Toyota 4x4 digest:     Monday, September 21 1998     Volume 02 : Number 091
 -   Toyota 4x4 Mailing List  (Toy4x4)   ---
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 major engine trouble
 Re: Smog Pump - another lesson
 Use of Taco Coil Over for 1st Gen IFS
 Re: Smog Pump - another lesson
 Re: tires
 Re: Smog Pump - another lesson
 True Tracs
 Re: True Tracs
 More IFS ideas (some kooky - kinda long)
 Re: More IFS ideas (some kooky - kinda long)
 Re: Goodyear Wrangler "MT" tires on tired 90 4x4 V6 Extra Cab
 Toyota_4x4 webring
 4runner top question....
 RE: HELP        PLEASE!  (Bigger Tires)
 Re: Use of Taco Coil Over for 1st Gen IFS
 Re: IFS lifts
 A/C evaporator drain tube on '98 Taco?
 Re: 22re turbo
 Re: IFS Sucks!  /  Marlin testing...
 Re: IFS lifts and rear springs
 Re: starting question
 Re: More IFS ideas (some kooky - kinda long)
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 11:22:33 +1000
 From: "Chris Senungetuk"  Subject: major engine trouble
 Hey all,
 Imagine my surprise when I went to change the oil on our 93 4runner - no
 oil in the engine. Oh, man, I wish I had checked the oil a little more
 regularly. What a sinking feeling. Looks like I found the reason why she
 complained of less power last week.
 A few months ago we took the rig to the dealer asking about the head gasket
 deal. At that time they blessed the engine as running perfectly and we will
 hear from them in the future. Sure enough, a month or so later they sent us
 a notice in the mail - bring it in, blah blah blah. We haven't really had
 time since then to do it and here we are.
 Now I'm _really_ hoping this is related to the head gasket problem. This
 morning when we brought it in of course the guy said it might be unrelated.
 While we wait to hear back it would great to hear from any listers if this
 scenario is possible: Head gasket problem begins, engine running poorly,
 engine looses or consumes oil as a result of the head gasket defect, engine
 suffers damage as a result of no oil. Yeah, it's a stretch, but there's
 hope. Somebody please cheer me up.
 Naturally I searched for an oil leak. Where'd all the oil go? The only clue
 I have is in the right-front area of the engine bay there is what appears
 to be oil coming from somewhere. I am aware of a problem with the power
 steering pump - it is leaking fluid, but that's not engine oil, right? So
 if you take that out of the situation, what else could be leaking engine
 oil in that area? There are some hoses going to what looks like an oil
 cooler, but those are all good. Are there any obvious places where oil
 should be leaking from? If the head gasket is not to blame I need to
 satisfy my curiosity as to what went wrong.
 Other gruesome details: Charred, burnt-looking black stuff on the dipstick
 and oil-filler cap. Low oil pressure. Black sooty exhaust pipe. Bad, bad,
 all bad. No oil? Aaaauugh.
 Check your oil often!
 Not feeling very happy today,
 Chris
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 21:43:38 -0400 (EDT)
 From: "Karl D. Bellve, Ph.D."  Subject: Re: Smog Pump - another lesson
 On Sun, 20 Sep 1998, Jim Brink wrote:> Ed.Wong@astramerck.com wrote:>>>> Actually - I have an AS (Air Suction) setup.>> Never had a smog pump.>>> Yeah, I didn't *think* that sounded right. I have never seen an AIR pump> on a 22R-E, but then again, I've only worked with CA-spec. vehicles for> the most part. I do think the last "R" series motors with AIR pumps were> the '84's, both FED and CA emission packages.> Thanks, this is new info to me. What does an Air Suction Pump Do? I assume
 it pumps air into the exhaust manifold? Mind you, I don't think I ever
 said smog pump but air pump. And isn't a Air Sunction Pump an Air
 pump? If not, what is the difference?
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 21:58:29 -0400
 From: Ed.Wong@astramerck.com
 Subject: Use of Taco Coil Over for 1st Gen IFS>> Has anyone looked at the possibility of using the coil over shocks from the
 Tacoma on the 86-95 IFS?  How about the adjustable coil over shocks from
 Downey?>> Ummm - that was not exactly what I had in mind...
 It would be far easier to do a body swap of my Gen1 4Runner
 onto a  103" wheebase Taco than to swap the Taco IFS
 over to my Gen1 4Runner.
 The Front end geometry is all different and I doubt the frame
 rails are anywhere near being in the correct locations to make
 the swap easy.
 Even if it were - it would be better (IMHO) to build the
 arms and coil over tower than to figure out how to
 locate the entire Taco front end onto an older truck.
 Note that the steering for one (rack and pinion versus
 recirculating ball) is in a different location.
 Also - the easy way would be to graft the axles as well - but
 then theres that "lack of gears" issue to contend with.
