper today warning that they've got _only_ two (2) Defenders left at $33,799, with $6,534 worth of options at no extra charge, then they list: full canvas, running boards, installed rear seats and belts, alloy wheels, freight. For those on the list looking for a Defender, perhaps Western Canada is the promised land. (I have no involvement with Lone Star, I'm just trying to be a Land Rover facilitator). -- Henry ================================================ /==============\ Henry Stevens | | | stevensh@cuug.ab.ca [|______|_______|] Calgary, Alberta, CANADA /___/^^^^^^\___\ |(@) [####] (@)| Have '64 MGB, want LWB Land Rover (need $$) | o [####] o | ======%%%%====== "Without a real car, I'm only {*}={&&}====={*} half a man." -Dean Jones {*} {*} "The Love Bug" ================================================ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sat Aug 20 13:24:50 1994 From: Malcolm956@aol.com Sender: "Malcolm956" To: lro@team.net Date: Sat, 20 Aug 94 14:17:00 EDT Subject: Re: Camping X-Status: Status: RO I am afraid I overstated the crudeness of my camping when I said that I slept in the dirt. Sleeping on the ground, usually in a 1 or 2 person tent would have been more like it. I even favor the use of sleeping pads or air mattresses though they are not a necessity unless the weather and ground are cold. Still, a fellow camper once told me that the comforts of home are best enjoyed at home. He had a point. The trick to camping, as I see it, it to balance the rig against the given conditions and your needs. So over the years I have accumulated a lot of different kinds of camping equipment. For base camp work I still favor my Coleman "Redwood" tent trailer and a very large, self supporting dining fly. The trailer is one of the smaller ones on the market but pulls out for a double bed on one side and a single on the other. Left behind in the space the bunks vacated is a table with bench seats, and a sink, propane stove and cabinets for eating & cleaning stuff. That trailer was a godsend for my family of five on a 9000 mile cross country trip. A small fly is used over the door to serve as a mud room and porch. The recent addition of a Sears porta pottie (required equipment for sailboat camping trips) makes the middle of the night quite civilized. The dining fly is my oldest piece of equipment. It is a 12'x20' bright yellow cotton canvas tarp that a Boy Scout troop declared surplus over 30 years ago. Cotton is nice because it is far more resistant than nylon to fireplace sparks. The ridge runs the 12' dimension and is supported by 8' adjustable poles. The corners are at 6'. A standard picnic table will fit under one half of the fly, leaving the other half free for play pens, lounge chairs, etc. My wife and I can set it up in about 10 minutes. If you set it up carefully, it is quite wind resistant. Once I kept the fly up through the remnants of a hurricane at Fundy National Park, when even a mountain tent at a nearby campsite went down. One side was pegged to the ground, the center poles shortened to less than six feet and the other end was less than four. Not much room for me, but it kept the kids out of the downpours. Of late I have done more camping by myself, first by bicycle and now in my dory. Here the rigs are minimal to marginal. While it is reasonable to drive the Land Rover ten miles out of the way just to hit a campground, it doesn't work on a bike. Often you need to do some very low profile camping. Fortunately in New England we have no beasties more venomous than mosquitoes and blackflies, so for this work I use a 10'x10' fly and mosquito netting. The home made fly is camouflage nylon, bias cut, so that it is very stable, like the commercial Parafly. My knees are not responding too well to bicycling these days so I am doing more sail camping along the coast of Maine. Here the Land Rover has pulled more than one exotic car or truck from a steep, slippery boat launch ramp. Twice a day tidal wetting of a boat ramp and the blue-green algae that live in the intertidal redefine the concept of slippery. The dory is an open boat with thwarts that run crossways. I cut plywood sheets to bolt to the thwarts for a deck and sleeping platform with storage under for waterproof canoe bags. I swing the sprit pole horizontally from the mast with the halyard at after end and the snotter at the forward. A custom fitted brown poly tarp is draped over the pole, snapped to the gun'nls and, bingo, I have a tent. The part that covers the cockpit can be folded back for fair weather. It is just like camping in a tent with a patio. I prefer to anchor off shore and sleep aboard, but often the thing to do is to camp on an island. A light weight rig is useful to minimize trips lugging stuff ashore. The combination of Land Rover and Swampscott dory really attracts attention. But you get some weird looks in mainland campgrounds when you drive in, step the mast, rig a tarp and sleep in the boat on the trailer. Some kind of fly, whether an awning from the side of the vehicle, a large self standing fly, a 10'x10' nylon tarp between trees, a tarp stretched over a pvc frame or a cover over the cockpit of the boat can make or break a camping trip. In other than perfect weather, a fly might be the most important piece of camping equipment. Dave VE4PN's extruded aluminum track can be thought of this way: the cross section is like the letter 'p', but with the right side cut away like the letter 'c'. It should be as many feet long as the tarp you are using. Rivet the stem of the 'p' to something solid. Fold, or sew, a tarp over a piece of rope and feed it in through the open end of the 'c'. The rope must be big enough to not pull out through the slot but small enough to slide in endwise. This system is commonly used on small sailboats to secure the sail to the mast using a bolt rope. The bottom line of all this blathering is that I enjoy camping, heavy or light. I don't enjoy an overstuffed car, so for heavy camping I prefer to tow my home and goods behind me and leave the car freed up for automotive use. For light camping, I like to have it all fit in one pack basket and not clutter up the car. As to age. At 61 I have trouble thinking of someone at 48 as an old lady. Rather, I would say, approaching prime and about to catch her second wind. It is never too late to have a happy childhood. That is what Land Rovers are all about. Malcolm From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 12:19:18 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: vance is missing From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Sun, 21 Aug 94 10:14:01 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Has anyone heard from Vance Chin in the last week or so? If you are out there Vance then pls e mail me asap Rgds Robin Craig -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:24:36 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:16:33 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: paulus@nextover.pe.utexas.edu Subject: Re: POLL-for 109/2.25L petrol owners Cc: lro@stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO How the heck do you manage to get 9km/l??? This is petrol, yes? (9km/l * 2.28 = 20miles/gallon!) That's almost double what I get! What's your secret?!? Interested in selling? Also, more info on your air conditioning would be of great interest to my girlfriend. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:28:43 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:19:04 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: robm@hpman010.uksr.hp.com, land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: 88" sIII Questions X-Status: Status: RO > Has anyone set up a sleeping arrangement with a board over the passenger > seat? I know you'll all laugh and say if you want to sleep in it buy a 109 > but I'm only thinking of this for very rare (emergency) situations. > Scotty has done that in the past and found it to work well. He built up a cabinet in the back with the top at the same height as the metal wall behind the seats. At night, fold the pasenger seat forward and a hinged board comes forward to rest on where the glove box would be. > Anyway I think this will do for starters I'm off to the spares shop to get > a new steering wheel as mine is sheeding black gunk all over my hands on > the way to work!! > I had the same problem, and solved it with a steering wheel cover. A bit cheaper and easier. > Cheers, > > Rob Meredith. Welcome to the world of Land Rovers! By the way, are you an HP guy? Me too! (HP 3000 independent consultant, Cobol & Powerhouse.) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:25:34 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:21:07 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: land rovers and africa X-Status: Status: RO What was the name and author of the african wildlife book? Was it any good? Thanks in advance! P.s. congrats on the plans for a Rover! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:28:25 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:23:10 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: DEBROWN@srp.gov, lro@team.net Subject: Re: LR Reliability X-Status: Status: RO Just got back lasst night from a trip from San Francisco, Calif. north to Victoria and Vancouver, BC, then east to Banff and Jasper Nat'l parks, then to Edmonton, Alberta, then south to Calgary, Montana, Eastern Idaho, Utah. Turn right at Salt Lake city and Head for Reno and home. Did the SE Idaho to Reno in one day (close to, if not more than 700 miles.) Problems encountered: Gearshift lever broke. (Got welded for $5) 12v extension cord shorted out and melted. (Yanked out of socket and threw it away.) Parking brake cable broke. (I'll have to get it fixed if I'm gonna park in SF.) So are Land Rovers reliable? Well, keep in mind that my vehicle is 35 years old. (a 1959 Land Rover 109") So I'd have to say yes. (Also keep in mind that I'm a mechanical jinx and things do their darndest to fall apart around me. I've never had a toaster that worked properly.) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 13:51:48 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:25:14 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: For all you rugged lorrycampers....... X-Status: Status: RO There is reportedly a cookbook called the Manifold Cookbook, or something like that. I have not yet been able to find a copy, but several people I know have independently confirmed that it does exist. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 22:09:20 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:26:52 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: lots of questions, long, from non owner X-Status: Status: RO > Hello everyone, > > I have been looking at Land Rovers for about 2 years now and think > I would like to buy a 4 door 109. I am not really interested in running > the Rubicon trail (here in California), but would like to have the four > wheel drive ability for some roads/trails I know. (at one time, I owned > a Jeep, please, no flames) > I know that TerriAnn has a 109 and cruises quite happily it seems, > but I am a little concerned with gas, gas mileage, cruising range and > cruising speed. I have a Sunbeam Tiger, so obviously I'm used to less > than 30 mpg (even 20 and when I stay in town to run errands I'm scared to > predict the gallons per mile). However, if I fill up a Land Rover to get > out of Davis, the prospects of filling up the gas tank every 200-250 > miles doesn't seem fun. I've read the FAQ, 16 gallons is the standard > tank, right? I also have a 109", and do quite well. I've got a 12g tank under the passenger seat (if my girlfriend and I get into an argument, I just have to light a match. ) and a 20g tank under the load bed in the back. With the new roofrack, boxes on top, loaded down with 30 pounds of Rachel clothes, My overly heady bed/cabinet system, etc., we got 11 to 12 mpg. That translates into 384 miles. I thought the 12 gallon tank was standard, but I may be wrong. My 88" has 2 12 gallon tanks, and I have seen an 18 gallon tank that fits under the seat. > So, I figure a 109 running a standard petrol engine with an > overdrive would increase the gas mileage, cruising range, and make > perhaps 60mph sustainable on the freeway. Then, I saw the post a couple > days ago from Australia (sorry, I forgot who) about changing > differentials to 4.1:1 ratio. This is a 20% change from standard, right? > This is just about the same as the overdrive, right? So the overdrive > would be better from the standpoint that it can be engaged and > disengaged, and would have a greater change on engine rpms, but would be > heavier than differential gear changes. At normal elevation (sea level, around The City,) I can cruise at 65 - 70 mph quite comfortably in 4th OD, with the engine at just around 3000 rpms. I do have the Toro overdrive, though. At higher elevations, I have noticed a definite loss of power. I've heard that mucking around with the carburetor can take care of that. > What about both? Is that just plain insane? Why do people change > engines? Spare parts, non-oil leaks, power, what is the one biggest > reason? Does anyone change transmissions or tranfer cases? ie my jeep > got >20 mpg on the freeway at 65 and seemed to me to have a very low 4wd > first gear. I know it would make some people retch, but has anyone > completly different drive train in a Land Rover. I guess at the far end > of the scale, I saw a wrecked range rover for sale in the SF chronicle > for $5000. What would its drive train be like in an old 109? Why change engines? More power, easier parts, less weight. (The LR 4-cyl is a heavy bugger!) All kinds of engines have been put in, though. I've still got the 4-cyl. I wouldn't mind a new engine, but don't have several $K to have it done. (I can't even imagine doing that myself.) > The next thing I would like to discuss is for Northern California > Land Rover people: Scotty's. I thought I had the phone number written > down near my ever increasing pile of Aluminum Workhorses, FAQs and odd > printed out emails. However, I can't find it. Could someone post the > phone number and shop hours? Directions from some major freeway would > really help, although I think I have maps of the entire Bay Area. I > would like to stop by on Monday. Scotty is mostly retired after the loss of his wonderful wife of 42+ years to a year long fight with cancer. He does do some work out of his house, though. He rebuilt my transmission just before we left, and did a bunch of other stuff too. His number is in the Aluminum Workhorse, which I don't have handy (of course.) I think it might be 1-510-285-2255 but I'm not 100% sure. > Now for those who live in the Land Rover home country. The spring > 1994 Aluminum Workhorse had an article written by Pat Hubbard that > concerned her faithful 109 fondly nicknamed the tank. She tells a really > wonderful tale of the beast and finishes by hoping that she can sell it > to someone in the states on the hopes that it will be well taken care of > instead of going eventually to a scrap yard. Her address is 10 Park > Close, Mount Tabor, Halifax, West Yorkshire HX2 0RG. From the for sale > ad she posted in the back, her phone is (0422) 355347. I am wondering if > any internet connected land rover person knows pat and her tank? I would > like to know if it is still for sale and whether it is in as first class > shape as it appears. I am in the process of writing her a letter and > might give a ring, but the task of buying something that big in another > country is daunting! > I saw that, and it truly did look nice. If you want something a little less spectacular, you might consider a trip to New Zealand to get one. (Cheap vehicles.) I'm not sure what would be involved in bringing a foreign vehicle into California, though. (Smog and all.) > john f hess phd (wow, really?) > jfhess@ucdavis.edu > > from home via modem --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 22:07:32 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:29:00 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: jory@mit.edu, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Electric Rovers X-Status: Status: RO Here's what I've found out about electric vehicles, so far: ON the 'net, there's the Electric Vehicle Discussion Mailling List. I haven't subscribed yet, so I don't know what it's like. "Discussions about the present and future direction of electric vehicles. Not intended as a forum for comparing electric vehicles to other vehicles." To subscribe, E-mail listserv@sjsuvm1.sjsu.edu and put in your message "SUBSCRIBE EV " There is also the Sacramento Electrical Vehicle Assn. They meet the 2nd saturday of each month at SMUD (Sacto Municipal Utility Distric) offices at 6201 S. Street from 10 - 12. Their address is 6837 Cunningham Way, Sacramento, Ca 95828. Phone # is (916) 318-4236. Also, there is a company doing electric conversions for a living in Sacto. They're Drive Electric, and can be reached at 1-916-442-5110. They're where I got most of my info. Their cost of parts is around $7000, with a total conversion being about $12,000. They use lead acid batteries, and the battery weight is about twice that of a traditional engine. (So about the same as a LR 4-cyl?) They can do top speeds of 65, 75, 85, or 95mph, with most being 75mph. They have a range of about 60 miles, and charge (fully) in 8 = 10 hours. They hook into the existing transmission and a standard transmission works better than an automatic. There is a tax incentive... Calif. will take up to $1000 off what you owe if you spend that much on an electric conversion. The feds will allow a deduction of 10% of what you put into an electric conversion. (I'm not sure if that includes the cost of the car or just the conversion.) SMUD (I don't have their number, but info in Sacto will -- ask for the electric vehicle operations number) generally has a booth at the state fair in Sacto. (August 19 - Sept. something, I think, and a lot of fun.) I would love to hear about your experiences! Welcome to The City! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From sinasohn@crl.com Sun Aug 21 21:15:12 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:31:39 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? X-Status: Status: RO I've never heard of such a thing, but I want one! If you find a source, please post the info. Thanks! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 22:07:24 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:34:21 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: twakeman@apple.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: POLL- LR camping X-Status: Status: RO I've given Brad an article on my setup, and would like to follow up with articles on other folks' setups, so this thread is of great interest to me. In any case, here's how we had things set up for this last vacation: I have a "Blevins Bed" that I built (badly) from plywood. This consists of a box kite-like frame that is (supposedly) the same height as the wheel arch-bench things. There are four compartments in this framework, within which are stored my clothes, cooking/eating utensils, laptop computer & supplies, and whatever other miscellaneous items will fit. I intend to add doors and bottom board to enclose these compartments at some point. On top of this framework going all the way to the starboard side of the rover is a piece of plywood. Another sits on top of this during the day, and then slides over the other half of the load bed at night to make a two-person bed. On the port side I've got a pair of cabinets that fit at the forward end of the wheel-arch to hold foodstuffs and such. Next to that is a 5gallon propane tank like used on barbeques and RV's. Finally, at the very back is a smallish cooler. For general on-road use, this all fits in securely, and only one bolt is used to secure the cabinet. I'm going to build another cabinet that will hold a smaller (2-1/2 gallon?) propane tank that I picked up. The propane stove goes on top of the cabinet (until you start moving at which point it promptly falls off.) I'm going to add some moulding and magnets to hold it in place, and yet allow for easy removal. Rachel's clothes and such went into a big duffel bag and a daypack that sat on the bed during the day, and the front seats at night. Table and chairs got strapped to the roof rack as did the portable toilet (once we realized that we wouldn't be using it at rest areas and RV parks.) I also picked up two boxes for the roof rack to hold the clothes, teacher books, and other souvenirs Rachel picked up along the way. Tools and spares go either behind the seats (with the first aid kit and fire extinguisher) or in a storage box built into the starboard side wheel bench just ahead of the wheel. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:30:12 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:38:00 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: maloney@wings.attmail.com, land-rover-owner@stratus.com, debrown@srp.gov Subject: Re: Gearbox and OVLR X-Status: Status: RO The Aluminum Workhorse has been pretty regular since I joined up. It comes (I think) every 3 or 4 months, and Brad Blevin's cartoons are worth the price alone! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:24:32 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:44:07 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: canvas bags revisited. X-Status: Status: RO Sounds like these water bags might be a candidate for sitting in the spare tire on the bonnet? I'm gonna have to see if I can find one hereabouts. (Or else order one.) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:28:04 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:45:10 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: LULU has a new set of shoes... X-Status: Status: RO Wow! So it was 25 quid for all five rims? As in 5 pounds per rim? That's Cheap! Even if you add in the 145 pounds shipping, that comes to only 34 pounds per rim, which is like 50 USD each. I think I'm going to have to look into this myself. I don't care too much about the color or galvanizing them, and I live close to SFO (I can walk there from my current client's office), so this sounds great. There is also about two blocks from work a place that sells used tires. They have a contract such that they get tires off of totaled cars and the like. So virtually brand new tires off of some little rich kid's rice burner will cost 50 - 60 USD. (I was looking at a couple of Dunlop Radial Rovers they had for $60.) Now I just have to decide: Do I want new rims (and of course I'd have to order other miscellaneous parts at the same time), or a new voice mail system, or. . . --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:24:38 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:46:13 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: What is Happening X-Status: Status: RO > Anybody confirm the need for Rhino bars in rural New York? Isn't that where New Yorkers go to meet wild women? (Sorry, couldn't resist! :-) > For those that missed out, I am still collecting names of Rovers > so drop me a note to be included. Have a bunch but will wait till > I come back from the mystic east before a write up a list. Decided to stick with "Indy" on my 109". Still no word on the 88", though. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:28:17 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:46:16 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: CXKS46A@prodigy.com, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: Rover on TV X-Status: Status: RO Maybe someone should be keeping a list of celebreties who own Rovers? The one's I've heard of are: Robert Wagner (Too cool not to) Robin Williams (Defender, but used to drive an 88 before Mork) Janet Jackson (Gift from agent or someone) John Rhys Davies (According to Sandy Grice) I haven't personally confirmed any of these, but they come from good sources. Robert Wagner's I heard about because of a news story wherein it was stolen and he chased the guy to get it back. (I think with the cops.) My roommate (Who keeps up on the entertainment world) spotted a story about Janet Jackson's gift. I think it was a Disco, but I'm not sure. A Rover owner in The City saw two guys in a Defender and went to talk to them about it and the LROA and after a while, got this feeling that he knew the driver. He then realized that it was Robin Williams. He told the story to Scotty who passsed it on to me. Any others? --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:25:11 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:46:24 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: ranger@ugcs.caltech.edu, lro@team.net Subject: Re: Land Rover 90 on CNN X-Status: Status: RO Well, I'd have to argue with that last one... Who needs to recycle a car when it lasts for 50+ years? Are cloth shopping bags worse than paper because paper bags can be recycled? That's pretty darn silly, if you ask me! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:24:39 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:46:28 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: robm@hpman010.uksr.hp.com, land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: Any info on landies in Aus X-Status: Status: RO There was a thread recently about how cheap Landies are in New Zealand. Might be the way to go. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:25:02 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:46:35 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: CXKS46A@prodigy.com, land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: re: The Great Adventure X-Status: Status: RO One of my past clients was a graphic design company that did a lot of cigarette packaging. (I wasn't very happy about it, but I have to make a living. (I know, no excuse.)) Anyway, for the longest time, one of the designers had a model camel trophy LR on the partition around his workspace. One day I got around to asking where he'd gotten it, and he said it wasn't his. He didn't know whose it was, and said I should just take it. So now it's an important part of my collection. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 22:08:35 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 10:46:40 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: twakeman@apple.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping X-Status: Status: RO I too like the minimalist approach, and I do go backpacking a fair bit. But on the other hand, why bother feeding a land rover if you're not going to make use of it? A bed, some cabinets, a coleman stove, even a cooler is not too much if you've got room. I was even thinking of rigging up a shower of sorts. I see the Rover as more like a sailboat than a backpack. It's like a miniature home. I don't need the 19" color TV, microwave, and flush toilets that a lot of RV's have, but I do like a nice, dry place to sleep. That makes it easier to stay out where there are more than 3 stars in the sky longer. Mind you, if I'm traveling alone, most of the storage space remains empty. Just because there's more space than there is stuff I want to bring. My idea of luxury is a *fork* in addition to the chopsticks! While I'm thinking of it, what do I carry, besides tools and spares? * First aid kit (don't leave home without it) * Plate (maybe two) * two cups (one for soup, one for tea/wine/milk/etc.) * Fork/spoon/chopsticks * Kershaw straight knife (One of the best things I've ever bought) * small can opener * frying pan * sauce pan * Clothes (usually, one *small* duffel bag -- another best buy: $5 and who cares about the indiana horses or whatever team is on it!) * Coleman 2 burner stove (Price Club = $50?) * Propane tank (Price Club = $15) * 1 std coleman canister (just in case) * Coleman propane lantern (Price club = $30) * Propane pipe (attaches to tank, lantern sits on top, connectors for stove) * 5 gallon bottle of water * water pump for 5 gallon bottle (Orchard Supply Hardware) * cooler * mattress pad (think this is gonna get thicker - my back is killing me) * Coleman Sleeping bag (unless it's gonna get *real* cold, then I bring a real sleeping bag) * Fanny pack with mini maglite, pouch for camera, water bottle bag, and aforementioned Kershaw * Water bottle * Camera * spare film * CB Radio * Big box of kleenex (Sinasohn nose) * 12v spotlight * Cellular phone Optional equipment: * Atari Lynx video game system (great for the passenger on long trips) * Handheld color TV & powered antenna (Rachel wanted to watch some football game once on the way to Reno. Just before the big LA Earthquake) * Laptop computer * 12v Inverter (to power the Laptop) * Radio * portable toilet (if camping away from restrooms and Rachel's along) * Folding table (for playing poker) * Folding chairs That's about it. Anybody bring along anything that I might want to bring? --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 13:56:53 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 11:53:02 -0700 From: Roger Sinasohn To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Lost mail X-Status: Status: RO I seem to have not gotten any mail since Friday, so if someone could save and forward the digests from Saturday on to me like about tuesday, I would *really* appreciate it. I don't know if things will get fixed before then, so that's why Tuesday. I think it may have had something to do with having like 500 messages  500 messages in my box when I got back from vacation... thanks in advance! Uncle (lost in cyberspace) Roger From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 12:52:43 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 08:38:53 +1100 Subject: Shocks and Disc Brakes X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Dear LRO's, I have a 1968 88 which currently has the Rancho RS-5000 shock absorbers: # 5163 on front and # 5169 on rear. Is there anyone aware of another company, such as Monroe, that makes a shock absorber with overload springs for the Land Rover? If someone out there knows of one, I would appreciate the manufacturer's stock number since manufacturers have cross over numbers but may not list the Land Rover in their catalog. Second question: Can an older Land Rover be retro-fitted with front disc brakes? If so, can you share the companys address and telephone number? Several of us from the Spokane area are caravanning to the Portland All British Meet over Labor Day. This year the car featured is the Land Rover. The word out on the Rover street is that there will be around 70-80 Land Rovers! Hope to see you all there. Regards, John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From @uga.cc.uga.edu:PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU Sun Aug 21 20:47:36 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 94 21:42:39 LCL From: Joseph Broach Subject: Re: LULU has a new set of shoes... To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 11 Aug 1994 09:32:02 -0500 (CDT) X-Status: Status: RO I was thinking about giving Sidney the same treatment soon. Is their any disadvantage to going from 15" to the 7.50 x 16" wheels? I need some new treads anyway, so that's not a problem. Thanks!! -Rgds, Joseph '67 ser IIa 88"...Sidney From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Aug 21 21:38:51 1994 Date: Sun, 21 Aug 1994 21:18:05 -0500 (CDT) From: David John Place Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping To: TeriAnn Wakeman Cc: Malcolm956@aol.com, lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9408191615.AA04465@apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Someone described the tent track as a "P" on its side with the "P" part open so a rope could be pulled through