From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 01:28:10 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Disco road test To: lro@stratus.com Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 00:22:12 -0600 (MDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 328 X-Status: Status: RO Disco road test results have been published: Whale, Gregory. "1994 Discovery: Disco is back... and it's music to our ears" FOUR WHEELER Vol. 31, no. 9 (Sept. 1994) p. 26-30 T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 07:05:21 1994 From: maloney@wings.attmail.com (maloney) Date: 1 Aug 94 11:56:22 GMT To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Message-Service: mail Phone: 201-564-2073 Subject: Ben Smith Content-Type: Text X-Status: Status: RO My apologies to the other netters. I don't have a direct mail ID or phone # for Ben. Ben, Are you back in NJ? Would you be up for a weekend camping trip in the Pine Barrens (500 miles+ sand roads)? I plan to head up to VT this weekend - job, weather, & accomodations permitting. Any other weekend would be fine (your welcome to come to VT too - stops at ABP and RN are planned). You can call me at: W-567-5488 (Short Hills) H-835-1796 Bill Maloney maloney@attmail.com From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Jul 31 22:38:06 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: lots of questions, long, from non owner To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 13:27:55 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > So, I figure a 109 running a standard petrol engine with an > overdrive would increase the gas mileage, cruising range, and make perhaps > 60mph sustainable on the freeway. Then, I saw the post a couple days ago > from Australia (sorry, I forgot who) about changing differentials to 4.1:1 > ratio. This is a 20% change from standard, right? This is just about the > same as the overdrive, right? So the overdrive would be better from the > standpoint that it can be engaged and disengaged, and would have a greater > change on engine rpms, but would be heavier than differential gear changes. > What about both? Is that just plain insane? First of all, I would definitly not go with both, as 4th with overdrive and 4.1:1 diffs is a little too tall a gear for a 2.25. If you tend to do mostly off road driving, the over drive is the way to go, but if you don't do that much the high speed diffs would be the way to go. > Why do people change > engines? Spare parts, non-oil leaks, power, what is the one biggest > reason? Does anyone change transmissions or tranfer cases? ie my jeep got > >20 mpg on the freeway at 65 and seemed to me to have a very low 4wd first > gear. I know it would make some people retch, but has anyone completly > different drive train in a Land Rover. I guess at the far end of the > scale, I saw a wrecked range rover for sale in the SF chronicle for $5000. > What would its drive train be like in an old 109? Most people change engines for more power or greater economy here in Australia, although I am changing back to a Rover motor as it is more suited to the car. Half the reason people in Australia think that Land Rover transmistions are weak is because they through a Holden (GM) motor in with more power and torque higher in the rev range, which means the they rev the motor more, putting a lot more stress on the transmission, I personally believe that you should stick with the original motor. I do know of people that have changed the whole transmission. One I can think of is a guy who put a nissan gear box and transfercase and diesel motor in his series III long wheel base. > > john f hess phd (wow, really?) > jfhess@ucdavis.edu > > from home via modem ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 10:12:04 1994 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 11:02:37 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Rover in court X-Status: Status: RO Going to court tomorrow (again) to testify as an expert witness as to the value of Robert D's wrecked 109. For those who came in late, Robert was hit by a woman who tried to pass him on a double yellow line as he was making a left hand turn. The other vehicle was totalled in the wreck, the Rover sustained minimal damage...except it was forced airborne over a 12' ditch only to hit an off-road bucket excavator parked in the field. Maybe this time we'll go to trial, not get another bloody continuance. Anyway, any recent comparable sales would be of interest. The vehicle was an immaculate '65 109" pickup, overdirve, dual tanks, bumper overiders, stainless steel master cylinder with remote brake booster (it had the best brakes I've ever seen on *any* Rover), oil cooler and about 26,000 original miles. I've got Lanny's and Charlie's recent sales at Rover North, both very comparable vehicles. I think the value is in the range of $8 to $9k. Any other sales/opinions? *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 10:11:47 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 08:03:43 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net, Mike@apple.com, Fedette@apple.com, mfredett@ichips.intel.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Portland ABF Leak X-Status: Status: RO In message <199407300120.SAA11573@pacific.pacific.net> Granville Pool writes: > I would like to go to the Portland meet and want to try to get together a > convoy of other North California roverites to head that way, maybe taking > two days up and two days back. I figured that we could camp out somewhere > along the way. > > Can you give more details as to cost of entry of a vehicle and of a > meetswapper (?) and other particulars of where and how we would connect with > you far-northwest rover folks? > > Thanks, > > Granville Pool Land-Rover's first because > Land-Rovers last! > mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net > 2601 Road I, #0 ("Road-I-Land") > Redwood Valley, CA 95482 > (707) 485-7220 > Portland All British Field Meet 10795 NW LaCassel Crest Ln. Portland, OR 977229 Entry is $30 for the week end. The Sat BBQ = $12 for the public one & is about $5 for the Land Rover Clubs BBQ You chose to go to one or the other. Phone 503-244-2296 for entry form & more info. Your idea of the length of the trip & mine are close. I want to Leave Cupertino Wed at noonish to get past the San Francisco madness before it gets too bad & take a couple of days to mosey up taking pictures along the way. The meet normally winds down by 2 ish Sun (Or at least I usually do). I was thinking of a combination of #1 & #101. Take care TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 11:18:25 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: POLL-for 109/2.25L petrol owners To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 11:07:31 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: from "David John Place" at Jul 29, 94 11:01:20 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 753 X-Status: Status: RO There are three threads recently discussed on LRO: -- Overdrives and high ratio axles. -- 16 inch tires verses 15 inch tires. -- gas mileage associated with various models of carburators Several of the appends give background information, but it seems to me that some of the wide variance in gas mileage might be explained by the 30-40 percent gearing differences in the various LR configurations out there. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From ccray Mon Aug 1 13:39:22 1994 Subject: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 13:39:22 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1106 X-Status: Status: RO OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. They were about 15 x 12 inches. They had a cork to plug the opening and a rope handle. You would fill the bag with water and drape it over a radiator cap. The canvas would get wet and the evaporation (and the fan action would help too) would cause the water to cool. I remember being out in 100 f sunshine and the water was so-o-o cold you could barely drink it. Anyway, I want one of those bags for the Utah expedition. I think it would look proper on the grill of a SIIa 88. Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. Thanks in advance... ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From BENHAM@WFOCLAN.USBM.GOV Mon Aug 1 14:30:35 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 12:29:23 +1100 Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Ray, I too think they look cool on the front of a LR. You can get them @ $12.00 ea from various outdoor and military surplus stores. However, mine leaks and is worthless. It is made out of the original Scotish flax with a cork stopper. Why it leaks is beyond me. I may put Scotchguard on it, but then that solution may defeat the original purpose of having some evaporation keeping the water cool. Let me know what you find out. Later, John Benham From ccray Mon Aug 1 15:00:56 1994 Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny (fwd) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 15:00:56 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 794 X-Status: Status: RO MR ALEXANDER P GRICE was bold enough to point out... > >If you can find "Manifold Destiny" (it recently came out in paperback, and >any decent bookstore should be able to order it) it has some interesting >recepies: .... you are RIGHT -- called the bookstore and it will be in Thursday. $7.95. Sorry to bother the netters -- should have done my homework earlier. Anyway, it is our objective to check out a couple of recipes and I will report back. > ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 19:40:20 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 17:34:56 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: lro@team.net Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 294 X-Status: Status: RO > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? I don't think I'm a guru, but here's a suggestion; A High Lift jack and some lenths of rope and/or chain will do just about anything a winch will. Just a little slower. R, bg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 17:14:26 1994 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 17:44:32 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the pa X-Status: Status: RO Ray Harder writes: >OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they used to have canvas waterbags.... Yup, I had one for years...hung it off the driver's side mirror so's I could quaff without dismounting. Worked great. First, the rope rotted out and a gust from a passing semi sent it spewing into traffic. Retrieved and rewired, it lived a few more years, 'til the top fabric disintergrated. Actually, I think it was made from flax (coarse linen). Got mine from Dick Cepek, but all Cepek advertises these days is tires. If you find another give me a shout. *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 17:47:58 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 15:37:26 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: mfredett@ichips.intel.com From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Re: ABF leak, Portland Cc: lro@team.net X-Status: Status: RO Thanks for your reply on the net, regarding the field meet. I understand that you have also tried a couple of times to phone and have missed me. Best time is late night (9:00-11:00 P.M.), although I will probably be home all this evening. Dormobile top is sold (traded) but have other stuff and plan to bring stuff to field meet for swappingtime. A couple more questions regarding the meet: 1. TeriAnn Wakeman writes that one must (naturally) choose between the "public" bbq @ $12.00/head or LRO bbq @ approx. $5.00/head. I should think we'd want to attend the LRO bbq and so question is exactly how much and would that be a part of the registration fee as would the public one? 2. What sort of picture is appropriate for the program, a portrait or an action shot? Inasmuch as it is a Land-Rover, I lean toward an action shot. What do you think? Thanks. Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 22:15:35 1994 From: Malcolm956@aol.com Sender: "Malcolm956" To: LRO@team.net Date: Mon, 01 Aug 94 22:07:50 EDT Subject: Water Pumps X-Status: Status: RO I seem to have a leak in the fan of my '65 Ser IIa 88". At least the fluorescent green liquid is flung from the fan blade tips as the engine runs. As the normal water content of a fan blades is on the lowish side, my conclusion is that there is a leak at the forward end of the water pump shaft. I would appreciate comments -about the relative merits of installing a rebuilt pump (ca $120) v. putting in the seals, et al, (ca $60). -do I really have to start by taking out the radiator? The latter question is really more of a forlorn hope than a real hope. My first British car was a Austin A-40 back in '57. Often the long way is the fast one, but any short custs would be appreciated. Thanx; Malcolm =====__ |[__]|_\_==_ | | ] (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:[> From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 21:44:43 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Camel Trophy Questions Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 19:39:00 -0700 From: Mike Fredette X-Status: Status: RO Hi folks, Here in the US there is an appalling lack of publicity for the Camel Trophy. The cable sports channel aired the film of last years event a couple times but that's about all. I understand that in other parts of the world, it's very big stuff indeed, my question is why? The Camel folk don't sell any of their merchandise ie. hats, shirts, watches, stickers etc. anywhere that I'm aware of in the US. They don't even advertise in LRO in the UK. With it being such a big event I would think they would make these items more available. What I'm getting at is, I want to buy some of these goodies, do any of you world traveled types know where to do so in the US? Or how about the across the pond types, anything in Australia or New Zealand or the UK or Europe? I'm sure someone can shed some light on the mystery. Also, I think it was Sandy Grice or one of the East coast fellows who had the address of Mr Collins, the US Camel Trophy organizer, could you please publish it again. Rgds Mike Fredette 94 DEFENDER 90 (how sweet it is) Portland, Oregon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 18:03:28 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re[2]: lots of questions, long, from non owner To: lro@team.net Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 8:53:19 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > > >============================================================================== > >Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" > >LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) > >email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au > > I see you are in Victoria - do you know anything about McNamara Diff > specialists in Moorabbin? I got some info from them some time back and I > was wondering if you knew anything more about them. > > > Best- > Greg > > > Yes, I have one of his manual diff locks in the back of my series 1, really strong, and good for getting out of embarising situations. What do you want to know! ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 22:32:19 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: Water Pumps To: Malcolm956@aol.com Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 13:22:28 EST Cc: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <9408012207.tn483357@aol.com>; from "Malcolm956@aol.com" at Aug 01, 94 10:07 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > > I seem to have a leak in the fan of my '65 Ser IIa 88". At least the > fluorescent green liquid is flung from the fan blade tips as the engine runs. > As the normal water content of a fan blades is on the lowish side, my > conclusion is that there is a leak at the forward end of the water pump > shaft. > > I would appreciate comments > -about the relative merits of installing a rebuilt pump (ca $120) v. putting > in the seals, et al, (ca $60). > -do I really have to start by taking out the radiator? > > The latter question is really more of a forlorn hope than a real hope. My > first British car was a Austin A-40 back in '57. Often the long way is the > fast one, but any short custs would be appreciated. > > Thanx; > Malcolm > > =====__ > |[__]|_\_==_ > | | ] > (@)-----(@) ... . -- .--. . .-. ..-. .. *\:[> > put a kit through the water pump, this replaces everything except the casing, new impella, spindel, the works. Will make it just like new. ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 13:15:28 1994 Date: 02 Aug 94 11:48:34 EDT From: Keith Steele <75126.1123@compuserve.com> To: Subject: Manifold Destiny X-Status: Status: RO For the cookin' while you are cruisin' set my wife found the under the hood cook book. It is still in print. Our copy will arrive in one two weeks. For those of you interested in obtaining a copy of your own it is - MANIFOLD DESTINY: The One! The ONLY! Guide to Cooking on your Car Engine. ISBN: 0679723374 Paperback $7.95 US. Published by Random House. It is available for special order through most book stores. Ray Harder wrote - Oh, how timely. 11 days till LULU and owners drive 1200 miles to Western Colorado and Utah for the LROA outing. We are going to make the manifold roast beef (w/potatoes, carrots onions). This part of the trip has my wife actually excited. If you (or someone else) could find and post some recipes from this book you would be heroes. Sorry Ray I most likely will not get the book in time (lost another chance at being a hero) for your departure but if you Rover over to your nearest book purveyor, offer to pay for overnight express, you may yet have some adventure to add to your adventure. Keith Steele 75126.1123@compuserve.com '72 Series III since new From 75126.1123@compuserve.com Tue Aug 2 10:53:39 1994 Date: 02 Aug 94 11:50:25 EDT From: Keith Steele <75126.1123@compuserve.com> To: Subject: Manifold Destiny X-Status: Status: RO Ray If you get this before the LRO mail list I found the Manifold Destiny book and it is still in print. It is MANIFOLD DESTINY: The One! The ONLY! Guide to Cooking on your Car Engine. ISBN: 0679723374 Paperback $7.95 US. Published by Random House. It is available for special order through most book stores. I have ordered a copy for my wife and I - arrival date 1 to 2 weeks. If the Manifold Destiny book comes earlier rather than later (in time for your and LULU's departure I will let you know. If you want me to Fedex it over to you I will. You never know, if you Rover over to your local book store and offer to pay overnight express you may be able to get it in just a couple of days. Good Luck and enjoy your trip. If my Rover is back together in time I am planning to go to the East Coast Main Event -cookin as we're cruisin. Keith Steele 75126.1123@compuserve.com '72 Series III since new From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 14:16:55 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? From: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Dale Desprey) Reply-To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 11:10:43 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu writes: > OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they > used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. > > Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am > wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might > obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. > I have a canvas water bag. I haven't put it on this year. Problem number one is that it leaks from the bottom corner. I found that it was best to soak it before using it. Problem number two is the "don't know the answer, so make something up" rover types in our club, were sure to criticize. I had mine hanging down in front of the rad, wrapped through the grill. "Won't that cause overheating problems". It doesn't make any difference on mine. These are available new, at Sir Plus. They have a plastic cap instead of a cork. Also the cord doesn't last very long. If you can't find one locally, let me know. Dale Desprey -- Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 12:39:28 1994 Date: Tue, 02 Aug 1994 13:30:16 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Good & bad news X-Status: Status: RO Went to court this AM concering Robert's demolished 109. Everyone from both sides were there...except the judge. Seems they ran out of judges/courtrooms so the trial got "bumped" 'til who knows when.... Now the good news...a college friend who works for RJR called. He's picked up a bunch of Camel Trophy goodies for prizes/giveaways at the October Mid-Atlantic Land Rover Rally. How about T-shirts from this year's event? Camel Trophy belts, pens, pins and even gold-plated Zippo lighters (hey, it's RJR!) engraved with every Camel Trophy location and date. The ol' Rover is going to be in *five* more episodes of the "Archaeology" series. John Rhys Davis again narrates, siting in or standing near the Rover in each. It's getting paid ($100 a day) almost more than me! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 15:16:08 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 12:26:53 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net (Granville Pool) Subject: Re: Hot Plate (venting footwells) X-Status: Status: RO John R. Benham (BENHAM@WFOCLAN.USBM.GOV) writes: > > On a recent Rover Run, it was unseasonably hot in NW Montana and >Northern Idaho. My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around >the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles >on my Clark Wallabees!! My old Land Cruiser FJ-40 had side vents to >prevent this heat build up. Any suggestions from other LRO's on how >you all deal with the heat build up?? > I recall that some enthusiast in the eastern U.S. once marketed a simple but sturdy guard of heavy steel wire (or light steel bar) which would cover a standard Land-Rover tropical roof vent, allowing you to mount such a vent on the side, to vent the footwell, yet have it reasonably protected from brush damage. I haven't seen such an item advertised in years. Anyone know what became of it? Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 11:24:13 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 09:08:56 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: tomills@du.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: springs update X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu> "T.F. Mills" writes: > Some time ago I solicited y'all's advice on spring repair, and decided > it would be best to get some spring specialists to do it. > > I'm not too happy with the $585 result. A few days afterwards, the LR > started to list badly to the driver's side. Before I could take it > back, the tranny fell apart, but that's another story. I can also see > daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? And what's > the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and > right fairly unique to Rovers? And could the shop have switched the > left and right springs because they didn't know there was a > difference? Could there be any other reasons for the listing? It was > listing alternately from side to side before I took it in, and I had hoped > re-arching and repair would cure the problem. And another thing, some > of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that > was normal. > > Any thoughts? > > > T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu > University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA > Ya shoulda not bought those shares of stock for that bridge Your Land Rover should run too stiff when empty and not list at all. Mine rides like a sedan with seven bales of hay in the back and does not list or sway unduely. There should not be space at the ends of the leaves. When there is they are just there for ballast and not to help carry a load. I have yet to meet a person who had leaf springs rebuilt who was happy about it. I have also seen a few worn out springs being sold by Land Rover parts companys as good used....sold at a higher price than you could purchase a new set from Merseyside Land Rover services ltd. As I recall, their prices for new springs are very resonable. Shippings not too good since they are heavy, but you could probably think of a few light things that your Land Rover needs to help defray shipping costs (By purchasing a lot of things at once you can pay for the cost of shipping out of part of the money you are saving over purchasing them in the US). You should ring up your shop and ask that they rebuild them again and do it right this time. If you can get them to agree to it you can remove the leaf springs & get them rebuilt again while you are doing the tranny... Or you can try to get your $$ back in trade for your old springs..HAH Sorry, I can't think of anything positive to say about your situation. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 00:49:14 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: Hot Plate (venting footwells) Date: 2 Aug 1994 22:18:42 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <199408021926.MAA08208@pacific.pacific.net>, Granville Pool wrote: >I recall that some enthusiast in the eastern U.S. once marketed a simple but >sturdy guard of heavy steel wire (or light steel bar) which would cover a >standard Land-Rover tropical roof vent, allowing you to mount such a vent on >the side, to vent the footwell, yet have it reasonably protected from brush >damage. I haven't seen such an item advertised in years. Anyone know what >became of it? > >Granville Land-Rover's first because Land-Rovers last. > I remember a chap, Doug Richardson, fabricating (or having them fabricated) in the LA area. I'll see if I can locate a phone or address. It's been a while since I've seen these too -- they were an iron bar/grill that would protect the vent hatch from brush. Randy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 22:24:42 1994 Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 23:11:50 LCL From: Joseph Broach Subject: Spare tire mounting To: land-rover-owner@team.net X-Status: Status: RO Hi, I am a new owner and this may be a nutty question, but what is the best place for the spare? My 88" has mounting plates on the bonnet (current mount), the rear door, and behind the front seats? The bonnet is convenient, but hampers visibility and makes the bonnet a real chore to open. Thanks!! From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 21:32:07 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 20:23:47 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: TEST X-Status: Status: RO Just checking to see if my email went south. Roy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 01:00:42 1994 Date: Tue, 02 Aug 1994 22:53:03 -0700 (PDT) From: LROVER@u.washington.edu Subject: Bits and Spares must sell need Cash Sender: Land Rover Fanatic! To: lro@team.net X-Envelope-To: lro@team.net X-Vms-To: IN%"lro@team.net" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Status: Status: RO 1-Safari roof for an 88 needs some TLC $700.00 or trade 1-Dlx dished hood fair to good shape$200.00 or trade 1-109 box bed set up as a trailer no top or sidess anylonger unfinished project sell or trade for $350.00 1-Safari rear door fair shape $80.00 1-coil Lucas $2.00 1-SIII steering wheel $4.00 1-pair SIII ext. door hinges $4.00 3-Interior door handels $1.50 ea. 1-Lucas Alt. rebuildable $30.00 1-Set SIII door trim $15.00 Misc. LR name tags..$2.50ea. also...'71-SIIa 88 in good working order blue w/hard top clean rarely driven, asking $7,500.00/trade That's what's available at this time anyone interested please e-mail me or call me at (206)365-3514hm# or (206)623-5460wk# or fax# (206)623-9831. Sincerely, Benjamin J. Freeman From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 02:03:23 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Re: land rover badges To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 00:51:16 -0600 (MDT) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "Robin Craig" at Jul 30, 94 07:19:58 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2101 X-Status: Status: RO Robin scribblerit: < BTW if you get Soldier like Mr Mills and myself the aforementioned < offending badge can be seen on the rear of a lightweight on the rear < cover of the July25 issue of that erstwhile publication. < < Millsy mate, did you spot the other two anomalies with that picture? Millsy pontificat: Quit rubbing it in!! I have yet to receive the Soldier issue with all the neat review Rovers from a few months ago, let alone the July 25 issue. I feel like the US is a desert island. I'm going to have to move to Canada. There was a recent US postal scandal: tons of undelivered mail stockpiled in DC -- I always suspected a plot to pretend airmail from overseas was really on a slow ship around all the horns and capes. Anomalies? Well, I'm busy trying to epoxy the shreds of my tranny in time for the national rally. I would have shot any other vehicle that behaved like this. But I love my Rover. It will make a sexy birdbath if all else fails. And I do have that ugly Tootsie to console me! (I wonder whatever happened to the smelly gummy Norwegian.) TeriAnn was right: we ain't normal. .