 What I meant was the next step (in $$ as well as engineering
 sophistication) was to design a coil over setup....
 hmm - kinda what Scott is doing.
 The only plus for the Taco swap would be to gain the bigger
 engines (assuming I did a body swap as I like the Gen1
 4Runner body style).
 EWong
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 19:12:18 -0700
 From: Jim Brink  Subject: Re: Smog Pump - another lesson
 Karl D. Bellve, Ph.D. wrote:> Thanks, this is new info to me. What does an Air Suction Pump Do? I assume> it pumps air into the exhaust manifold? Mind you, I don't think I ever> said smog pump but air pump. And isn't a Air Sunction Pump an Air> pump? If not, what is the difference?
 The air suction system does not use a pump. It uses a reed valve type
 intake system driven from pulses of the exhaust gas. Same principle as
 an AIR pump but without the mechanical pump itself supplying the air to
 the exhaust system. So to answer your question, no, an air suction pump
 is not the same as an air pump ('cause there is no pump!) but the
 principle behind it is the same.
 - --
 Jim Brink     Toyota/ASE Certified Technician     toytech@off-road.com
 Manhattan Beach, CA                  http://www.off-road.com/~toytech/
 **********************************************************************
 1986 Toyota Standard Bed 4WD
 22R - 32x11.50/15 BFG M/T - 4.88s- Downey LSD - EZ Locker
 **********************************************************************
 TLCA  -  Friends of the Mojave Road  -  CA4WDC
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 11:57:47 +1000
 From: "Chris Senungetuk"  Subject: Re: tires
 Jeff, I have the same truck. It came with
 31x10.5's on the stock rims from the dealer.
 Chris
 "Hi guys,
 I have a 92 toy 4x4 extnd cab and it has the
 stock rims on it.  I was
 curious if I could use those rims for some
 31x10.5 tires or do i need to
 buy another set of rims.  also what diffuculties
 should I expect if I'm
 able to use the stock rims.
 Thanks
 Jeff Zicko"
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 22:23:20 -0400 (EDT)
 From: "Karl D. Bellve, Ph.D."  Subject: Re: Smog Pump - another lesson
 On Sun, 20 Sep 1998, Jim Brink wrote:> Karl D. Bellve, Ph.D. wrote:>>> Thanks, this is new info to me. What does an Air Suction Pump Do? I assume>> it pumps air into the exhaust manifold? Mind you, I don't think I ever>> said smog pump but air pump. And isn't a Air Sunction Pump an Air>> pump? If not, what is the difference?>> The air suction system does not use a pump. It uses a reed valve type> intake system driven from pulses of the exhaust gas. Same principle as> an AIR pump but without the mechanical pump itself supplying the air to> the exhaust system. So to answer your question, no, an air suction pump> is not the same as an air pump ('cause there is no pump!) but the> principle behind it is the same.>> I learn from the master!
 - -Karl
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 19:56:23 -0700
 From: "Allen Jensen"  Subject: True Tracs
 This weekend, redoing my brakes, I found that my rear brakes were so far
 out of adjustment that pushing on the brakes while twisted up didn't seem
 to lock up the back true trac well enough.  A couple weekends ago, Jim
 Brink and I took the Miller Jeep trail.  While backing down a steel mud
 hill, I  wasn't stopping very well.  Only the fronts were working well.
 During the 4Runner Jamboree in Big Bear recently, I took the diamond trails
 without a problem.  I was surprised how well the true tracs got me over the
 dishpan springs hill, especially compared to some of the locked trucks.  I
 have a spot on the Big Bear video with the front tire spinning, then I
 stopped, pushed the brakes a little, then you see me climb forward with the
 front tire in the air not spinning.
 I love the True Trac in the rear myself, but kind of wish I had put a
 locker in the front for those rock crawling times, now that my friends seem
 to be dragging me rock crawling more than I thought I would.
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 20:29:41 -0700
 From: Jim Brink  Subject: Re: True Tracs
 Allen Jensen wrote:>> This weekend, redoing my brakes, I found that my rear brakes were so far> out of adjustment that pushing on the brakes while twisted up didn't seem> to lock up the back true trac well enough.  A couple weekends ago, Jim> Brink and I took the Miller Jeep trail.  While backing down a steep mud> hill, I  wasn't stopping very well.  Only the fronts were working well.
> I love the True Trac in the rear myself, but kind of wish I had put a> locker in the front for those rock crawling times, now that my friends seem> to be dragging me rock crawling more than I thought I would.
 Yeah well, I notice you come along kicking and screaming the whole way
 Allen :-)
 - --
 Jim Brink     Toyota/ASE Certified Technician     toytech@off-road.com
 Manhattan Beach, CA                  http://www.off-road.com/~toytech/
 **********************************************************************
 1986 Toyota Standard Bed 4WD
 22R - 32x11.50/15 BFG M/T - 4.88s- Downey LSD - EZ Locker
 **********************************************************************
 TLCA  -  Friends of the Mojave Road  -  CA4WDC
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 23:33:56 EDT
 From: DRM033@aol.com
 Subject: More IFS ideas (some kooky - kinda long)
 While things are getting tossed around, I have a few more.
 On the hydraulic adjuster for the T bars, Scott mentioned a problem with the
 cylinders having to be directly below the seats.  One way to solve this could
 possible be to mount the cylinders horizontally.  These cylinders would be
 linked to a "L" bracket that moved the adjuster.  I have not looked to see if
 the tranny would be in the way for this, but at least they point up.
 Also, on the IFS, I agree that the T bar is not the answer.  How about a coil
 spring mounted directly above the upper A arm.  This would require a custom
 arm to handle the load, and would also require you to have your coil tower
 real close to the hood and would defiantely have to come into the engine
 compartment.
 I was also wondering about ball joints.  If they are so limiting as some say
 they are, why not do something different.  How about a cross type design
 similar to a U joint.  One cross would ride on the A arm providing trave up &
 down.  the other cross would ride in the spindle and allow the wheel to turn.
 Now, thos would require costom spindles and A arms, but I thought it *might*
 work.
 As to clearance under the IFS front, hoy about a high clearance crossmember.
 the crossmember would be where it is on the pass. side to protect the diff,
 but once it was past the diff it would angle up to the level of the driver's
 side flange then go over & drop back down  right next to the lower A arm
 bracket.  Now, this would get you only about an inch or so of clearance, and
 require a screwy front skid plate, but hey, it is clearance.
 NOTE:  This next one may not make sense to you all, but I could explain
 further if you want.
 Design a front diff that is centered similar to how Scott & his 9" diff are.
 Instead of flanges you would have  small sprockets on the end of the short
 shafts that come out of the diff.  Here is where you could go 3 ways.
 1.  These would have double row chains that go down to another sprocket on a
 shaft directly below the diff.  These would have the CV shafts attached to
 them.  You wold have one per side to allow for the differential to work.
 2.  If you don't care about differentiation, you could have the lower shafts
 be only one shaft across from CV to CV - essentiallyproviding a spool.
 3.  If you wanted to get really trick, you could have the two lower shafts
 come towards the center and be splined on the ends where them meet.  Then you
 could use some type of sliding coupler (similar to ADD I think).  This would
 work like an ARB oper diff then not coupled, and a spool when coupled.
 Now, this would probably require a drop bracket type lift kit, and the diff
 would staw where it was when stock to make room for the sprockets & lower
 shafts.  You would also probably to encase the chain to keep commor road trash
 & what-not from getting caught in the chain.  Also, you build the chain so
 that it is your weak link, and this would be very easy to replace instead of
 CV's.
 I personally want to take the front half of 2 IFS trucks & splice the frames
 together end to end (center to center actually), ending up with an IFS & IRS
 vehicle with front & rear steering.  You would convert the rear part to a
 return-to-center type hydraulic steering with a "straight-ahead" type lock for
 it.  Since a body will have to be custom made, you would build it with enough
 room for 35" tires or so.  To address the rear diff being offset the wrong
 side, you again use a center type diff.  Add some custom skid plating and you
 are ready to beat the thing up.
 Now, it wouldn't do squat on the ramp, and it would look goofy as anything,
 but I bet it would maneuver AWESOME on the trail & ride like a CADDY...
 I think I think too much...
 have fun!
 David
 DRM033@aol.com
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 21:10:44 -0700 (PDT)
 From: Jimmy Tom  Subject: Re: More IFS ideas (some kooky - kinda long)
 On Sun, 20 Sep 1998 DRM033@aol.com wrote:> Design a front diff that is centered similar to how Scott & his 9" diff are.> Instead of flanges you would have  small sprockets on the end of the short> shafts that come out of the diff.  Here is where you could go 3 ways.> 1.  These would have double row chains that go down to another sprocket on a> shaft directly below the diff.  These would have the CV shafts attached to> them.  You wold have one per side to allow for the differential to work.> 2.  If you don't care about differentiation, you could have the lower shafts> be only one shaft across from CV to CV - essentiallyproviding a spool.
 Nice idea, but I think Differentiation is a muy mucho desirable option to
 have on in the front.....especially if you're thinking about driving at
 any speeds higher than rockcrawling.  (I'm biased here.....but who isn't?)
 A major front end push would occur w/ all of the slipping of the front
 tires as a spool tries to fight against itself while turning.  I dunno
 about the chain....too many links to break, but trail reapirs would seem
 easier than fixing a busted CV or shaft -- somthing like a fusible link
 for the suspension?> vehicle with front & rear steering.  You would convert the rear part to a> return-to-center type hydraulic steering with a "straight-ahead" type lock for> it.  Since a body will have to be custom made, you would build it with enough> room for 35" tires or so.  To address the rear diff being offset the wrong> side, you again use a center type diff.  Add some custom skid plating and you> are ready to beat the thing up.> Now, it wouldn't do squat on the ramp, and it would look goofy as anything,> but I bet it would maneuver AWESOME on the trail & ride like a CADDY...> David> DRM033@aol.com
 If we're gonna really do some major cutting, why not just do the engine
 setback thing and then you could push the front diff up a bit higher?  It
 would decrease the angles in the front driveshaft, allow you to make real
 long a-arms that would mount more to the middle of the frame (since there
 is no pesky motor to get in the way), and the axleshafts could be a bit
 longer -- allowing lesser angles on the CV's.  Weight distribution would
 be greatly improved (for those who regularly sky their truck), and you'd
 be able to tune your carb from te comfort of your driver's seat since the
 engine setback would shove the motor back about a foot.  Kinda brings back
 memories of driving around an Econoline w/o the "doghouse"!
 Granted, the shifter would now have to be more complicated, and it would
 be hard to mount the stereo w/o any dash, but you wouldn't need a snorkel
 anymore since the intake would be right in the cab!
 Inspiration?  Check out the next CORR race on the tube and you'll see how
 the Pro-4 racers do that all the time.  The in-car shots show the
 aircleaner right next to the driver.
 And no Dave, you're not thinking too much...have another beer!
 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Jimmy Tom  - -------------------------------------------------------------------------
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 21:27:49 -0700
 From: Ken Emanuel  Subject: Re: Goodyear Wrangler "MT" tires on tired 90 4x4 V6 Extra Cab
 Duke Hayduk wrote:>> Anybody out there have experience (road noise, mileage decrease,> wearability, wet pavement and off road rock/dust/occasional mud) with> this really aggressive tread tire for about 60/40 on/off road travel.> I'm in Bluff, Southeast Utah in terms of terrain/weather.> I have Goodyear Wranger ATS tires on my '94.  They are MUCH MUCH noisier
 than the Bridgestone Dueler A/Ts on my '87.  I wouldn't even expect a
 mud terrain to be as noisy as the Wrangler ATs.  It doesn't mean it's
 not a good tire though.  Oh yeah, small rocks stick in them easy and you
 get to hear them on the pavement until you dig them out by hand.
 *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
 Ken Emanuel                     Emanuel@csus.edu
 '87 Xtra Cab SR5
 '94 Xtra Cab SR5 V6
 http://webpages.csus.edu/~sac75830/toystuff.htm
 *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 23:01:56 -0700
 From: "Devin Noel"  Subject: Toyota_4x4 webring
 As many of you know I have started a webring for Toyota 4x4's. Originally I
 intended it to be for this mailing list, but I really don't care if
 non-members join. The homepage for the ring is located at
 http://www.off-road.com/~dnoel/webring/. I believe we have around 25 members
 in the ring, and lately there have been about a submission a week. If you
 have any kind of webpage about your Toyota 4x4 (heck even a pre-runner ) I
 encourage you to join. The more the merrier.
 To all the people who are in the ring, thanks for joining. Almost everyone
 has the necessary HTML fragment on their page, and to those who don't please
 get around to putting it up sometime.
 Devin Noel
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 00:10:08 -0700
 From: Jeff Keenan  Subject: 4runner top question....
 A friend of mine has an '89 4runner. Below the side windows on the
 back(top), are a set of "hockey stick" looking pieces of metal. His are
 very rusty, not worth repairing. Toyota localy wants 155.00 canadian for
 these parts. Is there an aftermarket outlet that sells these at a resonable
 price? Or even if somebody in B.C. has a set of used ones they would be
 interested in selling? Thanks.
 Jeff Keenan
 Kamloops BC
 Canada eh?
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 10:07:23 -0000
 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?500_T=D6LV_R=FAnar_Sigurj=F3nsson?=  Subject: RE: HELP        PLEASE!  (Bigger Tires)
 There is a 60-series riding around Geilo, on 44" tires.
 So, everything is possible...
 Cheers,
 Runar.> -----Original Message-----> From:	Gjermund Siegel [SMTP:gsiegel@online.no]> Sent:	Friday, September 18, 1998 11:25 PM> To:	Toy4x4@tlca.org> Subject:	HELP        PLEASE!  (Bigger Tires)>> I have a -83 Toyota Hi-lux Pick up  Long bed (RN 46)> In Norway we have this stupid rule not to exceed tire circumference with>  more than 5%> If we do we get in  trouble with the authorities.> I just did.   They tell me I have to replace my tires with smaller> ones,but>> It's got BFG M/T 35" 12.5 15 on and I think it looks real sharp with them.>> My truck is delivered to Norway with 205/16 as stock tires.> This means I can not use bigger than 31" tires on 15" rims without getting> in a jam.> My question for you all are:>> Can anyone tell me what the biggest legal tires on this truck is in your> country/state,> and what tires are stock where you live?> If I can get some documentation from Toyota enywhere in the world or some> technical institute that these tires are legal in some areas,I will get my> approval from the authorities.> No one has ever managed to do this in Norway,but I give it a try anyway.> If anyone can help with this you would not only help me,but every Toyota> truck owner in Norway.>> THE GOOD DEED OF THE DAY I'D SAY>> Please do E-Mail me directly to if you can help.>>> ==========================================================================> ==> Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 07:55:06 -0600 (MDT)
 From: Scott Ellinger  Subject: Re: Use of Taco Coil Over for 1st Gen IFS> Has anyone looked at the possibility of using the coil over shocks from the> Tacoma on the 86-95 IFS?  How about the adjustable coil over shocks from> Downey?>> Ummm - that was not exactly what I had in mind...>> It would be far easier to do a body swap of my Gen1 4Runner> onto a  103" wheebase Taco than to swap the Taco IFS> over to my Gen1 4Runner.>> The Front end geometry is all different and I doubt the frame> rails are anywhere near being in the correct locations to make> the swap easy.>> Even if it were - it would be better (IMHO) to build the> arms and coil over tower than to figure out how to> locate the entire Taco front end onto an older truck.>> Note that the steering for one (rack and pinion versus> recirculating ball) is in a different location.>> Also - the easy way would be to graft the axles as well - but> then theres that "lack of gears" issue to contend with.>> What I meant was the next step (in $$ as well as engineering> sophistication) was to design a coil over setup....> hmm - kinda what Scott is doing.>> The only plus for the Taco swap would be to gain the bigger> engines (assuming I did a body swap as I like the Gen1> 4Runner body style).> I've only been on five minutes, and I'm already seeing references to
 myself on these IFS threaded posts... I think I'll settle down with
 a snack and get going.  :)
 Lessee... Taco front end...
 Why?  For the coilovers?  It'd be cheaper (maybe, depends where you
 get your parts) and easier (IMHO) to fab shock hoops as a race-type
 subframe (superframe?) to mount racing coilovers on the earlier IFS,
 than to swap a whole Taco stub under something else.
 When Toyota introduced the Taco, according to a dealer friend, they
 widened the framerails about 4" to make room for the 3.4 V6; it won't
 physically fit the earlier frames (I looked at swapping one in when I
 was shopping for swap engines) without major work.  So the frames
 won't line up.
 Swapping on adjustable coilovers shouldn't be too hard; as long as
 you're running less front-end travel than I am, Penske makes a nice
 remote-reservoir circle-track coilover aluminum shock that you can
 get into for about $300-350 apiece, with spring.  That's a 9" stroke
 shock, which would be good for about up to 12" of front end travel
 mounted to the stock lower arm, but you'd have to fab upper mounts.
 The axles for the Taco may not fit the earlier trucks; the CV joints
 are probably different, as are the spindles, and the drive is on the
 wrong side as well.
 So, I guess my real answer is a question: Why?  I'd bet that any
 reason for wanting a swap that radical can be better met by swapping
 other stuff less wild onto what you've already got.
 - --scott
 Scott Ellinger   ellinger@holly.colostate.edu   Larimer County 4WD Club
 Visit my Home Page: http://holly.colostate.edu/~ellinger
 '86 Toy pickup body, Ford 5.0, GMC NV4500, "slightly altered" RKSTMPR
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 08:16:33 -0600 (MDT)
 From: Scott Ellinger  Subject: Re: IFS lifts
 I've read and whacked away Ed's thoughts, and have some comments.
 First off, Ed's an engineer.  I'm a college student, studying to be an
 industrail technology manager.  Engineering wouldn't take be because of my
 grades (I spent too much time building my own parts, and not enough in the
 books, so my grades suffered)
 Now, with that out of the way.... :)> Donhaue racing centered the diff. This gets more room for a longer axle.> Obviously other issue arise - how to get the drive shaft to work with a> centered> axle (custom xfer case?) and making the new axle/diff.
 I did this with my 9" front end; the downside is, I had to.  The 9" is so
 huge that it's not much narrower than the Toy 7.5".  With a stock 4-cyl.
 engine, centering the 7.5" would be a huge plus.  Maybe with the Toy V6
 as well, but it wasn't happy with my V8.  Next time... ?>> Torsion bars. These things are long and unweildy. Take take up space (aka> floor of htge interior has to be higher). The next step is to go for a> coil over type suspension. This gets the bars out of the picture.
 Cake.  Probably another month or two, and I'll have it.  Most likely,
 without going through the hood, and I'm going to suspend the upper arm,
 not the lower.  If you can suspend the lower (my current construction
 arrangement makes it a bad idea to do that right now, but I can fix it
 with more money/time) it'd take up even less room, and I might even be
 able to avoid cutting the inner fender.  But that's not important enough
 to me to do it; I prefer to suspend on the upper.>> To gain more room (assuiming you dont want to run the shocks through> the hood), you could go to a pull/push rod suspension.
 Yeah, but then you have to put the shocks/springs in the engine bay, or
 backwards into the passenger compartment.  I looked long and hard at
 this one, and decided it was too unwieldy even for me; to run decent
 travel distances, you pretty much have to run huge pushrod/cantilever
 arm setups, and that defeats the whole purpose.  These systems are
 designed for indycars, where 2" of suspension travel is extreme.  The
 only thing in the world with a negative RTI... :)  (can't even get to
 the ramp with that goofy front wing.... :) )>> The Taco front end is a start. Its a coil over. But I havent take a close> look at it> yet.
 It's a start, but needs work.  I've started going into what's available
 in coilovers on another post; guys (and ladies) keep in mind that if we
 stick to available 4x4 and/or desert race parts, we're excluding a whole
 lot of parts out there that we could be making great use of.  Circle
 trackers run some pretty impressive stuff, as do drag racers, dirt track
 guys, tuff truckers, stadium racers, even a few demo derbiers (well, they
 use mostly what's lying around the back of the wrecking yard, but... :) )>> In any case - at this time we move into race/custom. We're talking about> cutting the front of the frame off at the fire wall and starting all over> with a> blank sheet of paper. Can you say $$$?> Actually, at that point, (which, incidentally, I'm very seriously thinking
 about...) it's nearly the same cost, and easier, to just throw the whole
 frame out (James Stevenson, where are you?) and make your own, to your own
 specs, and find a body to fit later.  Me personally, I'd like to make a
 full size, extended cab, Trophy Truck spec 4x4, but keep it registered as
 a street legal vehicle.  Then take it out on a Friday or Saturday night to
 the drag strip, and... :)  There's gotta be a street stock class down there
 for the crazy kids with the Mach II they've been building since age 11.
 - --scott
 Scott Ellinger   ellinger@holly.colostate.edu   Larimer County 4WD Club
 Visit my Home Page: http://holly.colostate.edu/~ellinger
 '86 Toy pickup body, Ford 5.0, GMC NV4500, "slightly altered" RKSTMPR
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 09:01:25 -0500
 From: Robert Canon  Subject: A/C evaporator drain tube on '98 Taco?
 My A/C has the funk of a 1000 sweat socks, but relief is at hand!  I have a
 "foam kit" ready to apply but have two questions:
 Where is the A/C evaporator drain tube?  Looking at the truck from the
 front, it appears that the compressor is at the lower left of the engine
 bay.  Following lines from the compressor across the front of the truck to
 the right hand side behind the drivers side headlight leads to a cannister
 shaped item with a view window on top.  Is this the evaporator?  There
 appears to be a short, black rubber hose hanging down.  Is this the drain
 tube?
 My second question:
 Where is the air intake for the ventilation system?  I'm thinking between
 the hood and windshield but is there a specific spot that takes in air for
 the A/C?
 Thanks!
 Robert
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 09:21:17 -0500 (CDT)
 From: Brian Wiencek  Subject: Re: 22re turbo> I just wanted to let everyone that was interested know that> I finally got it in my truck.  I hooked everything up and> it is running fine.  I still have to do some minor tuning> and fix an exhast leak but over all I think I'm going to be> very happy with the swap.
 OK, details - is this a 'factory' turbo engine that you're swapping in or
 a custom turbo unit?
 - - Brian
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 08:34:42 -0600 (MDT)
 From: Scott Ellinger  Subject: Re: IFS Sucks!  /  Marlin testing...>> One more IFS fan down the drain.  One more to go.>> Now all we have to do is wait for Scott Ellinger to convert.
 Never!  I will wage my electronic Jihad against straight axles forever!  :)
 (just kidding; I'm looking at building one, but it's unlikely to be a Toy,
 only because I can get American stuff way cheap around here, but even rolled
 Toys are still expensive)>> I don't understand how he keeps CV joints in his truck, he says his ring and> pinion failed after adding the V8 but I have never had a problem the gears, it's> been the CV joints that failed for me. I notice that his CV joint angle is> almost flat, that has to be better on the joint, I hate to loose the clearance> under the front diff, but I can't afford to swap to a solid axle right away.> I do run pretty near zero CV angle at normal ride height.  Negative (inner below
 the outer) is well within my range of travel.  And I've broken a CV when my tie
 rod failed, and folded the outer CV to about 60 degrees.  But I'll bet you
 Birfield guys can't turn that sharp, either!  :)
 Zero CV angle is much better on the joints.  I could actually get probably
 another two to four inches of drop out of my front end, within the limits of the
 joints, but I'm already running out of ball joint angle, and frame clearance, and
 I don't need to push the limits of a suspension that will travel 14" within
 reasonable angles.  Granted, parts that I usually break are relatively cheap, but
 that doesn't mean that I like breaking them.
 I think, when my front diff failed, it was due to the side gears both seeing
 torque, more than they could handle.  The cross pin and spiders failed, stripping
 the teeth off the side gears when they went, and twisting the heck out of the
 carrier.  The ring at that point saw huge loading at the break point, and let
 go of a few teeth, and they chewed the pinion into a paperweight.
 When the rears went, I think it was more carrier deflection (it spun carrier
 bearings pretty quickly, too) that let the pinion misalign with the ring until
 the two chewed each other apart.  The internals (side and spiders) were OK in
 the rears every time, and the carriers didn't show signs of twist.  But the
 ring-gear side bearings were spun.  Every time.
 And that under-diff clearance?  Irrelevant... you oughta see what I do to my skid
 plate.  It's a wierd feeling to be driving on it, but you can get used to it.
 It's actually not all that unlike the feeling of hydroplaning, or that of being
 twisted up on two opposite wheels.  Well, OK, it's not totally irrelevant.  But
 the skidplate is there to be driven on, not just to deflect an errant rock or
 two.  I've done a few dirt-road high-berm landings onto it, too....  Maybe that's
 why my motor mounts are bent.... :)
 And for a little more Scott philosophy...
 I get a kick out of building a wierd vehicle.  In itself, IFS isn't that odd, but
 a built IFS is.  And a rockcrawlable IFS is even odder.  I'm still working on
 that part.  But that's part of why, like I mentioned before, the Chevy is likely
 destined for 6x6-dom.  It'd be relatively cheap, easy, and fun, plus, just imagine
 trying to get something like that stuck.
 - --scott
 Scott Ellinger   ellinger@holly.colostate.edu   Larimer County 4WD Club
 Visit my Home Page: http://holly.colostate.edu/~ellinger
 '86 Toy pickup body, Ford 5.0, GMC NV4500, "slightly altered" RKSTMPR
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 08:43:02 -0600 (MDT)
 From: Scott Ellinger  Subject: Re: IFS lifts and rear springs> What size tires are you running now, Scott?> I'm currently on 35's, but since they only rub a tad at the
 back of the rear wheelwells, I may hop up to 36's when the
 time comes.
 Sorry if my once-upon-a-time wording was confusing; I meant
 it to apply to the suspension (which has been through so many
 iterations that I no longer know how much lift I have, and can
 only guess based on the few prefabricated parts and the CV
 angles, vs. whether it sits nose or tail high)
 - --scott
 Scott Ellinger   ellinger@holly.colostate.edu   Larimer County 4WD Club
 Visit my Home Page: http://holly.colostate.edu/~ellinger
 '86 Toy pickup body, Ford 5.0, GMC NV4500, "slightly altered" RKSTMPR
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 07:53:23 -0700
 From: Gary Trubin  Subject: Re: starting question
 Neil, this appears to be the normal behavior of the new 3.4 v6. I have a
 '97 4Runner with the same v6 and it does the same thing. I was told that
 there was a modification made to the ignition system and that is the side
 effect.
 On 08:48 PM 9/17/98 -0500  Neil McMullen pontificated...>I just got a 1996 Toyota Tacoma 4x4 SR5 V6 today.  The truck is great, with>lots of power and goodies.  The only problem is that it seems to take three>or four cranks of the motor before it starts up (no matter if hot or cold).>The cranking sounds fine (not like the battery is bad - I think).  Any ideas>what might cause this?  Once started it idles and runs great.  I ask,>because my old 92' Toyota with the 22RE started up everytime instantly with>me barely turning the key.>>Any ideas?>Neil>mailto:mcmullen@asde.com>>>>============================================================================>Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota> +--------------------------------------------------------------------+
 | In leu of something eloquent...                                    |
 |        Mentor Graphics is not responsible nor endorses             |
 |        my views and/or opinions.                                   |
 |        All views and opinions are MINE!                            |
 + -----+                                                             |
 | Gary |                                                             |
 +------+-------------------------------------------------------------+
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 09:07:29 -0600 (MDT)
 From: Scott Ellinger  Subject: Re: More IFS ideas (some kooky - kinda long)>> Design a front diff that is centered similar to how Scott & his 9" diff are.>> Instead of flanges you would have  small sprockets on the end of the short>> shafts that come out of the diff.  Here is where you could go 3 ways.>> 1.  These would have double row chains that go down to another sprocket on a>> shaft directly below the diff.  These would have the CV shafts attached to>> them.  You wold have one per side to allow for the differential to work.>> 2.  If you don't care about differentiation, you could have the lower shafts>> be only one shaft across from CV to CV - essentiallyproviding a spool.> Nice idea, but I think Differentiation is a muy mucho desirable option to> have on in the front.....especially if you're thinking about driving at> any speeds higher than rockcrawling.  (I'm biased here.....but who isn't?)> A major front end push would occur w/ all of the slipping of the front> tires as a spool tries to fight against itself while turning.  I dunno> about the chain....too many links to break, but trail reapirs would seem> easier than fixing a busted CV or shaft -- somthing like a fusible link> for the suspension?
 Eeee... I dunno about exposed chains.  Some kind of enclosure would be really
 nice here, and you'd still need to move the diff way up for it to be worth
 while.  And you'd have to keep the skid plate low to protect the CV's anyway.
 I think a better solution would be Hummer portal spindles, with a reduction
 gear and high axles built in already.  Just have to get some 2.35:1 axles...
 those Hummers run about a 2:1 portal gear.  CTIS would become an option, too.>>  If we're gonna really do some major cutting, why not just do the engine> setback thing and then you could push the front diff up a bit higher?  It> would decrease the angles in the front driveshaft, allow you to make real> long a-arms that would mount more to the middle of the frame (since there> is no pesky motor to get in the way), and the axleshafts could be a bit> longer -- allowing lesser angles on the CV's.  Weight distribution would> be greatly improved (for those who regularly sky their truck), and you'd> be able to tune your carb from te comfort of your driver's seat since the> engine setback would shove the motor back about a foot.  Kinda brings back> memories of driving around an Econoline w/o the "doghouse"!>> Granted, the shifter would now have to be more complicated, and it would> be hard to mount the stereo w/o any dash, but you wouldn't need a snorkel> anymore since the intake would be right in the cab!> Okay, here's where I come in...
 I've been saying for some time now, the trick is to start with an extended
 cab truck.
 Put the engine in the bed, with the flywheel about even with the back wall
 of the cab.  Backwards.  Transmission pointing forward.  Since you've only
 gotta clear the bellhousing and tranny/transfer, you don't have to cut far
 past where the tranny tunnel is anyway, and there's aftermarket floor
 panels for drag cars that'd probably fit that really well.  Plus, you now
 can use a hard tonneu cover as a hood, put the tools under the hood up
 front, have killer weight distribution, and still a fair amount of room in
 the bed (an engine will fit under a prerunner-style spare tire, no prob.)
 But now you have to center the front diff to keep the driveshaft angles
 good.  Darn.... so disappointing... :)
 As for the rear, you'll have such a long rear shaft that you can do a two
 piece, bolt a carrier bearing under the oil pan, and just leave the thing
 centered.
 Downsides: The driveshafts spin the wrong way.
 You'll have to move the gas tank.
 The shift linkage will be goofy; just use an automatic with a cable.  Or
 I could make a manual-shift reversing linkage rod, but it'd be odd.  Or
 just learn to drive it backwards, but the shifter would be between the
 seatbacks... nah... too uncomfortable.
 The exhaust will have to be custom, but if you do a Chevy 350 swap, you
 can just put the manifolds/headers on backwards, and you're OK.  Same for
 a Ford, but I don't think it'll work with anything less than a smallblock
 V8.  It's not too hard to hook the exhaust around, through.
 Could be tough to cram cats/mufflers/tailpipe into that little room from
 the middle of the bed to the tailgate, but it can be done.  Maybe put the
 exhaust on forwards, and hook it around for two more feet of tailpipe.
 Back to the gas tank, there's plenty of room behind the engine.
 Leave the radiator up front, with an (several?) electric fans, maybe even
 move it back into the engine bay a bit to better protect it in case of a
 crash.  Or use an even bigger one.
 As for those driveshafts, you're gonna call me crazy, but flip the diffs.
 Both of 'em.  Now everything is back to spinning the right way, but the
 pinions are higher (better angle) and not getting oiled very well.  Just
 change the oil fill point, and maybe add an expansion tank for each diff,
 so that they can blow off a little oil from time to time.
 Okay, enough of my lunatic ravings... And no, I haven't had anything
 stronger than a margarita or two in years; I'm always this way.
 - --scott
 Scott Ellinger   ellinger@holly.colostate.edu   Larimer County 4WD Club
 Visit my Home Page: http://holly.colostate.edu/~ellinger
 '86 Toy pickup body, Ford 5.0, GMC NV4500, "slightly altered" RKSTMPR
 ============================================================================
 Toyota 4x4 page: http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyota
 ------------------------------
 End of Toyota 4x4 digest: V2 #91
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