it. The stuff is cheap, and it can be bent to follow the roofline of the Rover. I presently have a green canvas tarp with red and white fringe on it that I use for the tent part. With the track on the side of the safari roof, and I am 5' 11", I can stand up straight. I use tent poles that nest inside each other, and they have a spring loaded catch to keep them from nesting when in use. I have four ropes with wooden toggles run out to pegs, and this make a great cover. The best setup however is to use a screened room from a 13' travel trailer attached to this track. It has a "sod cloth" and screen to cover the area under the Rover so no mosquitoes can get in. It is great for camping in the Canadian bush. I presently use a ground pad just thick enough to lift my hips off the ground, but later this fall, I am going to go wild and get a military cot of the folding variety and do it up right. Cheers. Dave VE4PN From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 18:08:25 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 16:01:13 +1100 Subject: RE: Rover Camping Gear X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Dear LRO's, This camping gear and set up works for me and has been refined after years of geologic mapping and camping in Wilderness Areas in the Western United States: - Dome style tent, North Face VE24 - large enough to store gear, small enough to pack economically - a tough tent! - Inflatible foam pad - comfy, but can be stored in small bag - Sleeping bag - down filled; warm nights used as comforter, cold nights, only down will make it! Down breaths easier than synthetics - Lights: candle lanturn for tent, divers flashlight, 12v spotlight, propane camp lanturn - Coleman gasoline stove - always gas available; stove stand - REI roll-up table - strong, yets stores economically - Various knives, utencils, cheese graters, plastic cutting board, paper towels, stainless steel coffee perculator - Estwing axe and hatchet - Two Rubbermaid ACTIONPACKERS - best thing that ever happened in camp storage! Holds all the above loose items including the Coleman stove. - 32 qt. ice chest - Two five gallon poly-military water containers - Shower set-up: 12v demand RV water pump - pumps heated Coleman stove water to shower head hooked on roof rack w/tarp for privacy if around public... System is cheap and works great! - Various tarps and adjustable camp poles, numerous length dacron 5 mm ropes, parachute cord, carabiners, and bungee cords. Poles are carried in 4" PVC pipe with screw plug at one end and secured to roof rack when traveling - 8'x10' tarp rolled on 1" PVC tied to the roof rack and can be quickly unrolled for shade. - Canvas water bags (that leak!!) - Camera gear: two Nikon F's w/various lenses. Five inch Celestron SCT telescope - both packed in foam lined aluminum cases. - Small Shortwave radio with long wire antenna. - Fly fishing gear From all of this gear, one can throw a sleeping bag out on the grass; or set up a quick tent camp; or go all out and set up a complete campsite for a comfortable extended stay! Properly stored, all of this gear does not take up that much room. My setup makes a very comfortable camp. You can see it set up at the Portland All British Meet during Labor Day holiday. Regards, John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 02:10:34 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 09:02:01 +0200 (MET DST) From: Roeland van Delzen Subject: Dutch LRO To: lro@team.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Hallo! As a new member to this list, I'd like to introduce myself. My name is Roeland van Delzen and I live in the Netherlands. Since 10 years I'am infected by the Landrover virus. At the moment, I drive a 1992 Defender 110 Tdi Stationwagon. This car if fully preparated for long distance journeys (GPS navigation, long distance fuel tanks, Air Camping, raised air intake, protection guards, frige, etc). In the past I had a 72 III 109, 70 III 109, 82 88 III, 89 90 TD. As usual I still have many boxes with parts of all those cars. Recently I joined the Land Rover Club Holland which organises off road weekends, joint vacations trips (Island) and of course technical assistance. Besides off roading in the weekends, I mainly use my LARO for vacation. Once a year I make a long(er) trip. This summer I went to Africa and crossed the Maroccan/Algerian dessert and the High Atlas Mountains. I can recommend this trip to any globetrotter. Now some questions I'am interested in: 1) Is there anybody from Denmark on this list ? As I have a Danish girlfriend I'am regularly in Denmark and wondered if there are any off road clubs overthere (Jutland area / Sonderborg) 2) I plan to go to Island coming summer (July 95). Is there somebody from Island on this list and/or has somebody been there ? I like to exchange some experiences. E.g. what is the fastest / cheapest way to come there ? 3) I plan to buy some 9.00 size tyres for my 110. Does somebody know where to buy them. And how much ## ? 4) Recently I came across a 1.20 m deep river and (of course) went through it (knowing I had my raised air intake). My Tdi went through is beautifully, however, (lots of ) water/mud came into my air ventilation system. After cleaning and drying it, my fuses burn through the whole time. Has anybody tips for this ? Looking forward to hear from you, Roeland van Delzen Maarssen / The Netherlands From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 07:50:16 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 07:57:50 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Softtops on the Mid-Atlantic Off Road Course To: CXKS46A@prodigy.com Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Sandy, I just received the flyer for the Mid Atlantic rally and noticed a line stating that no open topped vehicles would be allowed on the off road course, only enclosed vehicles. How does a canvas topped vehicle fit in? I understand that a hoop set does not afford the same protection as a roll bar or hard top. Is the course rough enough that roll overs are likely? If so is there another side trip planned through logging roads or such? I realize you're away for the week and won't expect a quick reply. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 07:41:40 1994 Date: 22 Aug 94 08:28:07 EDT From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com> To: ALL Subject: FOUR WHEEL DRIVE. X-Status: Status: RO Help......I can't get my '66 109 wagon into four wheel drive.I push the yellow knob in and it won't stay down..What's wrong and how do I fix it? Thanks Benjamin G. Newman,MD From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 07:50:49 1994 Date: 22 Aug 94 08:43:55 EDT From: Randy Parker <75300.2654@compuserve.com> To: Land Rover Owners Subject: Reuters News blip on Land Rover X-Status: Status: RO LONDON, Aug 21 (Reuter) - Profits at Land Rover, the four-wheel drive vehicle unit of Bayerische Motoren-Werke's (BMW) Rover Group, will be at least 150 million stg this year and could top 200 million next year, the Sunday Times said. The newspaper said motor industry sources told it Land Rover made profits last year of about 120 million stg on sales of 1.3 billion. This year, sales will aproach two billion stg and the business is expected to reach profits of 150 million despite launch costs of an expected new super-luxury Range Rover. BMW bought Rover this year from British Aerospace Plc, which did not split out Land Rover and the Rover cars unit's profits. The report said profits from Land Rover could hit 200 million stg next year, although the bottom-line figure could be reduced by a 68 million stg investment programme. It said the figures by implication showed the extent of losses at the conventional cars side of Rover Group. Rover last year reported operating profit of 56 million stg, implying Rover cars lost about 64 million stg. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 07:57:58 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 13:48:40 +0100 From: anonymous To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.Net Subject: Importation & Registration Questions X-Status: Status: RO -------- Feel Free to respond in private, I'll summarized or re-send as requested, anonymously... With the immenent moving of a FOL (Friend Of the List) to the States, a number of questions have become important: (1) Old petrol engined vehicles be freely imported which were made up until (a) but not including, 1967 ? (b) and including 1967 ? (please site source/reference) (2) Old diesel engined vehicles be freely imported which were made up until 19__ ? (please site source/reference) (3) If one were to bring in a pile of L/R parts, how does one then get a L/R on the road ? Kit Car Title ? An old L/R title (Salvage or Not) ? Are some state less anal ? Vermont ? (I know a number of european exotics (Lancia Delta Integrals, G-ladder Supercharged Golf 4x4s) that have landed via a certain rally prep shop there..) Anyone a Vermonter ? Massachusetts - as of five years ago, they only required a bill of sale to register a vehicle with a transferrable registration, if the said vehicle was greater than 10 years old. (John H. could you verify with the RMV if this is the case still ?) New York is a bit anal as I recall... but once you've to paper from somewhere else they'll take it. (4) Anybody have papers & bulkhead plate for a dead North American-spec L/R (or Pre-67) that won't be resurrected ? -anonymous From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 09:15:32 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 09:53:51 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Celebrity Rovers To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Cc: sinasohn@crl.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Roger writes: >> Maybe someone should be keeping a list of celebreties who own Rovers? The one's I've heard of are: Robert Wagner (Too cool not to) Robin Williams (Defender, but used to drive an 88 before Mork) Janet Jackson (Gift from agent or someone) John Rhys Davies (According to Sandy Grice) >> The celebrity Rovers I have heard of are: Billy Joel (109 which he sold a number of years ago) Ralph Lauren (2 Defender 110s sprayed black) Michael J. Fox (Range Rover at his Woodstock VT farm) Tom Kean (Ex-NJ governor-Defender 90) Aurthur Miller (Series I 80 or 86" - can't tell. I have a photocopy of a somewhat full figured Marilyn with one leg dangling out the driver's side - I doubt it's still his daily driver) Sting (I think) Bryan Adams (Defender 90 - look closely at the white spoked wheel on his recent album cover - the surrounding bodywork & frame should look familiar) Ted Nugent (I think it is a 109, but I'm not certain) If the above are somewhat or completely incorrect, I'm sure we'll hear from someone. Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 11:05:12 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 11:34:40 -0400 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Re: FOUR WHEEL DRIVE To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO Ben Asks: >> Help......I can't get my '66 109 wagon into four wheel drive.I push the yellow knob in and it won't stay down..What's wrong and how do I fix it? Thanks Benjamin G. Newman,MD >> Ben, I had a similar problem with my 109 when I first got it. I think that the shaft/s that allow the 4WD engagement dog are sticking/rusty/dry. I'll assume that the red knobbed lever was all the way forward when you pushed the yellow lever down. 1st, make sure your transfer is full of oil. Next pull back the red lever for 4WD low (it may be stiff/sticking). Be sure to engage the clutch first. This will engage the 4WD engagement dog which has oil slinging paddles what will throw the oil up against the shafts & everything else in the ouput housing. If you're on pavement and have free wheeling hubs, set the front hubs in the "free" position to prevent drivetrain wind-up. If you do not have lockable hubs and are on pavement, choose as straight a stretch as possible to keep wind up to a minimum. Drive it a few miles. Stop and work the red lever back & forth to free up the mechanism. With the red lever all the way forward, push the yellow knob (4WD low) down. It should stay down at this point. Pull the red lever all the way back, and then forward. The yellow knob should pop back up. If not, you probably have an internal fault in the output housing causing the mechanism to stick. If you were to remove the transfer and ouput assembly and separate and strip them down, you would find the problem. This stuff is not as complicated as it appears. Just follow your manual step by step. Good Luck! Bill maloney@wings.attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 11:24:43 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 09:14:39 MST From: DEBROWN@srp.gov To: lro@team.net, Offroad@ai.gtri.gatech.edu Subject: Finally did it! '95 Discovery!!! X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: Finally did it! '95 Discovery!!! Well, I finally did it, put a deposit and ordered a '95 Land Rover Discovery! Now the hard part... the 2-3 month wait! :( I've decided to go with everything, dual a/c, jump seats, automatic, dual sunroofs, and leather, plymouth blue, and also the rhino bars, or for the urbanites, "whino" bars. ;) Someone asked about rear fogs... yes, it does have them. they're the lower portion of the tail lamp assembly on the body (not the bumper lights) and are activated by a button on the left side of the dash. Differences from '94 to '95 model... still unknown, but will let you know as soon as I find out. I would like some help with the CD player though. LR uses a Pioneer 6 disk changer but is somehow integrated with the LR radio. Does anyone know if this particular model is available? I copied all the numbers off the unit I could find, and I think the model is a CDXM65. Are there any modifications to this that make it work with the stereo? I just can't see spending $800 for the LR unit if I can get it elsewhere for half of that. (other numbers on the unit are ANR3053 and NK001487) Now... to sell my '86 Acura and '87 Hyundai Excell... (Hint, hint...) Thanks to ALL of you who have responded to my notes asking for opinions, and advice on vehicles and equipment, etc... I REALLY appreciate all of you who have responded to me. When I do get it, I'd like to meet some of you! Let's go "wheeling"!!! I live in Phoenix (actually Mesa) Arizona USA. Anyone else??? #=====# "Never doubt that a small group of individuals |___|__\___ can change the world... indeed, it's the only | | | | thing that ever has." " "`O'""""`O'" -unknown From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 11:38:54 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 09:22:39 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: sinasohn@crl.com, ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu, lro@transfer.stratus.com Subject: Re: canvas bags revisited. X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408211744.AA14137@crl4.crl.com> Roger Sinasohn writes: > Sounds like these water bags might be a candidate for sitting in the spare > tire on the bonnet? I'm gonna have to see if I can find one hereabouts. > (Or else order one.) > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > San Francisco, California > Probably a poor idea.. 1. The better the air flow the better the cooling. 2. They are designed to leak slowly (and hang upright). The inside of your rim and the bonnet fixings would be wet all the time. I hang mine on the grill. I have a lock down post in the center front of the bonnet (from Previous owner) that I hang the bag from. The front of the car seems to be the best place to hang them while driving. If you hang it on the side from a mirror post or something it will flop around. Hang it in the back and you get a nice coating of dust, what ever the tyres kick up and whatever oil is leaking. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 11:34:07 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 17:24:57 +0100 (MET) From: S|ren Vels Christensen Subject: Post Vacation Posting To: lro@stratus.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Hi all. Well, i'm back on job from 2 weeks vacation (deep sigh!). I was curious to find out if i could go to Jutland and back with a busted gearbox. I could. Even made the ferry ramps. I picked up my 7 year old son for his first ride with Aurens. '' It's not as noisy as you said over the phone, dad''. ''What?'' ''It's not...'' We went to Roemoe, an island off the Jutland coast. It has a 3 km (2 mi) wide beach to the west. In August, all the German tourist are gone, and the wind makes some wonderful dunes, about 3 - 6 ft high. Did you know that a Landie (Landie!) could fly? The manual didn't mention it. I had to change the exhaust anyway. I think my friend Lawrence enjoyed a day at the beach. So did my son and i. About lubricating devices: I use a .50 l mustard bottle of thin plastic with a pointed spout at the end. Very cheap, very efficient. I keep the used ones, so that i won't have to gobble half a litre of mustard just beacuse the diff needs oil. Which is rare since i use teflon tape on the filler plugs. BTW, when we got home to my parents place from the beach, my dad said ''Your car is leaking oil''. When i checked, oil was dripping from the rear left corner. Hey, wait a minute. That can't be! Well it can be, - the before- mentioned device was in the tool compartment. And it was full when it put it there. Was! :-( Well, at least my tools won't rust. :-) I read about the Transsylvanian Trophy in the club magazine. 2 brits rolled over 2 1/2 times in a 130". It looks like a used car on the picture. A german in a 90" persuaded one of the local farmers to try the Defender instead of the ox to pull the plow. It went fine until the driver wacked it i 2. and released the engine. There is also a picture of a Rangie with at least 45deg toe-in. When reading the article it seems to be rather a tough outing. One stage was 50 km (30mi) long. In a river that is. Is Camel afraid to scratch the paint on the Disco's? Well enough for now. I'll try to get home without getting sick from CO2. CU +----------------------------+--------------------------------+ | Soren Vels | 1976 sIII 109" 2.25 petrol | | velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk | "Lawrence of Arabia" | ((|||)) | Royal Danish Air Force | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 | ((|||)) | Communications Specialist | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members. | ((|||)) +----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______ ######################((|||))#############((|||)) AVoN RANGEMASTER 7.50 16 ######################((|||))#############((|||)) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 13:53:26 1994 X-Sendmail-Version: 8.6.9 X-Authentication-Info: costales@localhost From: costales@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (Bryan Costales) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 09:33:48 -0700 To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Waving revisited X-Status: Status: RO My disco was in the shop this weekend (having whino bars installed), so I was using my grizzly Series III to get around town. While parked on University here in Berkeley, waiting for the local camera shop to open, I saw a cream colored 2A 88. I waved and they waved back. Very civilized. A short while later, a bright red disco came by. This time my wave was roundly ignored. Very uncivilized. If any of you you know the owner of a red disco in Berkeley. Please give that person a call and an education about rover road courtesy. That driver is, I fear, just one among the many who will be giving we disco drivers a bad name. -- Bryan Costales -- Systems Manager, International Computer Science Institute Internet: bcx@icsi.berkeley.edu BITNET: bcx@ucbicsi 37 degrees 52.193 minutes north by 122 degrees 16.277 minutes west From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 14:22:17 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 09:38:17 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: sinasohn@crl.com, DEBROWN@srp.gov, lro@team.net Subject: Re: LR Reliability X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408211723.AA13180@crl4.crl.com> Roger Sinasohn writes: > Parking brake cable broke. (I'll have to get it fixed if I'm gonna park in > SF. Parking brake CABLE???????? Lets see lever goes through seat to rod. Rod connected to metal leaver pointing dwen under passenger seat. connected o another rod to transfer case mounted mechanical brake. ummm where is there a cable in your mechanical brale system? > > So are Land Rovers reliable? Well, keep in mind that my vehicle is 35 > years old. (a 1959 Land Rover 109") So I'd have to say yes. (Also keep > in mind that I'm a mechanical jinx and things do their darndest to fall > apart around me. I've never had a toaster that worked properly.) Mine seems to be keeping going, but it sounds like its winding up for the olimpic piston throw. Scotty said to drive it & not to worry, but as soon as I get the MGB running reliably, I planing on taking the LR back to him to have him try to figure out what happened (It has been making the noise since he built the engine). I'm going to be taking it up to Portland all British FIeld meet this year, but going far from home with a rattling engine always scares me. I'm not good at not worrying when en angine rattles too loud to talk in the car. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > San Francisco, California > TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 11:56:21 1994 X-Authentication-Warning: tornadic.sw.stratus.com: Host localhost.stratus.com didn't use HELO protocol To: lro@team.net Subject: L/R of the stars: defender 110 ''polo`` Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 12:43:11 -0400 From: William Caloccia X-Status: Status: RO The salesman at my formerly local L/R dealer (Foreign Motors West, Natick, Ma) mentioned that Ralph Lauren evidently fitted his L/Rs with custom interiors (he being the designer and all), and the vehicles were re-sprayed to his specifications (somehow I got the impression that there were more than two, and they weren't necessarily the same colours). As there was a used one I was looking at on the lot, and he was hoping to make another sale to Ralph, I certainly wouldn't buy a 110's with 6300 miles, and one salt laden winter in the NE - [rust was already breaking through on the door posts and some other places ! ] for $2000 over the new list price. PS I also noticed that between the US Defender 110's and the '90's they added rubber gaskets at the body surfaces of the snap-together 'safari cages'... From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 13:05:11 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 10:32:48 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: sinasohn@crl.