________________._____ /~~~~~~~//~~~~~~~~//~~~~~| / // // | /_\.___ //__ \.___//_______| [%%%%%%%%%] ======] |[_______] _____ ===========_____ --------}========================== | |/| ! ## !| | | []| |) | |/| ###### | | _____ | | ___ | |_____|/|_######_|____ |/_ _ \}_______|________/_ _\ |. / ______________________ \ \ \_______________// \\ / |/ |%{ @ } !! |%\| @ } |%{ @ } \%\ / !@&%!! \%\ / \%\ / ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ 1966 Land Rover Series IIA 109" T. F. Millsy tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 03:15:57 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: Re: Names To: velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk (S|ren Vels Christensen) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 01:03:30 -0600 (MDT) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "S|ren Vels Christensen" at Jul 31, 94 02:06:52 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 799 X-Status: Status: RO Soren Vels lapsit calami: < When watching a movie i was suddenly struck with inspiration. The most < obvious name for the landie was handed to me on a silver tray. A name that < reflects the highest dreams and wildest plans for a roving type in urban < imprisonment. Lawrence of Arabia. I call mine Sal or Sali -- short for Salah-uddin (or Saladin). Same general inspiration. I was once driving through the affluent celebrity town of Aspen, Colorado, in my topless 109, and somebody yelled out at me, "Hey, Lawrence!" There must be something to the idea, especially since T.E. never had a Rover. I suppose it beats calling your beloved, "Rat". T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 02:44:18 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: springs update To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 01:34:12 -0600 (MDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1065 X-Status: Status: RO Some time ago I solicited y'all's advice on spring repair, and decided it would be best to get some spring specialists to do it. I'm not too happy with the $585 result. A few days afterwards, the LR started to list badly to the driver's side. Before I could take it back, the tranny fell apart, but that's another story. I can also see daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? And what's the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and right fairly unique to Rovers? And could the shop have switched the left and right springs because they didn't know there was a difference? Could there be any other reasons for the listing? It was listing alternately from side to side before I took it in, and I had hoped re-arching and repair would cure the problem. And another thing, some of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that was normal. Any thoughts? T. F. Mills tomills@du.edu University of Denver Library 2150 E. Evans Ave. Denver CO 80208 USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 03:37:46 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: springs To: tomills@du.edu (T.F. Mills) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 17:38:02 +0930 (CST) Cc: lro@stratus.com (Land Rover Owners Group) In-Reply-To: <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu> from "T.F. Mills" at Aug 3, 94 01:34:12 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1069 X-Status: Status: RO Tom writes: >I can also see daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? Uh dunno... my springs always had a small gap when unloaded. Got worse after reseting though. >And what's the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and > right fairly unique to Rovers? Cant speak for US vehicles but definitely existed on some oz holdens. > Could the shop have switched the left and right springs because they didn't know there was a difference? Possible/likely A check of spring numbers may help but they may have been reset "against" the spring number anyway. > Could there be any other reasons for the listing? Shackle bushes done up too tight and/or at the wrong ride height. most likely. > And another thing, some of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that was normal. Hard to say. Depends upon the style of spring, if thry are "overload" style then several leaves in a bundle will sit below the main set. > Any thoughts? Time for a beer! -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 05:28:35 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: springs update To: tomills@du.edu (T.F. Mills) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 11:11:59 BST Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu>; from "T.F. Mills" at Aug 3, 94 1:34 am X-Status: Status: RO One other thing besides Darryl's thoughts.Is one side low,or,is one side high?Sounds stupid,I know,but I actually have a *high* side, (the left) while the other is normal.This on an 88" BTW. I *think* what happpened was that when I replaced the springs,with non-genuine ones,both sides were made the same,but with the increaed camber normally associated with the RHS.This theory is largely borne out(no,forget that bit....).The fact that there *is* more weight on the RHS is borne out by the increased "squash" of the radial tyres I've just put on instead of cross plys,on the RHS front *and* rear. One other theory I've heard advanced,is that due to non aligned chassis repairs,the spring hangers are no longer the same distance apart,thus causing the problem,but I discounted that one on the grounds that you'd have to make a relatively massive error to make any difference. So when your springs were reset,were they both made the same? Just a thought. Cheers Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 05:04:57 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 12:04:42 GMT+0200 Subject: Re: Names Cc: lro@stratus.com Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > Soren Vels lapsit calami: > > < When watching a movie i was suddenly struck with inspiration. The most > < obvious name for the landie was handed to me on a silver tray. A name that > < reflects the highest dreams and wildest plans for a roving type in urban > < imprisonment. Lawrence of Arabia. > > I call mine Sal or Sali -- short for Salah-uddin (or Saladin). Same > general inspiration. I was once driving through the affluent > celebrity town of Aspen, Colorado, in my topless 109, and somebody > yelled out at me, "Hey, Lawrence!" There must be something to the > idea, especially since T.E. never had a Rover. I suppose it beats > calling your beloved, "Rat". T.E.'s arabic name was summat like "El-aurens" -- rolls off the tongue melodiously, non? ...... Nice name for someone's really desert-worthy Landie! Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 10:59:29 1994 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Subject: Re: Listing To: tomills@du.edu (T.F. Mills) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 11:26:16 EDT Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199408030734.BAA24056@mercury.cair.du.edu>; from "T.F. Mills" at Aug 3, 94 1:34 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.36.1.1] X-Status: Status: RO > I'm not too happy with the $585 result. A few days afterwards, the LR > started to list badly to the driver's side. Before I could take it > back, the tranny fell apart, but that's another story. I can also see > daylight between the leaves: that shouldn't be, right? And what's > the story with the listing? Is the camber difference on left and > right fairly unique to Rovers? And could the shop have switched the > left and right springs because they didn't know there was a > difference? Could there be any other reasons for the listing? It was > listing alternately from side to side before I took it in, and I had hoped > re-arching and repair would cure the problem. And another thing, some > of the leaves still separate at the ends, and the shop assured me that > was normal. > > Any thoughts? Ok folks. I've said this before but nobody has ever bought it. The shackle pins that hold the rear shackle of the front spring and the front shackle of the rear spring to the frame may be too tight. These two shackles-on the frame side-are threaded and a locknut further secures them. If these are tightened up with all your might then they cannot "swing" with the compression/decompression of your springs. ...and goddammit they should. If not, you get an extra rough ride, if they move, but not freely (ie they get stuck in one point, unevenly at that) your rover might list to one side (much like the company I work for-read the papers lately??). Note that the manuals do NOT mention any of this (and hence I've not made any believers out of you)- they just say "assemble, bounce it around a bit, torque" or something to that effect. Those of you with badly worn springs may find these two shackles will "bottom out" against your frame. C'est la vie. Time for new springs. Aside from this, we all assume you have new bushes (frame side) or that they were ok from the start. WRT seeing space between the leaves-are they "peeling apart"??? Are they secured with metal straps about them (either bolted on or bent on)? Rgds, rdushin/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 10:16:05 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 10:04:28 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: That spring thing again - X-Status: Status: RO I'm sure I should remember this from the last time this was discussed (and I will archive the thread this time) but what is the opinion on LR road springs and the need/no need for different cambers for each corner. Rovers North only seems to have one spring for the front and one for the back. Perhaps this makes sense in the LHD truck as the gas and the driver are no longer on the same side?? Opinions. As for the Springs themselves - Rovers North is $100+ per for the original part - "Bat Fastard" is 25 pounds front and 33 pounds rear (shipping????). Do you run a real risk of getting springs that will not last? Any specific experience with aftermarket springs? Thanks - Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 13:22:14 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: OVLR: August off-road event. Preliminary Details. From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 12:08:17 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO August brings another OVLR off-road event. Below is the tentative information on the Calabogie power cut/Flower Station Road camping weekend as it is currently planned. The only detail that will be changing will be the departure time from Ottawa. If anyone is interested in participating in this event, they can either phone Jerry Dowell, or they can send me a message at fourfold. Rgds, Dixon Weekend, August 20/21: The Calabogie/Flower Station Road A revisit of an old overnight run not attempted in several years. This would be considered a medium off- road effort with and option of no heavy winching required. A good opportunity to check your axle articulation. Who: Anyone interested in an interesting off-road camping adventure. Phone Jerry Dowell (819 827-2932) to reserve a spot. There will be a limit on the number of Land Rovers as there are time constraints on how long it will take to get through any obstacles. We cannot sit at a mud hole for several hours and still make the campsite by dark. Phoning early is also a good idea as preference will be given to vehicles with 16" wheels. Vehicles may be divided by route to balance the number of winches on each trail, preference being given to the hydro cut route. What: Two teams of vehicles will enter the trail from opposite ends. The first will be at the beginning of the Calabogie Power/Hydro Cut and following the power cut to Straddlebug Lake; The hydro cut route will involve three to four areas where vehicles will have to be winched through. The second comes in at the Flower Station Road. This route will not involve winching, but features a trail building exercise of about 100 feet to get past a swamp. The two groups will meet in the centre at a large clearing. Bring:There is no fresh water at the campsite. Bring water. This is a bring your own everything event. You are responsible for bringing any required food, beverages, water, cutlery, oil, spare petrol, spares et cetera. One vehicle on the Flower Station route will require a chainsaw. When: At this time there are two proposed starting options. The current is meeting at Shoppers City West at 8am and proceeding to Calabogie. The journey is a two hour trip. As this might cut into time a bit much, the alternate proposal is to leave Friday evening and camp at the large pine at the end of the hydro cut. The two teams would leave from this point. -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 12:32:24 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 13:22:04 -0400 From: "Russell G. Dushin" Apparently-To: lro@transfer.stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > Rgds, > Joseph > >Remove the steering wheel and put it back centrally,with the wheels >straight ahead. >Cheers >Mike Rooth >You could always remove the steering wheel and put it back on straight >TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world Oh no, no no. Do it *right*. Adjust the steering drag link rod that runs from the steering relay to the right wheel. Loosen the clamps on either end that keep it connected to the tie rod ends. Use a tad of spritz (eg WD40) if need be and give the rod a twist while your favorite slave sits at the helm and yells when it is straight. You may need a pipe wrench and a rag to protect the rod if you dare not scratch it. As stated previously (but not to the list) this assumes the lever(s) attached to the relay have not been removed/replaced one or so splines off to either side. I forget *exactly* how it lines up, but methinks that when the wheels (ie tyres) are straight and you are at the half- way point in steering box travel (what is this, twelve turns lock to lock? so maybe six turns in....ignore where the "spokes" of your steering wheel are for now) the lower lever coming off your relay is supposed to be straight forward (check your manual, it covers this). I forget about the "incoming" lever to the relay but that is coverd as well in the manual. Once these two levers are set properly (they *probably* already are) then a simple twist or three about the drag link rod will straighten your wheel pronto. May well be a tad more trouble than removing the steering wheel, but that is splined and may not neccessarily line up when you move it. Besides, if your are dealing with a IIa or later Joe Lucas gets involved as well (horn removal). No biggie, but..... rd/nigel From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 14:14:07 1994 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 12:05:00 MST From: DEBROWN@srp.gov To: Offroad@ai.gtri.gatech.edu, lro@team.net Subject: California Emissions. X-Status: Status: RO FROM: David Brown Internet: debrown@srp.gov Computer Graphics Specialist AM/FM - PAB204 X-3544 - Pager:6486 External (602)275-2508 #6486 SUBJECT: California Emissions. I'm trying to find a Land Rover Discovery, and am having a hard time finding anything less than full retail price. I have found a buying service that has a connection with a dealer in California that offers $1000 off the retail sticker price. However, they MUST add the "California Emissions" to the vehicle at a cost of $100 and I live in Arizona. Can anyone out there please explain exactly what this includes, and how does it affect the vehicle's performance? Thanks, *** **** **** "Some men see things as they are and say why? * * * * * I see things as they never were and say why not?" * **** **** *** * * * -Robert Frost From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 15:09:05 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 12:05:52 -0800 To: lro@stratus.com From: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu (John Hess) Subject: Re: Spare tire mounting X-Status: Status: RO 2. >A bit more sophisticated is to make up a swivelling mounting bracket >that is firmly attached to the rear of the Landie. It takes the form >of two brackets with a spindle onto which is welded a swinging arm >that actually takes the tyre. The two brackets mount firmly onto the >rear of the chassis and loadbed rail just central to the rear lights. >The wheel is mounted on the swinging arm which is "locked" across the >rear door by a (or the) tailgate-type pin. > Very strong and rigid, takes up no space and is really a sensible >development of the el cheapo Landie tyre-on-back-door arrangement. >The only snag (such as it is) is that in order to open the rear door >it is 1st necessary to unlatch the tyre swinging mounting and swing it >out the way. A bit difficult to describe in words, but hopefully the >principle is lucid!! >Cheerio, >Keith Coman > > > * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Hello all, I really hate to say this, but this mount sounds exactly like what I had on the back of my Jeep! In the case of the Jeep, it mounts right in the corner, the top bar over the right rear light and the bottom bar under the light. Could it be that this is one idea that should be transferred to the Land Rover? I will say that for a look at a defender 90 at the LROA christmas get together, the spare tire carrier is very nice! Mounted to the side and swivels out of the way of the door automatically! when the tailgate is opened. Now, it would appear that my wife is making arrangements for us to go to England at the end of August. From past posts, I want to visit the auto museum and get a Land Rover ride, visit the Land Rover Factory (is that possible for plain-tourists?) and check out bookstores listed in FAQs and other posts. All that aside, what else should someone like me do? I don't have a Land Rover and so don't need parts but could be persuaded to look for things for others, assuming I'm not required to carry a short block or set of springs back. Any ideas greatly welcomed. John Hess, PhD Phone me 916 752 8420 Dept of Human Anatomy FAX me 916 752 8520 University of Calif Email me jfhess@ucdavis.edu Davis, CA or leave me alone, your choice. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 17:32:56 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 94 16:21:49 MDT From: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com ( ROY CALDWELL ) To: lro@stratus.com Subject: TEST X-Status: Status: RO Test, test. I think my mail is on the blink. Roy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 22:56:26 1994 Date: Wed, 03 Aug 94 23:38:58 LCL From: Joseph Broach Subject: Thanks!! To: land-rover-owner@team.net X-Status: Status: RO Thanks to all who replied to my "Land Rover Owner at Last" post. I am sorry I am not able to thank you all personally, but I have received too much great information. I have also been out putting around in Sidney a lot. I had to top up the front diff due to a loose drain plug. Are their certain conditions under which to check fluids (i.e. do things need to be engaged, in neutral, or does it matter at all??). Anyway, know that all your replies are appreciated and put to good use. Rgds, Joseph '67 ser IIa 88"....Sidney From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 00:43:21 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 07:45:24 GMT+0200 Subject: Re: Spare tire mounting Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > 2. > >A bit more sophisticated is to make up a swivelling mounting bracket > >that is firmly attached to the rear of the Landie. It takes the form > >of two brackets with a spindle onto which is welded a swinging arm > >that actually takes the tyre. The two brackets mount firmly onto the > >rear of the chassis and loadbed rail just central to the rear lights. > >The wheel is mounted on the swinging arm which is "locked" across the > >rear door by a (or the) tailgate-type pin. > > Very strong and rigid, takes up no space and is really a sensible > >development of the el cheapo Landie tyre-on-back-door arrangement. > >The only snag (such as it is) is that in order to open the rear door > >it is 1st necessary to unlatch the tyre swinging mounting and swing it > >out the way. A bit difficult to describe in words, but hopefully the > >principle is lucid!! > >Cheerio, > >Keith Coman > > Hello all, I really hate to say this, but this mount sounds exactly like > what I had on the back of my Jeep! In the case of the Jeep, it mounts right > in the corner, the top bar over the right rear light and the bottom bar > under the light. Could it be that this is one idea that should be > transferred to the Land Rover? Bingo!! We don't get too many Jeeps out here, so I wasn't familiar with this arrangement having been derived from the Landies' trans-Atlantic "father". It's a *great* idea IMO, but out here the swing-mounts that I've had a look at were all homebrew. Well it looks like a trip to a Jeep accessories store or scrap yard with a tape-measure could be just the ticket for you lucky chaps puzzling over how to mount a spare tyre on the back of a Landie!! (:D) Kind regards, Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 03:34:06 1994 From: Mike Rooth Subject: Re: TEST To: rhcaldw@nma.mnet.uswest.com (ROY CALDWELL) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 9:24:12 BST Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408032221.AA10699@mtnoca.helena_noc>; from "ROY CALDWELL" at Aug 3, 94 4:21 pm X-Status: Status: RO > > > Test, test. I think my mail is on the blink. > > > Roy > Received,strength five.Listening.Out. Mike Rooth From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 09:18:24 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 09:06:44 -0600 To: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Re: Access to roverweb Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com X-Status: Status: RO >> >> In an effort to consolidate some of the services on my machine the address >> for the roverweb has changed from http://roverweb.gar.utexas.edu:1500/ to >> http://roverweb.gar.utexas.edu/roverweb/roverweb.html. > >Hi Greg, I cant seem to access either of these addresses. I get an error >message stating that our machine is unable to connect to the foreign host. >Any ideas??? > >Ta >-- > > Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) > Dept. of Plant Science, Waite Institute > University of Adelaide, Glen Osmond S.A. 5064 > Australia. Voice:61_8 303 7426 Fax:61_8 303 7102 Woops - nice address I gave you...... try - http://whitman.gar.utexas.edu/roverweb/roverweb.html Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 11:04:48 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: twakeman@apple.com, lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 08:47:57 +1100 Subject: Re: POLL- LR camping X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > Date sent: Wed, 3 Aug 94 17:06:00 -0700 > From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" > Send reply to: "TeriAnn Wakeman" > To: lro@stratus.com > Subject: POLL- LR camping > Its time for a new poll to help out the LR interior disadvantaged. > > Question: How do you set your Land Rover up for car camping (specify long or > short wheel base). If you have anything built in, please be as descriptive as > possible as to what how big (dimensions would be nice) and where. > > > I'll start with my car: > > 109 two door, safari top, tail gate. > > camping modifications: > Horz 5 gal propane tank under bench between right seat and right rear wheel. > Hole cut in side of car with LR tool box lid modified as a lid for the side > providing access to the propane tank. > > Car camping set up: > I bungie cord 3 large plastic bens to the right rear bench. Front one hold > clothes, middle one sleeping bag & pillow, rear one kitchen stuff. Extra > propane bottles for lanterns and kitchen stuff in right rear tool box. > > Left rear toolbox contains tools, work on car clothes and oil. Above that at > left rear is bungie strapped ice cooler (food and film). Bungi corded against > back of front seats, plastic tarp, chase lounge pad (AKA bed), folding table, > propane stove, folding chair, two five gal. water cans. Not bungi corded, Great > pyrenese, dog food, dog food & water dish, old car cover for dog bed & chain for > dog. > > passanger side front floor, two buckets for washing and rinsing dishes, two > propane lanterns, one flashlight. On seat, camera gear. > > When I'm camping all the noncamera gear goes out except bed and ice chest. I set > the tanle up fot the stove & kitchen stuff, connect the stove to the inside > propane tank. Hang a lantern above the stove & one at the end of the tail gate > top. I sleep in the pad in the back of the car. > > So what does everyone else do?????????????? > > > TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world > twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards > LINK: TWAKEMAN > 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, > MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 > TeriAnn, Your set up looks preety good. I have a SWB 88 and do not have the luxury of space. I tent it and have all of my equipment stored in Rubbermaid `Action Packer's. These storage units are the best thing that has ever happened for campers. I have also designed an integral roof rack system. The rack holds the tent bag, safari chairs (from Costco), a 4" PVC pipe holding tarp poles, and extra water or gas. All of the cooking, tarps, and other odds and ends are stored in the `Action Packers'. The jewel of my set up is that the roof rack was designed to incorporate a shower curtain with a hot water shower. I have an 12 volt RV type pump which pumps (upon demand) heated water from a large 5 gal pot on a Coleman stove. It's fitted with a couple of pieces of short garden hoses to a PVC pipe/valve/shower head assymbly. The whole assymbly can be stored in a small `Action Packer'. It works great! No need to wait for a solar shower - especially here in the Northwest US. The shower unit becomes a very popular piece of equipment on Rover Rallys! Most of my professional life I've been ruffing it in the `field' - so I know that a hot shower is a luxury! Regards, John R. Benham Spokane, WA, USA > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 13:52:24 1994 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 13:39:17 -0600 To: lro@transfer.stratus.com From: hiner@mail.utexas.edu (Greg Hiner) Subject: Hot Rod Rover X-Status: Status: RO For those looking for those extra hp - I talked with Steve at British Pacific this morning about a few things and I got sidetracked and started asking him about engine modifications. It started with headers and went from there so for those that might be curious I thought I would pass on what I learned. Headers - 4 tube with collector - $274.55 Weber, 2 stage, 2 barrell carb - $360.11 High perfomance intake manifold for above - $221.76 Electronic ignition - he likes the Crane/Allison unit Coil - Lucas Sport or Jacobs also mentioned going with 2.5 liter petrol cam - better breathing I don't know what this would do to your low end performance or idle. He didn't seem to think it would hurt (though it sure would put a dent in your wallet). This starts to sound a little like overkill but a person can dream . . . . Best- Greg From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 14:03:53 1994 X-Msmail-Message-Id: A7424C2D X-Msmail-Conversation-Id: A7424C2D From: Edward Balassanian To: lro@stratus.com Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 11:42:19 TZ Subject: RE: Subscribe X-Status: Status: RO please remove me from this list. thanks. ---------- | From: ROY CALDWELL | To: | Subject: Subscribe | Date: Wednesday, August 03, 1994 7:07PM | | Received: from transfer.stratus.com by netmail.microsoft.com with SMTP (5.65/25-eef) | id AA21045; Wed, 3 Aug 94 18:19:20 -0700 | Received: from uswat.advtech.uswest.com | (uswat.advtech.uswest.com [130.13.16.1]) by | transfer.stratus.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA00937 for | ; Wed, 3 Aug 1994 21:08:00 -0400 | Received: from centhub (centhub.mnet.uswest.com) by | uswat.advtech.uswest.com with SMTP id AA17654 | (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 3 Aug 1994 19:07:58 -0600 | Received: by centhub.mnet.uswest.com (M-Net Hub.930405) | Received: from mtnoca.helena_noc by nmamail (4.1/SMI-4.1) | id AA28942; Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:05:22 MDT | Received: from ipx4.helena_noc by mtnoca.helena_noc (4.1/SMI-4.1) | id AA10812; Wed, 3 Aug 94 19:07:10 MDT | Message-Id: <9408040107.AA10812@mtnoca.helena_noc> | | | Have not received any mail from the list. | Tom responded to my test but I did not | get a copy via the list. Please see of | I have dropped of the subsciber list. | Thanks, | | Roy - Rovers in the Rockies | | From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 16:58:26 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 17:48:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: off center steering To: Mike Rooth Cc: Joseph Broach , lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408031604.AA06944@hpc.lut.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO The steering arm on the relay is in the wrong spline or bent....the lower arms are always loose btw.......the stops on the swivel housing should limit the turns,not the worm in the steering box....knock the drop arm off,move the wheels to full left and reinstall the arm....this should help...some of the relays have a master(double thickness) spline that would make this impossible....so check*before* you get the *big* hammer! "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Wed, 3 Aug 1994, Mike Rooth wrote: > > > > > > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > > > Rgds, > > Joseph > > > Remove the steering wheel and put it back centrally,with the wheels > straight ahead. > Cheers > Mike Rooth > > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 19:40:57 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 1994 20:30:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Steven M Denis Subject: Re: test To: ROY CALDWELL Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408042309.AA00424@mtnoca.helena_noc> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO OK.......All togeather now........"IT'S *WORKING*,ROY!!!!!!!" (do ya think he*heard*us?......I donnno....should we try again?....nay,he's got a Lucas-puter...wouldn't do any good...) :-) :-) :-) :-) sorry, i couldn't resist....... "HEY! NICE JEEP,MISTER!"..........."Look,Kid,it's a ..Oh never mind..." "NOTAJEEP"-1967 109 Station Wagon Steven M. Denis " "-1957 107 Station Wagon PO Box 61 " "-1964 109 Pickup Erieville,New York USA " "_1967 109 NADA SW 13061 On Thu, 4 Aug 1994, ROY CALDWELL wrote: > > > Sorry for bothering people again. Sysop said we > did have some trouble with the mail tool. I want > to try this again to see if I can get this returned > via the Rover list. Thanks! > > Roy - Rovers in the Rockies, going into withdrawl with > no owners list > From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Thu Aug 4 19:40:47 1994 Date: Thu, 4 Aug 94 17:34:35 PDT From: brabyn@skivs.ski.org (John Brabyn) To: burns@cisco.com, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Ready for Colorado X-Status: Status: RO I sympathize about the transmission pan removal problem-- they don't mention in the manual that you have to take the chassis apart to do it! Have a great trip! John Brabyn 89RR From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 02:51:16 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: New Arrivals From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Thu, 04 Aug 94 23:37:43 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Just collected two series 3 109 SW's for about 25 nucks yesterday. Yup you guessed it, two of the Roco limited editioon jobbies are out, look great, have a few spares if anyone is interested, will post more tommorrwo. Must go to bed now rtgds Robin -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 08:53:04 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 15:24:46 +0100 (MET) From: S|ren Vels Christensen Subject: Re: Hot plate To: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: <30F38123F68@wfoclan.usbm.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO On Tue, 2 Aug 1994, John R. Benham wrote: > Dear LRO's, > > On a recent Rover Run, it was unseasonably hot in NW Montana and > Northern Idaho. My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around > the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles > on my Clark Wallabees!! My old Land Cruiser FJ-40 had side vents to > prevent this heat build up. Any suggestions from other LRO's on how > you all deal with the heat build up?? > > Thanks, > > John R. Benham > Spokane, WA Well, if you can get Rockwool in WA try to get a plate that is fluffy on one side and hard on the other, -about 1 inch thick. Cut it to fit with about 5 mm clearance. Clean the panel and stick it on with contact glue (on the out side, of course). "And now to something completely different". M.P.F.C. Since i'm going to Jutland next week, i finally got to change the leaking fuel tank. The old one was the small 45l used to make room for PTO. The new one is a 70l, which is difficult to hold between the knees while trying to fit the bolts in holes with 2-3 mm wider span than the frame. I also learned to split a 1/4 inch bolt in two exactly identical halves with an accu tool with a 4 mm hi-speed drill. And now, off for two weeks in the sun with Lawrence and Carlsberg. +----------------------------+--------------------------------+ | Soren Vels | 1976 sIII 109" 2.25 petrol | | velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk | "Lawrence of Arabia" | ((|||)) | Royal Danish Air Forc | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 | ((|||)) | Communications Specialist | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members. | ((|||)) +----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______ ######################((|||))#############((|||)) AVoN RANGEMASTER 7.50 16 ######################((|||))#############((|||)) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 09:53:06 1994 Date: Fri, 5 Aug 1994 16:34:00 +0100 (MET) From: S|ren Vels Christensen Subject: Re: Thanks!! To: lro@team.net In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO On Wed, 3 Aug 1994, James B Russell wrote: > Unless you are exceptionally fortunate you will probably find your > Land-Rover will have a typically British tendency to leak fluids. In > fact, there are many of us who begin to worry when they don't leak since > that usually means there are no longer any fluids to leak out. > > Don't be concerned about engaged, nuetral, or anything like that but do > make it a regular check everything and top off as necessary. Make this a > do as I say not as I do since I am far more neglectful than I should be. > > And if you don't have service manuals, be sure to get them since your > local garrage has probably never heard of a Land-Rover let alone have any > tech data on them. Consider a parts book too. > > Enjoy! You are in for a wonderful love/hate relationship. I know -- I > have had the same beat up 1966 IIA 88 SW for 18 years now. It is a good > and close friend and like a good friend, sometimes they are forgetful (as > am I) but we always get over it. > > Jim Russell ==== jrussell@netcom.com > (Seattle -- San Francisco) Fluids quick check: After a trip, open the hatch under the middel seat and take a deep breath (through the nose). Manuals: For a new owner, the official workshop manual combined with a Haynes is IMO the best thing. The workshop manual is very detailed and the Haynes has a lot of photos, which is great because you can see what things are like inside before starting repair. +----------------------------+--------------------------------+ | Soren Vels | 1976 sIII 109" 2.25 petrol | | velssvch@inet.uni-c.dk | "Lawrence of Arabia" | ((|||)) | Royal Danish Air Forc | Dansk Land-Rover Klub no. 3564 | ((|||)) | Communications Specialist | DL-RK: Approx. 1000 members. | ((|||)) +----------------------------+--------------------------------+__((|||))______ ######################((|||))#############((|||)) AVoN RANGEMASTER 7.50 16 ######################((|||))#############((|||)) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Fri Aug 5 11:29:40 1994 From: llevitt@idcresearch.com Date: Fri, 05 Aug 94 12:17:58 EST To: CXKS46A@prodigy.com, Harry Greenspun Cc: land-rover-owner@stratus.com Subject: Re[2]: Roof racks off the rack Content-Length: 420 X-Status: Status: RO Harry Greenspun writes: > I know that Yakima makes a series of adapters that can be attached > directly to the roof (either bolted through or even a "molly" mounting > system when the other end can't be accessed). These then accept Yakima > rack "feet." I would assume that the adapters are general purpose - they act as surrogate gutters and would work for any brand rack system. Flame away if I'm wrong... Lee From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 01:43:59 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Rangie bits into 109 To: lro@stratus.com (Land Rover Owners Group) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 16:08:12 +0930 (CST) Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1352 X-Status: Status: RO I think it was John Hess who asked about fitting a Rangie drive-line to a 109. Too late John. Thats just what rover did for the Stage ones. ('78-83 ???) The V8 was detuned a bit and the gearing altered a bit. ie slower :-( (This is the 3.5 V8 and LT95 4sp we're talking about) As for putting one into a 4/6cyl 109. No idea as to how hard it would be. The radiator would definitely need to move and the g/box hump would need to be reshaped. The chassis of a stage one is different but I dont know by how much, just the engine, radiator and possibly g/box mounts I presume. (a rangie radiator is used) You would definitely need the .996 transfer set if you didnt go for the 3.54 diffs (ex rangie or 110/defender) My stage one runs at about 30kmh per 1000 rpm in top, with the .996 and 4.7 diffs. (yes I know thats not the normal stage one set up, but mine is not the only one like it, thought to have been a special order job-lot as the others I know about also had county trim level and the optional low ratio steering box ... until I busted mine :-( Might be fun to try the conversion if you have lots of spare time and $$$$$ Cheers -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) Dept. of Plant Science, Waite Institute University of Adelaide, Glen Osmond S.A. 5064 Australia. Voice:61_8 303 7426 Fax:61_8 303 7102 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 04:22:52 1994 To: lro@stratus.com From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Cooking in lorries Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 10:16:48 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO Hexamine stovese are neat, but replacement hexamine is grossly overpriced (unless you steal it from soldiers) and smelly. But if you cut a couple of little windshield plates from an old drinks can, to rest inside the sides of the stove, and fill it up with barbecue charcoal, it works superbly as a small Osborne Stove. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 08:31:46 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 09:22:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Jon Humphrey To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Fairey Overdrive In-Reply-To: X-Status: Status: RO Steve writes > >Turing radius?????? Oh,with a 16 ft 2 axle trailer with *two* John Deere >model B tractors on,it is,let's see, New >York,Pennsalvania,Delaware,Maryland....thats 4 ,right????? >(turinig radius with or without trailer is the same .....*way* too big!) I think the origional owners manual sez "Turning radius--45 feet" Steve is right.....WAY too big. I wonder if you could do one of those power turns and take off the other way like in smokey and the bandit. Later Jon From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 10:42:16 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny To: 75126.1123@compuserve.com (Keith Steele) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 10:34:39 -0500 (CDT) Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) In-Reply-To: <940731014947_75126.1123_FHD44-1@CompuServe.COM> from "Keith Steele" at Jul 30, 94 09:49:47 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1315 X-Status: Status: RO Keith Steele was bold enough to point out... > >For those Landie drivers who like to smell the roast along with >roses while cruising the byways of the world, there is a cookbook >which came out a number of years ago in the US called, strangely >enough, Manifold Destiny. It is dedicated to recipes for under >the hood cooking, some of which were quite good. My wife is >trying to see if she can obtain a copy someplace. .... Oh, how timely. 11 days till LULU and owners drive 1200 miles to Western Colorado and Utah for the LROA outing. We are going to make the manifold roast beef (w/potatoes, carrots onions). This part of the trip has my wife actually excited. If I could get some more recipes it could add some adventure to our adventure. I know we could retrofit some kitchen varieties, but why not use some new ones that have been field tested. If you (or someone else) could find and post some recipes from this book you would be heroes. Thanks, in advance. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 11:03:54 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 08:55:51 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: jfhess@bullwinkle.ucdavis.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: lots of questions, long, from non owner X-Status: Status: RO John, These old Land Rovers are noisy as all get out, get poor gas milage (my poll shouws about 12-13 MPG, slow (I get treated as a stationary object by everyone else when I on the road), and requires you to spend lots of time checking fluids. You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of time. If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new 4X4. But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering about exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. People wave, give you a thumbs up as that drive by, you get into all kinds of conversations with non-owners. But if you don't pull over to let them pass they get mighty upset. If you want a reliable Land Rover that you can hop into & go & keep up with everyone, get a new one. I don't know anyone with a old Land Rovers that goes outside their "Home territory" without enough tools on board to rebuild the car. If you want good gas milage and decent off road capability, try a VW Thing, of a Baja Bug. If you want chrisma try a Land Rover & UNDERSTAND that chrisma does not come without a price that most people are not willing to pay. Range? I have two petrol tanks and am getting ready to install a third. The tanks are not very big, but if you get enough of them you get range... just not in the sand or deep mud. Jim, AKA Scotty, always seems to have a Land Rover or two around thats for sale and knows where there is a half dozen or so more for sale. He closed his shop in Pittsburg to stay home with his wife when Jean was dying of cancer. He has a home shop with no real hours. The number is 510-686-2255. You will probably get his answering machine. Before you purchase one, just understand that it is a commitment of time for maintnenece, $$ for parts, you will have to learn more than you think to keep it going (or have lots of $$ and a regular Land Rover doctor that you visit monthly). They are noisy, primitive, slow, and go through fluids. They are not for normal people. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 14:49:18 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 09:47:24 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU, land-rover-owner@team.net Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last X-Status: Status: RO In message <199407310252.WAA26843@transfer.stratus.com> Joseph Broach writes: > > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? Too much winch is better than not enough, and one that works both ways is better than one that only pulls. Other than that you can just check the yellow pages & all the off road equipment places you cn find. Not everyone has RN's markup. > > * I thought the all Landies came with 16" wheels, but the 88" has 15"ers > Any tire recommendations?? Not only that but early 16 inch wheels are narrower, and you can get wide aftermarket white spoke wheels as well (Mine has them & they look much better than stock). Sorry since I do not have stock wheels I can't give an answer. > > * What is the use for the neutral position of the transfer case?? Your Land Rover can handle both front & rear PTOs. You can put the transfer box in netral and run the PTOs without moving the car (There is a PTO front winch for the Land Rover). > > * The gearbox (serII) jumps out of second when the clutch is disengaged > (pushed down)?? What is the probable cause of this?? You probably have some serious wear in the transmission. I would budget a transmission rebuild soon before it lets go & meanwhile make sure you keep the fluids topped up > > * The PO could shift from first to second even though second's not > synchronized You double clutch between first & second. On downhill stops, I start in second, and have sometimes been known to shift first to third. But mostly I double clutch 1-2. > it sounded okay, but is it alright for the tranny? Surely not... > > * How hard is it to remove the Safari roof?? How heavy is it?? There is a row of bolts holding the top of the wind screen to the front of the top. If you have a valence at the front you will need to remove it first. There should be a bolt at all four corners where it contacts the body. If it has the side opening rear door, remove it first. You will need two people inside & under with good backs to lift it & walk it off the back. My roommate (also female) & I remove my 109's 2 door safari hard top without help if we can not find any. Its a bitch but doable. You just chant "aluminum top light" and tell your roommate that its just a light aluminum top & hope she forgets how heavy it really is when its time to put it back on. > > * Any maintenance tips?? Fluids! drain them all out & put in new fluids..water..90 wt., brake fluid. Use Castrol LMA DOT 4 brake fluid ONLY Frequenly check all 90 wt resavours until you get a feel on how quickly it is leaking out of each one. Don't go on a trip without checking fluids. Lock the front wheels for a day at least once a month, once a week is better to get fluids splashed around in the front axle. Dont forget, transmission, transfer case, both diffs, and each front ball joint each has its own resavour & oil is much cheaper than parts. Fluids! > > ...Thanks for wading through this mess!! > > J.B. (...and "Sydney" the ser IIa SWB from Tenessee) Save this document as:Save a copy in:Show ClipboardHide Clipboard Undo <<<>>> Redo <<<>>>(Unable to display contents at the momentUntitled-<<<>>> closingquitting CanUt Undosaverevert From CXKS46A@prodigy.com Mon Aug 1 14:06:00 1994 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 1994 13:57:05 EDT From: CXKS46A@prodigy.com (MR ALEXANDER P GRICE) To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny X-Status: Status: RO If you can find "Manifold Destiny" (it recently came out in paperback, and any decent bookstore should be able to order it) it has some interesting recepies: Thruway Thighs, Poached Fish Pontiac, or Safe-at-any-Speed Stuffed Eggplant. The pork tenderloins really cooked up well (my own idea, but based on concepts in Manifold Destiny). Wrap things up real well, ie., triple wrap in aluminum foil, not only to deep engine funk/road dirt out, but to keep juices in and off your manifold. Carry oven mits or work gloves. If you get really creative, you could incorporate a temperature probe in with the food to provide a direct read-out on the dash! *----"Jeep may be famous, LAND-ROVER is Legendary"-----* | | | Sandy Grice, Rover Owners' Association of Virginia | | E-Mail: CXKS46A@prodigy.com FAX: 804-622-7056 | | Voice: 804-622-7054 (Days) 804-423-4898 (Evenings) | | 1633 Melrose Pkwy., Norfolk, VA, 23508-1730 USA | *------------------------------------------------------* From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Jul 31 23:11:53 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 13:57:22 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? The winch on my Series 1 is home made, don't know how much it would cost to build, but it is bloody strong. Basically it works of the P.T.O. and uses a centre PTO with the belt pully removed and a sprocket put on instead, which is used to turn a double link chain to the shaft that runs to the winch, which runs along the main bearer of the chassie on the left hand side. The actual winch drive, I have been told, is the turret drive off a Centurian tank, turned onto its side and had a winch drum welded to it. The only problem with turret drive is the gearing, its wwaayy tooo low, 40:1 reduction to be precise, which means that I can winch a Range Rover up a hill in 4th gear at an idle with a stuffed motor, which is what I have to do, as all the uni's in the drive shaft have gone and then it rattles to much, but other than that its a great winch, realy good talking point as well > > * I thought the all Landies came with 16" wheels, but the 88" has 15"ers > Any tire recommendations?? > > * What is the use for the neutral position of the transfer case?? The neutral postion in the transfer case is for when you are running equipment of the P.T.O. that requires the vehicle to be stationary, eg. saw bench off a belt pulley, or when winching some one elses vehicle from where it should not have gone, which is about 90% of the work that my winch has to do. > * The gearbox (serII) jumps out of second when the clutch is disengaged > (pushed down)?? What is the probable cause of this?? Rebuild the gear box, you occasionally see a Landy jump out of third, but not second, except my parents series III which jumped out of every gear, including reverse, until it was rebuilt. >* The PO could shift from first to second even though second's not synchronized > it sounded okay, but is it alright for the tranny? Surely not... This is okay, you just have to get used to doubleing the clutch when changing from third to second, but don't even think of changing down to 1st on the move, I have never been able to do this without lots of grinding noises. > * How hard is it to remove the Safari roof?? How heavy is it?? Why on earth would you want to do that, the safari root keeps cabin tempurature down in the summer! > * Any maintenance tips?? If you are not working on it, then there is definitly something wrong with the vehicle! But seriously, regularly check the swivell housing for oil, or else you will go through wheel bearings. After off roading, check all the oils for water and the correct levels, especially the diff's, also remove the brake drums and clean out any junk that is in there, if you don't do this you will go through brake drums and shoes like they were going out of fashion. If you have an oil leak, try to fix, and if you cannot, regularly check the oil, my parents tranfer case used to leak, then they cooked, they had to throw the entire thing away, the main shaft was blue!! and the casing had teeth embeded in it, the whole thing was scrap. > ...Thanks for wading through this mess!! > > J.B. (...and "Sydney" the ser IIa SWB from Tenessee) > ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Sun Jul 31 23:19:49 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: testing the Discovery's air bags. To: lro@team.net Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 14:07:41 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO Hi all, I thought this might interest a few of you out there. Last Friday, the LROC of Victoria, Australia, had a film night, where one of the videos shown was of some of the testing that was done to the Discovery to make sure that the air bags did not go off while off roading, and believe me, I am never going to buy a demonstrator vehicle after I saw what these vehicles were put through. They chained them up to trees, and then took off, they jumped them about 2 metres in the air, they bounced them over railway sleepers, that were about 1.5 metres apart, but the discoverys wheels only hit the sleepers, not the ground. They had a concrete step that was about a foot tall, and snatched one over that. They drove them over a simulated corregated road, that if they took any faster, the drivers would have lost control! Basically you would not want one of these vehicles, as they would either be longer than standard or would have a funny bannana shape about them, I know how strong they are built! ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From ccray Mon Aug 1 15:00:56 1994 Subject: Re: Manifold Destiny (fwd) To: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 15:00:56 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 794 X-Status: Status: RO MR ALEXANDER P GRICE was bold enough to point out... > >If you can find "Manifold Destiny" (it recently came out in paperback, and >any decent bookstore should be able to order it) it has some interesting >recepies: .... you are RIGHT -- called the bookstore and it will be in Thursday. $7.95. Sorry to bother the netters -- should have done my homework earlier. Anyway, it is our objective to check out a couple of recipes and I will report back. > ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From jhilborn@moose.uvm.edu Mon Aug 1 16:24:55 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 1994 17:25:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Jan Hilborn Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu In-Reply-To: <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Status: Status: RO Ray, it wouldn't be very hard to make one (or 5)... the hardest part would be the closure at the top... if you don't have any luck (in the next few days) i'll try to throw one together and you can test drive it... jan From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 16:39:27 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? Date: 1 Aug 1994 21:31:14 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu>, wrote: >OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they >used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. > >They were about 15 x 12 inches. They had a cork to >plug the opening and a rope handle. You would fill >the bag with water and drape it over a radiator cap. >The canvas would get wet and the evaporation (and the >fan action would help too) would cause the water to >cool. I remember being out in 100 f sunshine and the >water was so-o-o cold you could barely drink it. > >Anyway, I want one of those bags for the Utah expedition. >I think it would look proper on the grill of a SIIa 88. > >Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am >wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might >obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. > Don't know if it will help, but mine says: Keeps Drinking Water Cool SAHARA Flax (picture of a cow skull and cactus) Water Bag another Wenzel product Randy From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 10:48:05 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: LRO@Team.net Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 08:35:41 +1100 Subject: Hot plate X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO Dear LRO's, On a recent Rover Run, it was unseasonably hot in NW Montana and Northern Idaho. My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles on my Clark Wallabees!! My old Land Cruiser FJ-40 had side vents to prevent this heat build up. Any suggestions from other LRO's on how you all deal with the heat build up?? Thanks, John R. Benham Spokane, WA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 17:40:20 1994 To: mlist-lro@nntp-server.caltech.edu From: rsrose@cco.caltech.edu (Randolph Rose) Newsgroups: mlist.lro Subject: Re: Lucas Wiring Date: 1 Aug 1994 22:31:54 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena X-Status: Status: RO In article <9407310128.AA06479@mtnoca.helena_noc>, ROY CALDWELL wrote: >I hope somebody has some ideas because I have run out >of ideas. This is the problem. I replaced the main >frame wire in Wicked Wonda, my 58 Series I. I thought that >I understood how the tail lights wired up but the signals >don't work. I have the factory single lens dual element >bulb. One element is the tail light the other is the brake light. >It does not matter which element I try to get to blink it is >a no go. The original factory vehicle manual wire diagram >does not show the turn signal switch or relay - the twits! >The factory manual does not show the relay or switch until the IIA >mod. > Probably not in the workshop manual because turn signals were an option. I recall ( or seem to) that the workshop manual for Series II, in the back of the book, showed the installation methods for optional equipment. This is a single volume book, and not the two volume IIA manual. I know it showed how to put in a governor, winch, dual gauge. >Now, this sounds stupid but, which element gets the signal blink? >The tail or brake light? The bright element, which is also the brake light. >The factory IIA illustrations and my >other Rovers have the signal light seperate and the brake and tail >light in the same assembly but with one element bulbs. True on 99.9% of Land-Rovers you find. Tail/stop is dual filament, turn signal, single filament. >Oh by the >way the wire from the back to the front was only three wire. Tail >and brake light and a spare. As yet I can't figure out how the >turn signals worked. The turn signals are factory installed, for >what it's worth. And this is what makes me think you had the alternate type of signals. If I am right, then these three wires were not tail, brake, and spare, but tail, right brake, and left brake. Hopefully, you have your original turn signal switch. Switches for separate turn signal lamps will have three terminals on the back. Again, if my suspicions are right, your switch has more than three. Here's how it goes: on the way from the brake light switch to the bulb, the circuit first stops off at the turn signal switch where it is split into left and right brake light, then goes to the respective bulbs. When you switch for a turn, the appropriate brake light circuit is interrupted, and the blinking circuit is sent to the brake light. The switch will have separate terminals for front lamps, and perhaps the dash indicator light. > >Any way, send all non-destructive ideas to me, pleeeease, I been >without a Rover so long, don't know which way is up!!!!! > > >Roy - Sticking pins in the voodoo doll of George Lucas out on > the Rockie Mountain Front. I'll try to find diagrams tonight (Monday); got a FAX number? Randy rsrose@iago.caltech.edu '57 Series I, with separate turn signal lamps. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 18:03:32 1994 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 94 15:53:12 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu, lro@transfer.stratus.com, Land-Rover-Owners@apple.com, FORUM@apple.com Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? X-Status: Status: RO In message <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> writes: > OK, it goes back 25 years, but when I was a kid, they > used to have canvas waterbags in the farm fields. > > They were about 15 x 12 inches. They had a cork to > plug the opening and a rope handle. You would fill > the bag with water and drape it over a radiator cap. > The canvas would get wet and the evaporation (and the > fan action would help too) would cause the water to > cool. I remember being out in 100 f sunshine and the > water was so-o-o cold you could barely drink it. > > Anyway, I want one of those bags for the Utah expedition. > I think it would look proper on the grill of a SIIa 88. > > Looked and looked and can't find one. People think I am > wierd. Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might > obtain one? False leads appreciated, too. > > Thanks in advance... > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 > > - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) > - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) > - 80 MGB - xx > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ray, I got mine 5 or 6 years ago at McGukins (SP?) hardware store in Bolder CO. It is the BEST hardware store I have ever seen. They do mail order. So you can call information, get their phone number & order one over the phone, assuming they still carry it. You will need a place to hang it from. I have a bonnet hold down on the center front of my car & that worked fine after shortening the rope handle. Good luck finding one. TeriAnn TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 19:07:15 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 08:46:21 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: LRO@team.net, Malcolm956@aol.com Subject: Re: Water Pumps X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 480 X-Status: Status: RO > > I would appreciate comments > -about the relative merits of installing a rebuilt pump (ca $120) v. putting > in the seals, et al, (ca $60). > -do I really have to start by taking out the radiator? > I carry a water pump rebuild kit in the tool box. I've only had to do it once, in the field*, but it's easy. You do not have to remove the radiator. *In the street in front of my In-Laws (well, it was more entertaining than a Giants game on TV.) Regards, Bill G. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 20:19:34 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: canvas water bags To: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 10:45:11 +0930 (CST) Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com In-Reply-To: <9408011839.AA14911@lulu.cc.missouri.edu> from "ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu" at Aug 1, 94 01:39:22 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 306 X-Status: Status: RO > Anyone on the LRO mailing list know where I might > obtain one, (a canvas water bag that is) Ray if all else fails they are readily availible down under. Can still get the big round ones (~25+ litres) that you hang under a tree. Just a thought. -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 00:15:12 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Cc: rc@sandelman.ocunix.on.ca Subject: up again From: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Robin Craig) Reply-To: rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Mon, 01 Aug 94 23:31:37 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Well its monday night and the info dam has finally broken and we have gotten out of the weekend drought here. Craig in OZ mentions the Dsicovery air bag video! WHAT A SCREAM!!! they showed this baby to the press here at the Discovery Launch in canada in May and the press coulndt beleive the abuse that vehcil;e was subjected to. Man they really tried everything just like Craig said. It was kind of like how you expect every rental car gets treated!! It seemed to be the same vehicle the whole way through the video. Robin Craig Ottawa, Ontario, Canada -- Robin Craig, rc@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 02:23:50 1994 To: land-rover-owner@team.net From: azw@aber.ac.uk (Andy Woodward) Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 08:18:06 UNDEFINED X-Status: Status: RO >> * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? >Too much winch is better than not enough, and one that works both ways is better >than one that only pulls. Other than that you can just check the yellow pages & >all the off road equipment places you cn find. Not everyone has RN's markup. I reckon that hand winches are the best. Cheap adn more versatile. The thing that has always bothered me is that most power winches are mounted on the front. Now, unless you habitually drive into place you are likely to get stuck backwards............... The problem arises when you are bogged and cant reroute the winch to the rear. A hand winch clips on anywhere and pulls in any direction. They can also be used for other things away from the presence of the lorry. A high lift jack can also be used as a winch (or even at a pinch, as a high lift jack....) Sadly my hand winch is a cheapo crap job for a fiver from a market stall. It's done the job to date, but bending it back into shape is disturbing and I'd quite like a proper one - anyone know any details in teh UK? From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 19:04:10 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 16:58:33 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: LROVER@u.washington.edu, lro@stratus.com Subject: Re: Fairey Overdrive X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 627 X-Status: Status: RO >Hum...Toro O/D ? I have not heard of that brand How much$ and were? >Sincerely, >Benjamin J. Freeman Toro overdrives are (were) a close copy of the Fairey, but the case is a little bigger, so they hold more oil. I was told that the sycro is a Range Rover part. They were sold in the US by DAP (and ?) a few years back. I don't know if they are still made or not, but believe they were made by Bearmach. Price was comparable to the F brand. Mine works fine in all gears and I use it in low range also. No problems. except the oil transfer thing that I have outlined, and seemed to have cured with venting. Regards, Bill G. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 04:46:30 1994 From: "Keith Coman" Organization: Rhodes University To: lro@stratus.com Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 11:42:43 GMT+0200 Subject: Re:Land Rover Owner at last -- Winches Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO > >> * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? > > >Too much winch is better than not enough, and one that works both ways is better > >than one that only pulls. Other than that you can just check the yellow pages & > >all the off road equipment places you cn find. Not everyone has RN's markup. > > I reckon that hand winches are the best. Cheap adn more versatile. The thing > that has always bothered me is that most power winches are mounted on the > front. Now, unless you habitually drive into place you are likely to get stuck > backwards............... > > The problem arises when you are bogged and cant reroute the winch to the rear. > A hand winch clips on anywhere and pulls in any direction. > > They can also be used for other things away from the presence of the lorry. > > A high lift jack can also be used as a winch (or even at a pinch, as a high > lift jack....) > > Sadly my hand winch is a cheapo crap job for a fiver from a market stall. It's > done the job to date, but bending it back into shape is disturbing and I'd > quite like a proper one - anyone know any details in teh UK? Just to add two cents.... The quality\performance of the winch is one thing, but to my mind another critical issue is the quality of the actual winch *rope*. Ropes that have either (a) seen better days or (b) which are used at fairly acute angles (often with abrasion over rocks\earth or tree trunks) can and do fail catastrophically -- the whip-back effect of a snapped tow rope under severe load has to be witnessed to be believed -- and if one's tender shrinking body's in the way....... Moral of the story is that even with an el cheapo winch, make sure that the rope is in top-notch condition, is operated within its strain tolerance, and that there is adequate clearance people-wise in case of failure. Personally, I feel that a good quality winch will allow for remote control operation either by an operator standing well out to one side or from within the cab taking directions from a well-clear external observer. In either instance, when using the winch it is I think a jolly sensible thing to raise the hood\bonnet to shield the windscreen\cab in case of rope failure. Cheers, Keith Coman * Dept of Management, Rhodes University, Grahamstown, South Africa * ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 08:20:50 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 09:15:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Harry Greenspun Subject: Aftermarket products for Disco? To: Land Rover BBS Cc: Guy Kawasaki Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 517 X-Status: Status: RO While I'm waiting for my 5-speed Disco to arrive, I'm pondering accessories. Two questions: 1. Is it possible to get aftermarket rear (jump) seats? Since I'm already paying full MSRP for the Disco, the thought of shelling out over $1000 to the dealer for rear seats makes me woozy. 2. Any recommendations on a brush bar? Atlantic-British sells one ($400) which they claim is air-bag compatible (like the OEM bar- $900!). D.A.P. sent the Bearmach brochure. Any suggestions? Thanks. Harry From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Mon Aug 1 18:10:27 1994 From: Craig Murray Subject: Re: (Followup) Land Rover Owner at last To: lro@team.net Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 9:00:53 EST In-Reply-To: from "To:lro@team.net" at Aug 1, 94 1:57 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] X-Status: Status: RO > Now, a few questions for the gurus... > > * I need a winch but can't afford the Warn from RN, suggestions?? One other suggestion I remembered last night, buy a hand winch first, like a turfor, a power winch mounted on the front of a vehicle is going to be no good if you have to pull your self out backwards, or sideways. ============================================================================== Craig Murray 1955 Series 1 86" LROC of Victoria Australia 2.25 diesel (Soon!) email: craigp@ocs.cpsg.com.au From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 09:43:20 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 10:30:00 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: lro@team.net From: jhong@haiku.com (John Hong) Subject: TeriAnn sums it up X-Status: Status: RO TeriAnn writes: >You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of time. >If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. >Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new 4X4. >But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering about >exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. >Before you purchase one, just understand that it is a commitment of time for >maintnenece,$$ for parts, you will have to learn more than you think to keep it >going (or have lots of $$ and a regular Land Rover doctor that you visit >monthly). They are noisy, primitive, slow, and go through fluids. >They are not for normal people. This is the best summation of the rover experience I have ever read. TeriAnn, are we allowed to redistribute "The Manifesto" with attribution? IT made my day. I'm so glad you and NotAJeep Denis decided to stay on the list. My rover is really hurting for a frameup and general overhaul - keeping up with all the bandaid maintenance is really trying. But I'm not giving up! I CAN FIX IT! In the vein of rover strange/obsessive behavior - if I had to choose between secure garage space for a year or a nice girlfriend for a year - I'd have a hard time deciding - mind you, if the garage was heated and had a floor drain it would be EASY! :) Well anyway, I'm off to the West Coast for a quick trip starting tomorrow - if any of you WC LRO-listers see a Korean guy in a boring rental car with a bat fastard sticker waving at you...cover your floor drain. John Hong (jhong@haiku.com 617-625-9469 voice 623-5253 fax) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 12:48:36 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Cookin' _ON_ the road From: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (dixon kenner) Reply-To: dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 09:32:20 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO Stevens writes: > I've been following the thread about the Land Rover's cooking abilities. > (And perhaps, to tie in the thread about mileage, the figures should be > given in mpg: meals per gallon) :-) However, it must be born in mind that the Land Rover is probably not the best vehicle for getting those smaller snacks while out on the road. Its excessive ground clearence insures that you will need a large BBQ to handle all of the good stuff you happen across. > As a sidebar, there was, a couple of years ago, another cookbook for > would-be road chefs, titled something like "The Roadkill Cookbook". I > gather it was half tongue-in-cheek, half serious. I seem to recall one > chapter entitled "Identifying your dinner at 50 miles per hour." The book got a lot of press. Identifying the little buggers, determining if they were fresh enough to pick up, determining age, etc. were all part of the book. Rather amusing read. > This presupposes that someone will do you the honors of "hunting up" and > laying out dinner for you. Although if you're going to run into moose on > the hoof on the hiway, it would appear from the Rover meets Brick Wall > thread that a Landy is the best vehicle in which to fetch venison. It was in a 1991 Rovers North newsletter (I believe the year is right) that there was a photo of a Land Rover that hit a moose. The Land Rover was a bit crushed looking in the front, but still drivable. > Bon appetite Out on the prairies it must not be as much fun hitting dinner. All of those wide fields enable you to see the critters coming. You will have to come out east where there is a thrill of driving down country lanes, through the wooded sections, and having dinner leap right in front of you. Makes you react fast, especially if you are in an Austin Mini and a dozen suddenly appear... Rgds, Dixon -- dixon kenner, dixon@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 10:50:50 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 08:40:59 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: mcdpw@pacific.pacific.net, mfredett@ichips.intel.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: ABF leak, Portland X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408012237.PAA26588@pacific.pacific.net> Granville Pool writes: uld that be a part of the registration fee as would the public one? > > 2. What sort of picture is appropriate for the program, a portrait or > an action shot? Inasmuch as it is a Land-Rover, I lean toward an action > shot. What do you think? I'm trying to find a copy of the picture of my Land Rover that appeared in the Rover's North Working Rovers section. Its the back of my car with the tail gate down and a bunch of dairy goats disembarking. TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 14:16:26 1994 To: lro@stratus.com Subject: Substitute for Air Locker From: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca (Dale Desprey) Reply-To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 02 Aug 94 11:13:58 -0500 Organization: FourFold Symmetry - Nepean, Ontario, Canada X-Status: Status: RO I saw a post awhile back, either from NZ or OZ, about products comparable to ARB Air Lockers, but stronger, simple and less expensive. Somehow, I lost track of the thread. Any information that you may have about these products would be greatly appreciated. Dale Desprey -- Dale Desprey, dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Ottawa Valley Land Rovers / FourFold Symmetry, Nepean, Ontario, Canada From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 11:54:20 1994 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 94 09:46:13 -0700 From: "TeriAnn Wakeman" Reply-To: "TeriAnn Wakeman" To: jhong@haiku.com, lro@team.net Subject: Re: TeriAnn sums it up X-Status: Status: RO In message <199408021430.KAA04269@zork.tiac.net> John Hong writes: > TeriAnn writes: > > >You need to be seriously strange to own one & drive it for any length of > time. > >If you aren't when you get one, you will ether become that way or sell it. > > >Old Land Rovers are definatly NOT for everyone. The saner crowd gets a new > 4X4. > > >But for the seriously strange, there are few things better than puttering > about > >exploring new & far away places and camping out with your Land Rover. > > >Before you purchase one, just understand that it is a commitment of time for > > >maintnenece,$$ for parts, you will have to learn more than you think to keep > it > >going (or have lots of $$ and a regular Land Rover doctor that you visit > >monthly). They are noisy, primitive, slow, and go through fluids. > > >They are not for normal people. > > This is the best summation of the rover experience I have ever read. > TeriAnn, are we allowed to redistribute "The Manifesto" with attribution? > IT made my day. I'm so glad you and NotAJeep Denis decided to stay on the > list. > > My rover is really hurting for a frameup and general overhaul - keeping up > with all the bandaid maintenance is really trying. But I'm not giving up! I > CAN FIX IT! In the vein of rover strange/obsessive behavior - if I had to > choose between > secure garage space for a year or a nice girlfriend for a year - I'd have a > hard time deciding - mind you, if the garage was heated and had a floor > drain it would be EASY! :) > > Well anyway, I'm off to the West Coast for a quick trip starting tomorrow - > if any of you WC LRO-listers see a Korean guy in a boring rental car with a > bat fastard sticker waving at you...cover your floor drain. > > > John Hong > (jhong@haiku.com 617-625-9469 voice 623-5253 fax) > John, Please feel free to use it. An attribution would be nice but since so many of my statements seem to get into general circulation like my long ago "Land Rovers are built to withstand the charge of a bull rino and be rebuilt in the jungle with a screwdriver and a crescent wrench". For me the decision would be much easier.. A boyfriend who would like nothing better to do than work on my cars while I drove them would be much better than a garage. But as it is I have never had the time to do the upkeep on a boyfriend and my British cars. Therefore a garage would come in handy. Speeking of bat fastard... have you personally seen the cubby box they make that goes in between the front two seats? It looks cheap in their advertizment, but it looks like the largest commercial one available. Do you have any opinions? Take care, TeriAnn TeriAnn Wakeman Large format photographers look at the world twakeman@apple.com upside down and backwards LINK: TWAKEMAN 408-974-2344 TR3A - TS75519L, MGBGT - GHD4U149572G, Land Rover 109 - 164000561 From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 18:29:35 1994 From: ccray@lulu.cc.missouri.edu Subject: Re: canvas water bags -- thing of the past??? To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Tue, 2 Aug 1994 18:22:11 -0500 (CDT) Cc: lro@transfer.stratus.com (Land-Rover-Owners FORUM) In-Reply-To: from "Dale Desprey" at Aug 2, 94 11:10:43 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1312 X-Status: Status: RO Dale Desprey was bold enough to point out... >These are available new, at Sir Plus. They have a plastic cap instead of >a cork. Also the cord doesn't last very long. If you can't find one >locally, let me know. > Get to me a city where Sir Plus is located. I can call directory assistance to get a phone number. Thanks. TerriAnne's Boulder contact is good, but they are temporarily out of stock. Apparently they are selling like hotcakes. They had a mini (10x10) in stock but not the larger (12x18 est). It is so refreshing to talk to someone that knows what I am talking about. I must have drop-ped into about 20-30 red-neck missouri hardware stores and the blank stares (by the 40 and under) is dis-concerning. The over 40 know what I am talking about but they don't give a damn. Anyway, Boulder (yes, it is McGukins) is going to call me back tomorrow. If they have problems, the Sir Plus backup might be handy. I will keep netters informed... Thanks, ------------------------------------------------------------------- Ray Harder Columbia, Missouri 314-882-2000 - 61 SIIa 88 (LULU) - 66 SIIa 88 (rebuild project) - 69 SIIa 88 (parts) - 87 RR (wife's) - 80 MGB - xx ------------------------------------------------------------------- From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 22:18:17 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: Substitute for Air Locker To: dd@fourfold.ocunix.on.ca Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 11:37:19 +0930 (CST) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: from "Dale Desprey" at Aug 2, 94 11:13:58 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2082 X-Status: Status: RO Dale writes: > I saw a post awhile back, either from NZ or OZ, about products comparable > to ARB Air Lockers, but stronger, simple and less expensive. Somehow, I > lost track of the thread. Any information that you may have about these > products would be greatly appreciated. You are probably thinking of the Jack MacNamara products. They advertise in LRO I think. They make a manually activated diff lock for the rear axle. ( you have to get out and wind a bolt fitted to a modified axle.) from what i've seen these things work great and arent too expensive, They are also in keeping with the somewhat primitive appeal of older Land-Rovers :-) MacNamaras also make cabin activated diff locks now. Craig Murray mentioned Mal Story's Maxi-drive diff locks. These things are certainly good but he used to insist on fitting stage I V8 type CV joints in place of the uni-joints in the ball swivels if you wanted a front diff lock. This added nearly $1K to the cost of the kit way back in 1988 ( no I couldnt afford it then either) It is possible to use toyota CV's and have mal re-spline the toyota axles to save some dollars but you need a very specific toyota axle. A friend spent ages running around wrecking yards with a micrometer until he found the right ones. Hey I can replace an awful lot of standard axles for ~$1K For 10/10ths work the Maxi-drives are probably the strongest of the in-car actuation types, (though I havent seen the later MacNamara in-car lockers) In all likely hood both of these would be stronger than the ARB air-lockers, mainly due to strengthened axles supplied with the kits. For simple "get out of trouble" diff locks the manual MacNamaras take some beating. For the real hard cases with salisbury type diffs, You can get a No-Spin Detroit locker, but be prepared to rethink your driving style on loose dirt roads. (yes you can do power turns in a landy with a holden GM 3.3lL 6cyl and a detroit locker) Craig can probably fill in most of the bits I've forgotten :-) -- Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Tue Aug 2 21:38:18 1994 From: dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au (Daryl Webb) Subject: Re: Hot plate To: BENHAM@wfoclan.usbm.gov (John R. Benham) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 12:01:31 +0930 (CST) Cc: LRO@Team.net In-Reply-To: <30F38123F68@wfoclan.usbm.gov> from "John R. Benham" at Aug 2, 94 08:35:41 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 510 X-Status: Status: RO John Benham writes:> Dear LRO's, > My left hand drive 88 heated up unbearably around > the drivers floorboard. In fact, it got so hot, it melted the soles > on my Clark Wallabees!! I use 10mm eva-zote like close cell foam (you know like sleeping mats) Certainly helps. Throw a heavy rubber mat on top and wa-la warm but not fried feet. Cheap easy and fire-hosable! Be warned when water gets under the foam it becomes slippery as all get out. Daryl Webb (dwebb@waite.adelaide.edu.au) From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 18:08:27 1994 From: "John R. Benham" Organization: WFOC Spokane, Washington To: wc@lady.ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (William Carter), lro@stratus.com Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 15:56:14 +1100 Subject: Re: Disco fever X-Pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-Status: Status: RO William, What is a Rhino package and how can you get to an accuracy of a thousanths of a minute of latitude and longitude? John R. Benham Spokane, WA USA From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 15:23:53 1994 Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 13:14:09 +0800 From: William.Grouell@Eng.Sun.COM (William L. Grouell) To: land-rover-owner@team.net, PC7170@UTKVM1.UTK.EDU Subject: Re: off center steering X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Content-Length: 919 X-Status: Status: RO > > My IIa 88 tracks perfectly so alignment must be true,however, > when the steering wheel's centered the wheels are actually turning > slightly right. Thus I must drive with the steering wheel left of > center. This is annoying and also makes it turn right sharper than left. > Any ideas on how to correct this?? > > Rgds, > Joseph Adjust the lenth of one of the two steering rods that attach to the steering relay. Either one will do it, but not the one between the wheels, that ones for the toe-in. Just loosen the clamp, spray WD-40 or ? on the threads at both ends, turn the rod once or twice, drive, to see how far off you went, in the wrong direction (of course), correct, tighten clamp. No sweat. R, bg PS; It doesn't make the thing turn more one way than the other. It just changes where the steering wheel spokes are. From car-list-rejects@transfer.stratus.com Wed Aug 3 02:26:45 1994 From: "T.F. Mills" Subject: fast Rover, dead Rover To: sinasohn@crl.com (Roger Sinasohn) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 1994 01:19:19 -0600 (MDT) Cc: lro@stratus.com In-Reply-To: <199407071444.AA00680@crl2.crl.com> from "Roger Sinasohn" at Jul 7, 94 07:44:55 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 904 X-Status: Status: RO Ages ago, Uncle Roger wrote: < T. F. Mills writes: < < > Speaking as the owner of the fastest Rover in the West (1966 109"), < > I'd say don't even think of getting by without overdrive if you plan < > on much highway driving... < How fas