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Land Rover Camping X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408211746.AA14261@crl4.crl.com> Roger Sinasohn writes: > I too like the minimalist approach, Minimalist??? I thought I was taking everything except the kitchen sink > * First aid kit (don't leave home without it) I have a small one mounted to the inside fire wall > * Plate (maybe two) same > * two cups (one for soup, one for tea/wine/milk/etc.) One cup, but I travel alone > * Fork/spoon/chopsticks no chopsticks > * Kershaw straight knife (One of the best things I've ever bought) Old steak knife > * small can opener mediun size can opener > * frying pan > * sauce pan Camp cooking kit that has pot and lid that serves as frying pan & bowel > * Clothes (usually, one *small* duffel bag -- another best buy: $5 and who > cares about the indiana horses or whatever team is on it!) clothes in plactic tub with lid > * Coleman 2 burner stove (Price Club = $50?) same > * Propane tank (Price Club = $15) My propane tank is built into car in front of rear wheel > * 1 std coleman canister (just in case) same but for lantern > * Coleman propane lantern (Price club = $30) same > * Propane pipe (attaches to tank, lantern sits on top, connectors for Long hose to go between tank & stove > stove) > * 5 gallon bottle of water I bring two, but I also fill dog water dish, & use a lot for dishes > * water pump for 5 gallon bottle (Orchard Supply Hardware) I just lift & pour > * cooler same > * mattress pad (think this is gonna get thicker - my back is killing me) chase lounge pad > * Coleman Sleeping bag (unless it's gonna get *real* cold, then I bring a > real sleeping bag) real sleeping bag > * Fanny pack with mini maglite, pouch for camera, water bottle bag, and > aforementioned Kershaw not on my list > * Water bottle I use small bottle of bottled water > * Camera Tonnes of camera gear > * spare film lots of film in the cooler. some space left over for food > * CB Radio I leave it behind when I take the LR because i have not found a good place to put the magnetic antena > * Big box of kleenex (Sinasohn nose) paper towels > * 12v spotlight hand lantern > * Cellular phone Say what? folding table for stove (I cook outside car) folding chair pillow 2 buckets (one for washing, one for rinsing) coffee pot for tea and hot water for doing dishes Pile of tools, Rover's North catalogue in case I need to order parts on the road Dg food, dogs food & water dishes, long chain & old car cover for him to use as bed when I throw him out on chain for the night. small tarp rope small wood cutting board > > Optional equipment: > > * Atari Lynx video game system (great for the passenger on long trips) nope > * Handheld color TV & powered antenna (Rachel wanted to watch some football nope, I bring a book or two (minimlist you say?) > * Laptop computer Mine stays home (I'm escaping it) > * 12v Inverter (to power the Laptop) nope see above > * Radio nope > * portable toilet (if camping away from restrooms and Rachel's along) been thinking of one (usually about 3 AM) > * Folding table (for playing poker) always bring for cooking > * Folding chairs always bring, table is too low to lean over for too long > > That's about it. Anybody bring along anything that I might want to bring? optional, desert bag stuff fo a fire or BBQ second propane lantern > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > sinasohn@crl.com that none but madmen know." > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > San Francisco, California > Our lists of things to bring are very simular...minimilist you say? I never thought of it that way TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 12:08:27 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 18:33:20 +0100 (MET) From: S|ren Vels Christensen Subject: Umbrellas To: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9408181441.tn84002@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO On Thu, 18 Aug 1994 Malcolm956@aol.com wrote: > >So what does everyone else do?????????????? ... cut off ... > strong, and adjustable to fit Land Rover rear side windows. You may not be > into guns, but the racks are ideal for umbrellas, fishing rods, bow saws, ... cut off ... Off course an umbrella is a MUST. It's a British car, isn't it? :-) > Cheers from New Hampshire, > Malcolm > > =====__ > |[__]|_\_==_ > | | | ] > (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:{> BTW, i have a little (two inch) alf sitting next to the rear window. It's been there for ages. None of the previous owners dared to remove it, and neither do i. Who knows what will happend??? +----------------------------+--------------------------------+ | Soren Vels | 1976 sIII 109" 2.25 petrol | | velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk | "Lawrence of Arabia" | ((|||)) | Royal Danish Air Force | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 | ((|||)) | Communications Specialist | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members. | ((|||)) +----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 13:02:06 1994 Date: 22 Aug 94 13:33:46 EDT From: "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" <71773.3457@compuserve.com> To: ALL Subject: engine replacement X-Status: Status: RO I recently purchased a 1967 109"NADA wagon almost fully restored.After having some engine and oil leak problems I was told that my engine was a 1955-59 Rover car engine.I was told that parts for this engine are almost impossible to get and that this engine was the worst Rover made.I now want to replace it. Spoke to Mr. Turner of Turner engine fame from the UK who suggests replacing mine with a 4cyl.2.5 re-built by Turner.IF i did this I would like to change the rear ratio's to gain more speed [I do little off road work ].I would like to hear other's advise and suggestions.Thank Benjamin G. Newman From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 13:06:18 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 94 10:49:49 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: 71773.3457@compuserve.com, ALL@apple.com, LRO@team.net Subject: Re: FOUR WHEEL DRIVE. X-Status: Status: RO In message <940822122807_71773.3457_FHM53-1@CompuServe.COM> "BENJAMIN G. NEWMAN" writes: > Help......I can't get my '66 109 wagon into four wheel drive.I push the > yellow > knob in and it won't stay down..What's wrong and how do I fix it? > Thanks > Benjamin G. Newman,MD Benjamin, Don't panic yet. go under the car to where the front of the transfer case is.To the left of the back of the front drive shaft is the high range 4 WD linkage. The rod with the yellow knob connects to one end of a little bar that is bilted in the center. The other end of this bar connects to an inverted 'L' shaped rod that goes into the front top of the transfer case. You may just have lost a cotter pin or had the bolt fall off. I know you are new to land Rovers. The yellow knob is not used while in low range. it is for high range 4WD only, and is released by shifting the red knobed lever into low range and back. If you try to depress the yellow knob while in low range it will not stay down. If your problems is not one of the two above, you can go ahead & panic. Take care, TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 22 13:36:13 1994 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 1994 11:18:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Larry Rubens Subject: Reply to David Brown To: Land-Rover-Owner@Team.net In-Reply-To: <199408200655.HAA15777@chunnel.uk.stratus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO > I've been comparing the available sport utility vehicles sold in the USA > and my conclusion is: There is no comparison. Anyone that chooses > anything other than a Discovery (that could afford one) is a sick > individual and should be committed to an institution and/or shot. (IMHO) > I should clarify: For carrying 5 or more people, and commuting every day > with it. Otherwise, for purely off road use, the Defender would be the > vehicle of choice. I just went through the same routine and I agree 100%. I ordered a new 5-sp Discovery. We're not crazy are we? Are the Disco's as reliable as the other and older Land-Rovers? I need the niceties of the Disco for use as my "going out for the evening vehicle", but it doesn't seem to compromise on ruggedness which I also want. I can't afford the Defender anyway and especially can't afford a Range Rover. I wish there were more reports from Discovery owners, I'll post one when I get it but I suspect that may be two months from now. Regards ######################################################################### ## Larry Rubens <76330.1624@compuserve.com> ## ## "My opinions are my own, but in my opinion should be yours too" ## ######################################################################### From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug